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Maybe we should separate the evolution of languages from the evolution of package/versioning systems. They do tend to go hand in hand, but that has more to do w

Maybe we should separate the evolution of languages from the evolution of package/versioning systems. They do tend to go hand in hand, but that has more to do with logistics and organizational issues than any technical necessity.

disgruntledphd2 6y ago
But like R has a great packaing system, and it copied Perl, which is much older than Python. Meanwhile Python has a bunch of incompatible packaging systems which cause so much pain to so many programmers. Did you know that pip won't even resolve dependencies, and will break your programs silently? I certainly didn't, because Python wasn't my first language and therefore I assumed that the package manager will handle dependencies. Like seriously, when a language designed by statisticians for statisticians (R) has a better packaging story than everyone's second favourite language, something has gone horribly wrong.
- notacoward 6y ago
  > R has a great packaing system, and it copied Perl I almost used Perl as an example of Python's inverse - a crappy language wrapped in a good packaging system. For its time CPAN was pretty great. All of the things today that people are likely to hold up as being better drew inspiration from it. > which is much older than Python Perl 1987, Python 1989. So yes it's older, but much older?
  - disgruntledphd2 6y ago
    Fair, I realised that the difference wasn't that large after I posted. I'm just so annoyed by Python's (lack of a) packaging system that it makes me prone to hyperbole. It's been frustrating me at work all week, and I suspect that it will be a low-grade annoyance for me in my career for the next few years, as I'm a Data Scientist and hence need to deal with Python a lot.
    - int_19h 6y ago
      pip is a packaging system, and it ships out of the box with Python. It may not be the best one around, but there certainly isn't a lack of one.
      - disgruntledphd2 6y ago
        Does it ensure that packages in the environment are consistent with one another? If not, I'm not sure what it does that curl won't do.
        int_19h 6y ago
        curl won't resolve dependencies.

disgruntledphd2 6y ago

But like R has a great packaing system, and it copied Perl, which is much older than Python. Meanwhile Python has a bunch of incompatible packaging systems which cause so much pain to so many programmers. Did you know that pip won't even resolve dependencies, and will break your programs silently? I certainly didn't, because Python wasn't my first language and therefore I assumed that the package manager will handle dependencies. Like seriously, when a language designed by statisticians for statisticians (R) has a better packaging story than everyone's second favourite language, something has gone horribly wrong.

notacoward 6y ago
> R has a great packaing system, and it copied Perl I almost used Perl as an example of Python's inverse - a crappy language wrapped in a good packaging system. For its time CPAN was pretty great. All of the things today that people are likely to hold up as being better drew inspiration from it. > which is much older than Python Perl 1987, Python 1989. So yes it's older, but much older?
- disgruntledphd2 6y ago
  Fair, I realised that the difference wasn't that large after I posted. I'm just so annoyed by Python's (lack of a) packaging system that it makes me prone to hyperbole. It's been frustrating me at work all week, and I suspect that it will be a low-grade annoyance for me in my career for the next few years, as I'm a Data Scientist and hence need to deal with Python a lot.
  - int_19h 6y ago
    pip is a packaging system, and it ships out of the box with Python. It may not be the best one around, but there certainly isn't a lack of one.
    - disgruntledphd2 6y ago
      Does it ensure that packages in the environment are consistent with one another? If not, I'm not sure what it does that curl won't do.
      - int_19h 6y ago
        curl won't resolve dependencies.