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> they just want to be able to afford insulin to keep themselves alive like they’d be able to in other countries. It's a silly argument to compare countries on

> they just want to be able to afford insulin to keep themselves alive like they’d be able to in other countries. It's a silly argument to compare countries on a single issue though. Insulin is probably cheaper in Germany (I have no clue since I've never bought any), but our taxes are much higher as well. For somebody who has no money to buy insulin, that doesn't matter much, as they wouldn't pay any taxes. For most people however, that means something, as it would cut deeply into their budget. All of these things are trade-offs, you can't view them isolated and expect to gain any insights.

chrisseaton 6y ago
> It's a silly argument to compare countries on a single issue though. If you can't afford to buy drugs you need to keep yourself alive, what other issues matter for you?
mikepurvis 6y ago
> ... but our taxes are much higher as well. Not sure who the "our" is in your comment, but: "So there you have it, if you are wealthy and live in California you are paying more income tax than people who live in the European Unions’ largest economy. Of course this is only one facet of the tax system. There are many others, like the value added tax of 19% in Germany, but Germany’s corporate tax rate is 15% while ours in 35%. If you live in California and are paying these high rates you can’t even take solace in the fact that you’re working less. In Germany the average work week is 35 hours with 24 paid vacation days and 10 paid holidays!" http://bvcocpas.com/how-the-united-states-tax-rates-compares-to-germany/ http://bvcocpas.com/how-the-united-states-tax-rates-compares...
- luckylion 6y ago
  While the numbers are from a decade or two ago: yes, I'm pretty sure the top 10% in the US pay more taxes than the average person in Germany. But that's really not a large factor for most people because they're by definition not in the top percentage of the country.
- mrep 6y ago
  That quote is about a person with a million dollars in wages in the highest income tax state and it doesn't factor in payroll taxes which contribute to the tax wedge on income. The tax wedge for a single worker with no children earning the nations average wage in 2019 was 49.4% for germany and 29.8% for the united states [0]. That's not to say government provided healthcare is incompatible with lower taxes as there are other countries around the US tax wedge rate with government healthcare but germany is not a good example of that especially for the average person. [0]: https://taxfoundation.org/publications/comparison-tax-burden-labor-oecd/ https://taxfoundation.org/publications/comparison-tax-burden...
Daishiman 6y ago
> Insulin is probably cheaper in Germany (I have no clue since I've never bought any) Yeah maybe you shouldn't be making opinions out of pure ignorance of the situation at the factual and emotional level.
hinkley 6y ago
Drilling down, there's a PDF: https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-1.html https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-1.html Looks like for human insulin Germany is 1/12th the cost. There's a lot of pricing theater going on in the US too. The MSRP seems to be a game of psychological anchoring the manufactures are playing with the insurance companies, who always get a discount. But that is a whole other kettle of fish. "First, the manufacturer prices available in the MIDAS data do not reflect rebates or other discounts that might have been applied after drugs left the factory; we expect that, in many countries (and particularly in the United States), the net price paid for drugs was lower than the reported manufacturer prices shown in our results tables."
Dahoon 6y ago
It's a silly argument to compare countries on a single issue though. Taxes might be higher in nordic countries but so are the pay, the lowest allowed wages, the money everyone who is out of a job gets, etc.

chrisseaton 6y ago

> It's a silly argument to compare countries on a single issue though. If you can't afford to buy drugs you need to keep yourself alive, what other issues matter for you?

mikepurvis 6y ago

> ... but our taxes are much higher as well. Not sure who the "our" is in your comment, but: "So there you have it, if you are wealthy and live in California you are paying more income tax than people who live in the European Unions’ largest economy. Of course this is only one facet of the tax system. There are many others, like the value added tax of 19% in Germany, but Germany’s corporate tax rate is 15% while ours in 35%. If you live in California and are paying these high rates you can’t even take solace in the fact that you’re working less. In Germany the average work week is 35 hours with 24 paid vacation days and 10 paid holidays!" http://bvcocpas.com/how-the-united-states-tax-rates-compares-to-germany/ http://bvcocpas.com/how-the-united-states-tax-rates-compares...

luckylion 6y ago
While the numbers are from a decade or two ago: yes, I'm pretty sure the top 10% in the US pay more taxes than the average person in Germany. But that's really not a large factor for most people because they're by definition not in the top percentage of the country.
mrep 6y ago
That quote is about a person with a million dollars in wages in the highest income tax state and it doesn't factor in payroll taxes which contribute to the tax wedge on income. The tax wedge for a single worker with no children earning the nations average wage in 2019 was 49.4% for germany and 29.8% for the united states [0]. That's not to say government provided healthcare is incompatible with lower taxes as there are other countries around the US tax wedge rate with government healthcare but germany is not a good example of that especially for the average person. [0]: https://taxfoundation.org/publications/comparison-tax-burden-labor-oecd/ https://taxfoundation.org/publications/comparison-tax-burden...

Daishiman 6y ago

> Insulin is probably cheaper in Germany (I have no clue since I've never bought any) Yeah maybe you shouldn't be making opinions out of pure ignorance of the situation at the factual and emotional level.

hinkley 6y ago

Drilling down, there's a PDF: https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-1.html https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-1.html Looks like for human insulin Germany is 1/12th the cost. There's a lot of pricing theater going on in the US too. The MSRP seems to be a game of psychological anchoring the manufactures are playing with the insurance companies, who always get a discount. But that is a whole other kettle of fish. "First, the manufacturer prices available in the MIDAS data do not reflect rebates or other discounts that might have been applied after drugs left the factory; we expect that, in many countries (and particularly in the United States), the net price paid for drugs was lower than the reported manufacturer prices shown in our results tables."

Dahoon 6y ago

It's a silly argument to compare countries on a single issue though. Taxes might be higher in nordic countries but so are the pay, the lowest allowed wages, the money everyone who is out of a job gets, etc.