16 ms·
Default window manager switched to CTWM in NetBSD-current
- otabdeveloper4 6y ago> XEyes Ah yes, the most important app. Definitely deserves a top 5 spot in the menu!
- oblio 6y agoThat's what you get when the people configuring the thing are people who will never use it :-). (in this case the right click menu)
- messe 6y agoThe only use I've ever had for XEyes is, ironically, under Wayland. I use it to see quickly which apps are running natively as Wayland apps, and which are using XWayland. The eyes don't follow the mouse when you hover over a native Wayland app, but they do for XWayland apps.
- hibbelig 6y agoThere is a configuration option for Sway that will put information into the title bar to tell you if the window is XWayland or pure Wayland. But I forgot the exact option. It was mentioned in the Sway documentation.
- messe 6y agoIt's actually been a while since I've used Wayland, but that's good to know. My current mix of OSes is OpenBSD (cwm on X11) for coding, iPadOS for casual consumption and note-taking, FreeBSD on a home server, macOS for work, and Windows/Nintendo Switch for gaming.
- chungus_khan 6y agoI figured out a similar sort of thing using xprop actually, but that's way funnier.
- trasz 6y ago> For more than 20 years, NetBSD has shipped X11 with the "classic" default window manager of twm. However, it's been showing its age for a long time now. It's been showing its age 20 years ago too.
- non-entity 6y agoI switched a couple *nix machines I had to ctwm a while back. Its a neat manager if you want to go for a "retro" twm look but want a few more features Config is mostly like twm but more options.
- IgorPartola 6y agoI remember bacon in 2005 or so running openbox/black box/etc. on a $1400 laptop to make sure I squeezed all the performance out of it. Ironically, over the years my requirements for a graphical UI to do things on my laptop have actually diminished (my file management is now mostly done via the command line, etc. while my care for keeping my window manager to less than 300KB of memory has completely gone away.
- rawoke083600 6y ago>"...bacon in..." Typing this on an iPhone or Mac ? :)
- chungus_khan 6y agoIt would always annoy me how I had such a beautiful, slim, and minimalist graphical UNIX system set up, but then some program would come in and load several megabytes of images it wasn't actually displaying into the X server. Megabytes matter a little less on my current 32go machine than when I had 32mo.
- regularfry 6y agoWho's using NetBSD as a daily driver, then? What's the experience like?
- rjsw 6y agoI do, using it to type this. It runs almost everything that I would want to use, the only extra application that I need is a customized version of the Eclipse IDE.
- hestefisk 6y agoI’s be interested in hearing more.
- znpy 6y agoI remember trying that back in 2008 or so. Awesome system, but the lack of hardware support really hurt back at the time. I particularly liked the fact that OS-provided packages and user-istalled packages were two distinct and separate things, thanks to the pkgsrc black magic. It allowed for things like upgrading the underlying OS without touching the programs installed and vice versa. I tried creating a similar frankenstein system by using pkgsrc on a mostly base install of Slackware but I didn't go very far (tbh, I was quite junior at the time). It looked like a neat idea at the time though.
- jayp1418 6y agoI use it daily with Mate DE and sometimes switching to Xfce4. Have them both installed :)
- regularfry 6y agoOn what hardware?
- jayp1418 6y agohttp://bsd-hardware.info/index.php?probe=99cf14c489 http://bsd-hardware.info/index.php?probe=99cf14c489
- 6y ago
- ggm 6y agoTvtwm worked fine for me. Thinkpad x30, grid of 4x3 panes of visible state with screen size jumps between positioning. Ctwm looks suitably small. Had I gone back, I do think tiling is where I would go. My last work purchased device is an osx. What comes next isn't clear yet, 3 years to go.
- rawoke083600 6y agoI recently switched my daily workflow(coding, writing etc) to a "keyboard driven methodology" as much as possible ! So far (about 3 months) it's been going great. I'm running an ASUS ZenBook with Ubuntu 20.04 and: -i3 (Seems everyone starts here for tiling managers) -lightdm( weird issues with the default GDM3 and dual screens) -Switched from "Dual Monitors" (laptop + 27") to one monitor, the 27", my laptop lid/display is closed. This was interesting to me, since now that I make better use of workspace and their shortcuts, I don't need more physical-real-estate. Especially with my neck issue. Can't turn my head too much right (car accident), I call it my Zoolander-Thang. -Employed "workspaces" (virtual desktops ?) as follows: --ws1 (Terminals) --ws2 (Browser) --ws3 (Comms) Skype,Gmail,WhatsApp --ws4 (Code) VSCode --ws6 (Files) Still in GUI land here... should look spend more time with something like nnn or ranger. --ws7 (Gimp) --ws8 (Geany) Scratchpad and misc. editor stuff -Learnt most of the 'useful' keyboard shortcuts for the commonly used programs. VSCode, i3, Gimp Less mouse, more KB :)
- throwaway8941 6y agoDon't forget a keyboard-driven navigation plugin for your browser, like vimium. I have a desktop PC and use my mouse maybe once or twice a day, mostly for JS-heavy crap (which also probably presents enormous problems for the blind folk).
