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Wasn't this on Deja News that Google bought and integrated into Google groups? How is this archive different?

by __tg__ 6y ago

IvyMike 6y ago
It doesn't feel like google has been a good steward of these archives. They blended usenet archives and google groups together in a really annoying way, content has erratically gone missing (see the lwn link that hprotagonist posted), and have seemingly lost interest overall--the whole google groups product has seemed neglected for years. My guess is the only reason it hasn't been sun-setted is that someone high up needs to remember it to kill it.
- toast0 6y ago
  Yahoo is taking the final steps to kill its groups product in a couple months. Google is usually 2-5 years behind Yahoo, so expect Google Groups to die before the end of 2025.
lkbm 6y ago
There have been reports that some of those posts have been vanishing from Google Groups[0]. It's nice that this person/org is hosting these, but I'd feel more comfortable if archive.org (and perhaps another org or two) mirrored them as well. History shouldn't be dependent on some random person/org paying to host them. I thought things would be safe with Google and I was wrong. I'm definitely less confident that usenetarchives.com will be around forever. [0] https://lwn.net/Articles/827233/ https://lwn.net/Articles/827233/
hlandau 6y ago
It really seems to me that archive.org, or some similar organisation, should petition Google to donate their Usenet archive, which they clearly don't care about, to them. Or possibly buy it off them. It's a long shot since it would require Google to actually do something with a dataset they clearly don't care about, but they could get some good corporate PR points almost for free.
- Aeolun 6y ago
  Assuming they haven’t long ago given up on any kind of corporate PR points.
- ksherlock 6y ago
  archive.org has various usenet archives. Some of the data is there, it's just not conveniently organized or searchable or viewable. eg: https://archive.org/details/usenet https://archive.org/details/usenet
  - Jaruzel 6y ago
    Surely someone has had a go at bringing it all back online somewhere? If not, I might have a bash at it.
- atdt 6y ago
  I suspect there may be significant overlap between the DejaNews archive and https://archive.org/details/usenethistorical https://archive.org/details/usenethistorical
  - bensw 6y ago
    You'd be correct, although "significant" is not a strong enough word
- tpmx 6y ago
  I agree. However, the IA team hasn't really excelled in showcasing their awesome collections. The UX isn't great, the performance of the wayback machine is objectively bad, etc.

Wasn't this on Deja News that Google bought and integrated into Google groups? How is this archive different?

by __tg__ 6y ago

Wasn't this on Deja News that Google bought and integrated into Google groups? How is this archive different?

It doesn't feel like google has been a good steward of these archives. They blended usenet archives and google groups together in a really annoying way, content has erratically gone missing (see the lwn link that hprotagonist posted), and have seemingly lost interest overall--the whole google groups product has seemed neglected for years. My guess is the only reason it hasn't been sun-setted is that someone high up needs to remember it to kill it.

toast0 6y ago
Yahoo is taking the final steps to kill its groups product in a couple months. Google is usually 2-5 years behind Yahoo, so expect Google Groups to die before the end of 2025.

lkbm 6y ago

There have been reports that some of those posts have been vanishing from Google Groups[0]. It's nice that this person/org is hosting these, but I'd feel more comfortable if archive.org (and perhaps another org or two) mirrored them as well. History shouldn't be dependent on some random person/org paying to host them. I thought things would be safe with Google and I was wrong. I'm definitely less confident that usenetarchives.com will be around forever. [0] https://lwn.net/Articles/827233/ https://lwn.net/Articles/827233/

hlandau 6y ago

It really seems to me that archive.org, or some similar organisation, should petition Google to donate their Usenet archive, which they clearly don't care about, to them. Or possibly buy it off them. It's a long shot since it would require Google to actually do something with a dataset they clearly don't care about, but they could get some good corporate PR points almost for free.

Aeolun 6y ago
Assuming they haven’t long ago given up on any kind of corporate PR points.
ksherlock 6y ago
archive.org has various usenet archives. Some of the data is there, it's just not conveniently organized or searchable or viewable. eg: https://archive.org/details/usenet https://archive.org/details/usenet
- Jaruzel 6y ago
  Surely someone has had a go at bringing it all back online somewhere? If not, I might have a bash at it.
atdt 6y ago
I suspect there may be significant overlap between the DejaNews archive and https://archive.org/details/usenethistorical https://archive.org/details/usenethistorical
- bensw 6y ago
  You'd be correct, although "significant" is not a strong enough word
tpmx 6y ago
I agree. However, the IA team hasn't really excelled in showcasing their awesome collections. The UX isn't great, the performance of the wayback machine is objectively bad, etc.