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Pre-COVID, you can visit a shopping mall and select your maid from a pool of selection. The whole experience is bizarre and inhuman and I don’t quite understand

Pre-COVID, you can visit a shopping mall and select your maid from a pool of selection. The whole experience is bizarre and inhuman and I don’t quite understand how many of my friends do it.

nikshawarma 6y ago
Exactly. Every time I step into those malls and see those shops, I feel utterly disgusted. It feels so cheap and dirty. I don't think I can ever bring myself to hire a live-in helper.
ashtonkem 6y ago
People’s ability to rationalize and normalize can be extremely impressive, if not occasionally nauseating.
iateanapple 6y ago
> The whole experience is bizarre and inhuman and I don’t quite understand how many of my friends do it. Why is it bizarre and inhuman? A maid working in Singapore will earn 3-4x what she will make in Indonesia with generally better working conditions. In addition because expenses are minimal (food+accommodation provided) you can save in 3-5 years what a typical lower class family living in Indonesia will save over 20.
- manquer 6y ago
  The inhumanity is nothing to do with economics of it. It is do with how they are being treated. What rights they have if they are selected out a shopping mall. They have zero avenue for support when they face abuse whether physical, sexual or emotional. visas in places like these ask you to leave immediately if you get quit or fired from a job.
  - iateanapple 6y ago
    > They have zero avenue for support when they face abuse whether physical, sexual or emotional. That is not true at all. Singapore is a country of law and order. > visas in places like these ask you to leave immediately if you get quit or fired from a job. They have been invited to a country as a temporary worker to do a specific job. Saying you have to go home if you get fired is not inhuman. I have worked offshore and had my contract canceled - it sucks but it’s not inhuman.
    - arp242 6y ago
      Well, this story doesn't strike me as a shining example of "law and order" working. I think you underestimate the psychological effect of constantly being treated as a disposable guest worker; there's a difference between that and working off-shore or being an expat treated as an equal. As I mentioned in my other reply[1] it is a "good deal" for many Indonesians in a way, but it comes at a price, a price which strikes me as quite needless as well. [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24563416 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24563416
  - Dylan16807 6y ago
    The issues with abuse are terrible, yes. But what's wrong with the shopping mall part? I'd be happy to sit in a shopping mall as potential employers come by to hire me for 3x what I'd make elsewhere. Maybe even 1x; I'm not convinced I would dislike it more than the normal job interview process.
matz1 6y ago
How is it bizarre and inhuman ?
refurb 6y ago
I could see it being odd, but is it that different than getting an au pair in the US and having the agency send you a list of potential candidates? I mean, it is odd and probably uncomfortable doing it in person, but the process is the same.
throwawaynothx 6y ago
I also visit a place and select my woman.
YetAnotherNick 6y ago
How is it different from something like say job fair/college placements? If both the maid and the employee agrees to go forward and have choice in that matter, I can't see your reasoning of it being inhuman. I am just seeing that the mall provide a dense contact point in which both the employees and maids can get in contact with the opposite side.
- throwawaysgx 6y ago
  Just because both sides agree to something doesn't make it right. A century ago child labor is considered ok in western countries, now we can look back and agree it was a horrible thing. You cannot compare a job fair to what was happening in those malls. Imagine you're not coming to a job fair, but you stay in a dorm room with 20 other women, and every day you sit in a room waiting for someone to come. Some agencies make the workers to stand in line in front of the "showroom" for any potential employers to walk pass. It makes me feel like they were selling goods and not a person.

Pre-COVID, you can visit a shopping mall and select your maid from a pool of selection. The whole experience is bizarre and inhuman and I don’t quite understand how many of my friends do it.

nikshawarma 6y ago

Exactly. Every time I step into those malls and see those shops, I feel utterly disgusted. It feels so cheap and dirty. I don't think I can ever bring myself to hire a live-in helper.

ashtonkem 6y ago

People’s ability to rationalize and normalize can be extremely impressive, if not occasionally nauseating.

iateanapple 6y ago

> The whole experience is bizarre and inhuman and I don’t quite understand how many of my friends do it. Why is it bizarre and inhuman? A maid working in Singapore will earn 3-4x what she will make in Indonesia with generally better working conditions. In addition because expenses are minimal (food+accommodation provided) you can save in 3-5 years what a typical lower class family living in Indonesia will save over 20.

manquer 6y ago
The inhumanity is nothing to do with economics of it. It is do with how they are being treated. What rights they have if they are selected out a shopping mall. They have zero avenue for support when they face abuse whether physical, sexual or emotional. visas in places like these ask you to leave immediately if you get quit or fired from a job.
- iateanapple 6y ago
  > They have zero avenue for support when they face abuse whether physical, sexual or emotional. That is not true at all. Singapore is a country of law and order. > visas in places like these ask you to leave immediately if you get quit or fired from a job. They have been invited to a country as a temporary worker to do a specific job. Saying you have to go home if you get fired is not inhuman. I have worked offshore and had my contract canceled - it sucks but it’s not inhuman.
  - arp242 6y ago
    Well, this story doesn't strike me as a shining example of "law and order" working. I think you underestimate the psychological effect of constantly being treated as a disposable guest worker; there's a difference between that and working off-shore or being an expat treated as an equal. As I mentioned in my other reply[1] it is a "good deal" for many Indonesians in a way, but it comes at a price, a price which strikes me as quite needless as well. [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24563416 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24563416
- Dylan16807 6y ago
  The issues with abuse are terrible, yes. But what's wrong with the shopping mall part? I'd be happy to sit in a shopping mall as potential employers come by to hire me for 3x what I'd make elsewhere. Maybe even 1x; I'm not convinced I would dislike it more than the normal job interview process.

matz1 6y ago

How is it bizarre and inhuman ?

refurb 6y ago

I could see it being odd, but is it that different than getting an au pair in the US and having the agency send you a list of potential candidates? I mean, it is odd and probably uncomfortable doing it in person, but the process is the same.

throwawaynothx 6y ago

I also visit a place and select my woman.

YetAnotherNick 6y ago

How is it different from something like say job fair/college placements? If both the maid and the employee agrees to go forward and have choice in that matter, I can't see your reasoning of it being inhuman. I am just seeing that the mall provide a dense contact point in which both the employees and maids can get in contact with the opposite side.

throwawaysgx 6y ago
Just because both sides agree to something doesn't make it right. A century ago child labor is considered ok in western countries, now we can look back and agree it was a horrible thing. You cannot compare a job fair to what was happening in those malls. Imagine you're not coming to a job fair, but you stay in a dorm room with 20 other women, and every day you sit in a room waiting for someone to come. Some agencies make the workers to stand in line in front of the "showroom" for any potential employers to walk pass. It makes me feel like they were selling goods and not a person.