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You can sideload apps on android - im far less sympathetic to Epic here compared to their case against Apple. I remember looking into seeing what fortnight look

You can sideload apps on android - im far less sympathetic to Epic here compared to their case against Apple. I remember looking into seeing what fortnight looked like on mobile a while back and for Android I dont recall there even being an option to get it through the play store - it had to be sideloaded - and that worked fine. They're standing on thin ice going against android (especially considering the entire country if China uses phones that essentially don't use Google services at all but still run android - Google does not have the same sort of control over android that Apple does over ios).

Fej 6y ago
Epic did for a time only distribute their game through their launcher, available only as an APK from their website, but they eventually capitulated to Google's policies and listed Fortnite on the Play Store. They did this because it is evidently not realistically possible for a commercial app to be distributed outside of the Play Store and reach a critical mass of the Android userbase, whatever the cause(s) may be. Google has made the process of installing alternative app stores obtuse enough that general consumers might not do it. It's not that obtuse, especially to readers of this site, but it looks as though it's enough. There's also the restriction that app installs and updates cannot be done in the background. Another possibility, or perhaps in addition to the above, is that the general public never goes outside of default app stores to search for games, or is never persuaded to do so. It's the path of least resistance to only use the one(s) included with the phone. Fortnite is the one attempt at a massive enough scale that could have broken this pattern, but it didn't, even though they had Fortnite on all the other platforms to use as an ad, which targets exactly the people most likely to jump through the hoops.
- shirakawasuna 6y ago
  Sideloading is definitely a pain in that the Google Play Store is given privileges so long as you don't have root (the vast majority of people don't). For example, while the Google Play Store can automatically update 10 apps at a time, other stores (such as F-Droid) require you to manually approve and update every single one, waiting for the installation to complete.
- fireattack 6y ago
  >Google has made the process of installing alternative app stores obtuse enough I do agree an average user would feel the warning intimidating, but I don't think it's obtuse (or do you mean obscure?) at all. If anything, it's pretty explicit. If you try to install apk from say, your browser (the most likely scenario for Fortnite), the system would ask you to give it the privilege to install "unknown/unsafe app" or whatever it's called. And you only need to change this setting once. Later you can just directly install any APK from this app (browser).
  - ThatPlayer 6y ago
    I think the bigger issue is 3rd party apps installed this way do not get any permissions to auto update (either itself or other apps). This makes it near impossible to make an app store that competes with any system app store as you do not get 1 click installing or updating. Or for the app to even update itself. So a user who has 10 updates on a different app store would have to click through 10 install prompts just to update.
    - morsch 6y ago
      That is a big issue and I wish we could force Google (and Apple for that matter) to change it. For the longest time, I thought the Fdroid people didn't want this feature, turns out they can't do it on vanilla Android.
      - ThatPlayer 6y ago
        Yep. If you have a rooted Android phone, Fdroid does have a separate package you can install for that feature https://f-droid.org/en/packages/org.fdroid.fdroid.privileged/ https://f-droid.org/en/packages/org.fdroid.fdroid.privileged...
  - sullyj3 6y ago
    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/obtuse https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/obtuse 2.b: "difficult to comprehend : not clear or precise in thought or expression". I think that makes sense.
- amitheonlyone 6y ago
  I believe that the warnings you get when trying to install an APK downloaded using the browser is necessary. Especially with older people, it is much like a firewall and will prevent them from installing malware or 'spammy' apps.
- watwut 6y ago
  > They did this because it is evidently not realistically possible for a commercial app to be distributed outside of the Play Store and reach a critical mass of the Android userbase, They won't reach critical mass on Android, cause the game runs on very few phones.
redxdev 6y ago
From what I can tell Epic has two (three, depending on how you count) main arguments against Google. The first is what you mentioned - that they _do_ have the option of sideloading an app like Fortnite. The problem being that they lose out on a massive market because they don't want to use Google's IAPs. This is made worse by the fact that Android gives "scary" warnings when trying to install an app from an untrusted source - which is arguably a good thing for safety/security, but at the same time questionable when Google also benefits from it. The other issue is that Google actively makes it harder for an alternative storefront to operate on Android by forcing OEMs to only include the Play Store (though I think OEM's own stores might also be acceptable? not sure) if they want Google Play Services (which most apps require). Which means Epic can't go out and make a deal with an OEM to add the Epic Store (or possibly even just a single app like Fortnite that doesn't use Google's IAPs, not sure) to an Android device because said OEM would have to drop Google Play Services. And they can't just tell you to download the store - there are limitations that you cannot bypass without being a system app (i.e. something preinstalled). The most notable one for a store being that it can't auto-update other applications.
- watwut 6y ago
  People are overdoing the scary message on Android point. It is warning of the kind people routinely ignore.

