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The fact that Apple uses this chip to, among other things, block "unauthorized repair" (can't change a freaking SSD in 2020, really), makes me very happy that p
by aneutron 6y ago
The fact that Apple uses this chip to, among other things, block "unauthorized repair" (can't change a freaking SSD in 2020, really), makes me very happy that people are finding ways to break this chip to make repairs more accessible.
On the other hand, this could have serious implications on the iOS security model for example.
And I'm pretty sure someone is gonna run Doom on the touchbar in some months.
- draugadrotten 6y agoDoom on touchbar (2016) https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2016/11/21/13697058/macbook-touchbar-doom-hack-sure-why-not https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2016/11/21/13697058/... https://twitter.com/b3ll/status/800472338496036864?s=20 https://twitter.com/b3ll/status/800472338496036864?s=20
- quenix 6y agoThat's running purely in usermode, and nothing was broken in this demonstration, the touch bar is being used "as intended"
- aneutron 6y agoExactly. This would "in theory" allow Doom to be running outside of the "prescribed parameters".
- sgt 6y agoSo the monsters would actually leave the touchbar. This sounds really risky, folks
- GekkePrutser 6y agoOnly if you feed them after midnight!
- DaiPlusPlus 6y ago[Real-life Nasal Demons](http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/N/nasal-demons.html http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/N/nasal-demons.html)... perish the thought!
- nitrogen 6y agoJust don't shoot the cacodemon labeled "init (1)" and you should be fine.
- stjohnswarts 6y agocan we run text mode doom over ssh mayhaps?
- djxfade 6y agoBack in the days, we had bootsector games. In the future we will have TouchBar games running before even the OS boots.
- javajosh 6y agoA legit application would be a rather awesome (and secure) way to generate a new private key with human generated randomness. Or perhaps a puzzle that you have to solve before your computer boots? The possibilities are endless!
- rock_artist 6y agoor at least get the macOS loading gauge to the touchbar ;)
- kristofferR 6y agoTrue, but to be fair, the same mechanism also blocks thieves from using and/or selling stolen Macs.
- aneutron 6y agoFair enough, but the problem is mainly when you are in a third world country and parts are very difficult to get, and where Mac stores are non-existent.
- littlecranky67 6y agoPeople in third world countries buy Macbooks - really? A decent macbook is several times above an average monthly income in a first-world country already...
- ThatsWhatImSayn 6y agoWhat else are they going to spend our trillions of tax dollars on? Not much we can do, UN votes are expensive.
- bArray 6y agoSecond hand devices they may, although I'm not sure how many people are shipping Apple products out of the Country given the large scam risk.
- withinboredom 6y agoOh, prepare to be mind-blown. Let me tell you how it works. Someone goes to the US (such as a direct flight to NY or ATL), they hop off the plane, load a backpack full of laptops, then fly back and resell them without paying import taxes or VAT. It works even better if the person flying is flying for work and someone else buys the ticket. It's not scalable, but works pretty good when a group of friends purchases them. Cost of MBP in the US: $2,799 (€2,390) Cost of MBP in NL: €3,199 ($3,746) Cost of plane ticket from NL to US: (pre-covid) ~€600
- ksec 6y ago>The fact that Apple uses this chip to, among other things, block "unauthorized repair" I actually dont mind they block unauthorised repair, at least I believe in the Steve Jobs's Apple era he wanted the best customer experience. And they want the Data of what is failing in their Mac where their Genius Bar gain first hand experience and knowledge which leads to feedback to the Design team. ( They dont publicly announce or admit it, but the database has those problem listed. ) The goal was to aim for perfection, a machine that is so reliable it wouldn't need to repair in the first place. And if and when they fail, Genius Bar is there to help. You used to get some nice gesture from Apple Retail. Now they are simply trying gouge customers into buying a new MacBook, hopefully with AppleCare+, or replacement for the logic board. Every single problem they will just quote you to replace the logic board price. Not only are they expensive, the actual work or replacement isn't even up to Apple's standard. I will need time to dig up some data. But MacBook Pro 2016+'s resale price has dropped quite significantly compared to MBP 2015 in the same age. And MBP 2015 second hand market is actually going strong.
- aneutron 6y ago> The goal was to aim for perfection, a machine that is so reliable it wouldn't need to repair in the first place. You will have to excuse me, but that is a load of bullcrap. Let's take the case that irritates me the most: The SSD. By definition of the technology that is NAND storage, an SSD will be able to operate "within norm" and without bit errors for so long. Rewrite for long enough and you'll see your data waving you good-bye. As for your other claims about recording errors and whatnot, you can EASILY achieve those (matter of fact it's already implemented in UEFI by some manufacturers), and NOT disallow people from repairing their computer. Sure the lifespan of an SSD is ideally 5/7 years. But that is a death sentence, not a search for perfection. Also, what happens if Apple simply refuses to fix your computer, or supply your with parts ! And yes this has happened rather publicly (Linus Sebastian's Mac Pro) So again, apologies for the language but that is a load of bullcrap
- rimliu 6y agoWho is Linus Sebastian, why should I care about him, and why I should consider his case typical?
- yholio 6y agoSorry, but the only rational consumer response to a device that actively works against you is not to purchase it, not hack it. Once millions of people pay to be imprisoned on their own devices, the long game is lost no matter how good the hackers are, the firm has the upper hand and the resources to prevail in the long run. And I am perfectly happy to assert this as a political preference, and vote in office people that vow to protect consumers from this kind of racketeering. I understand this might not be your cup of tea, and that some people prefer unfettered capitalism, its your political right. However I fell that allowing this in our society limits my freedom and choices, because the things you buy affect me too.
- fastball 6y agoMany people buy iPhones / Macs because of the (intended) security provided by things like the T2 chip.
- yholio 6y agoSuch people would have no issue if they were to be provided with a 20 character secret code that allows rooting and fine grained security control. They would simply not enter it and rely on Apple's decisions for them. This pretty much kills the whole "intended" security line, the intent is user control.
- fastball 6y agoThat's definitely a fair point! Though I think this could probably open you up to some MITM style attacks where someone intercepts a Macbook in transit and steals the root key that comes with it or something. Maybe not though, I guess it really depends on how you accomplish this. But on the surface it does seem like that could work.
- coldtea 6y ago>This pretty much kills the whole "intended" security line Only if the "20 character secret code" had the same security characteristics, which it doesn't.
- Svoka 6y agoFor me it was conscious choice: Security ≫ Repairability. I don't mind getting a new MacBook, but I do mind if it gets compromised. This way I know it would be a screen replacement at best.
- tonyedgecombe 6y agoI’ve always thought the repairability thing is overblown, mostly I want reliability.
- varispeed 6y agoLack of repairability is sort of akin to security by obscurity. This is flawed thinking and motivated by Apple's greed.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]