- rawoke083600 6y agoAhhh ! Haven't even thought about the browser-shortcuts ! Lol I know F5 basically :/ Thanks will def look into this.
- simias 6y agoI try to use the keyboard for everything but unfortunately I haven't found a proper plugin for modern browsers. I tried to like tridactyl on Firefox but there were too many rough edges and it was unreliable (not really their fault, mainly limitations of what webextensions can do). As a result it was frustrating to have your keyboard shortcuts not work right ~25% of the time because you had the wrong part of the browser focused or something like that.
- sam_lowry_ 6y agoI used ctwm between 1998 and 2008 before switching to xmonad. It's still a great choice.
- tangus 6y agoGood choice. CTWM and Sawfish are two of the best and more configurable window managers there are. Unfortunately I had to give up on both years ago when they got unmaintained on Debian and not even compiling them from source would make them avoid visual glitches that made them unusable (especially after running Firefox (!)). Now I use KDE (also quite configurable, at least keyboard-wise) and my life is a little simpler in some ways and my experience a little more annoying in others.
- signa11 6y agotry out fvwm2, it is pretty awesome!
- bsg75 6y agoApparently fvwm3 has been released: https://github.com/fvwmorg/fvwm3 https://github.com/fvwmorg/fvwm3
- jmclnx 6y agoI agree, and a while ago I did a memory usage of all the Window Managers I could find. CTWM used less memory then all the others except for icewm. But it is far more configurable then icewm, even approaching FVWM2, but with much less memory. And I still use it on my Slackware System
- oropolo 6y agoWhat's the TL;DR breakdown of who the target audiences are for FreeBSD, NetBSD, and OpenBSD?
- snarfy 6y agoFreeBSD - You want to run an alternative to Linux OpenBSD - You care about security NetBSD - You want to hack on BSD
- guenthert 6y agoHmmh? I thought NetBSD was the legacy/retro computing crowd. They still support (at least as 2nd tier architecture) SUN 2 with MC68K, which are more than 30 years old now. I don't quite understand the motivation for that, I must admit. If I would be curating museum machines, wouldn't I want the original software with it? You can't run modern software in a meaningful way on those ancient, quite limited machines, which have less RAM than today's CPUs cache.
- johnklos 6y agoNetBSD is a wonderful OS for embedded applications. Having support for a fully static port (the Sun2 port) and for old, generally slow architectures (m68k, VAX) means performance regressions don't go unnoticed, for starters. I run NetBSD on a system with 24 megs of memory. I don't think this is possible with modern GNU/Linux - one would need an older kernel and something other than systemd, I think.
- FandangoRanger 6y agoFreeBSD: Created by people who run OS X on their computers for Sony and Apple. NetBSD: Created and run by people on a huge variety of computers, big in Japan. OpenBSD: Created by its own users, fork of NetBSD, run by everybody who truly cares about security and correctness.
- pufflefish 6y agoGood rundown. Sent from my Arch Linux system. edit: I have other systems. I agree with OpenBSD.
- snvzz 6y agoAIUI it uses Xlib. Not Xcb. What a poor choice.
- lmz 6y agoWell it was based on TWM.
- snvzz 6y agoYes, but my point was that netbsd had the chance to switch to something Xcb based. And instead, they switched to yet another Xlib-based wm.
- eschaton 6y agoWhat does it matter? And would an Xcb-based window manager perform well on a 68020 with only a few megabytes of RAM and a 1-bit display?
- snvzz 6y agoXcb is lighter. It requires less message bouncing back and forth. It is also simpler, and should yield less bugs. Xlib is terrible and should be avoided whether possible[0]. Everything else being equal, Xcb should be faster. This is true on current hardware, or on an Amiga 1200 with a 68030 accelboard like the one I have right next to me. The difference is actually dramatic[1]. [0]: https://www.remlab.net/op/xlib.shtml https://www.remlab.net/op/xlib.shtml [1]: https://www.x.org/wiki/guide/xlib-and-xcb/ https://www.x.org/wiki/guide/xlib-and-xcb/
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- natas 6y agoyou'll be missed twm!
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]