Fej 6y ago

Epic did for a time only distribute their game through their launcher, available only as an APK from their website, but they eventually capitulated to Google's policies and listed Fortnite on the Play Store. They did this because it is evidently not realistically possible for a commercial app to be distributed outside of the Play Store and reach a critical mass of the Android userbase, whatever the cause(s) may be. Google has made the process of installing alternative app stores obtuse enough that general consumers might not do it. It's not that obtuse, especially to readers of this site, but it looks as though it's enough. There's also the restriction that app installs and updates cannot be done in the background. Another possibility, or perhaps in addition to the above, is that the general public never goes outside of default app stores to search for games, or is never persuaded to do so. It's the path of least resistance to only use the one(s) included with the phone. Fortnite is the one attempt at a massive enough scale that could have broken this pattern, but it didn't, even though they had Fortnite on all the other platforms to use as an ad, which targets exactly the people most likely to jump through the hoops.

shirakawasuna 6y ago
Sideloading is definitely a pain in that the Google Play Store is given privileges so long as you don't have root (the vast majority of people don't). For example, while the Google Play Store can automatically update 10 apps at a time, other stores (such as F-Droid) require you to manually approve and update every single one, waiting for the installation to complete.
fireattack 6y ago
>Google has made the process of installing alternative app stores obtuse enough I do agree an average user would feel the warning intimidating, but I don't think it's obtuse (or do you mean obscure?) at all. If anything, it's pretty explicit. If you try to install apk from say, your browser (the most likely scenario for Fortnite), the system would ask you to give it the privilege to install "unknown/unsafe app" or whatever it's called. And you only need to change this setting once. Later you can just directly install any APK from this app (browser).
- ThatPlayer 6y ago
  I think the bigger issue is 3rd party apps installed this way do not get any permissions to auto update (either itself or other apps). This makes it near impossible to make an app store that competes with any system app store as you do not get 1 click installing or updating. Or for the app to even update itself. So a user who has 10 updates on a different app store would have to click through 10 install prompts just to update.
  - morsch 6y ago
    That is a big issue and I wish we could force Google (and Apple for that matter) to change it. For the longest time, I thought the Fdroid people didn't want this feature, turns out they can't do it on vanilla Android.
    - ThatPlayer 6y ago
      Yep. If you have a rooted Android phone, Fdroid does have a separate package you can install for that feature https://f-droid.org/en/packages/org.fdroid.fdroid.privileged/ https://f-droid.org/en/packages/org.fdroid.fdroid.privileged...
- sullyj3 6y ago
  https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/obtuse https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/obtuse 2.b: "difficult to comprehend : not clear or precise in thought or expression". I think that makes sense.
amitheonlyone 6y ago
I believe that the warnings you get when trying to install an APK downloaded using the browser is necessary. Especially with older people, it is much like a firewall and will prevent them from installing malware or 'spammy' apps.
watwut 6y ago
> They did this because it is evidently not realistically possible for a commercial app to be distributed outside of the Play Store and reach a critical mass of the Android userbase, They won't reach critical mass on Android, cause the game runs on very few phones.

redxdev 6y ago

From what I can tell Epic has two (three, depending on how you count) main arguments against Google. The first is what you mentioned - that they _do_ have the option of sideloading an app like Fortnite. The problem being that they lose out on a massive market because they don't want to use Google's IAPs. This is made worse by the fact that Android gives "scary" warnings when trying to install an app from an untrusted source - which is arguably a good thing for safety/security, but at the same time questionable when Google also benefits from it. The other issue is that Google actively makes it harder for an alternative storefront to operate on Android by forcing OEMs to only include the Play Store (though I think OEM's own stores might also be acceptable? not sure) if they want Google Play Services (which most apps require). Which means Epic can't go out and make a deal with an OEM to add the Epic Store (or possibly even just a single app like Fortnite that doesn't use Google's IAPs, not sure) to an Android device because said OEM would have to drop Google Play Services. And they can't just tell you to download the store - there are limitations that you cannot bypass without being a system app (i.e. something preinstalled). The most notable one for a store being that it can't auto-update other applications.

watwut 6y ago
People are overdoing the scary message on Android point. It is warning of the kind people routinely ignore.