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> Right, and he's also made explicit statements that you could FSD "by the end of 2016", "by the end of 2018", "by the end of 2020", coast to coast. That isn't
by jryle70 6y ago
> Right, and he's also made explicit statements that you could FSD "by the end of 2016", "by the end of 2018", "by the end of 2020", coast to coast.
That isn't out or character for Musk. He's always set and communicate unrealistic timeline. That doesn't make him a fraud. Take Falcon Heavy:
> By 2008, SpaceX had been aiming for the first launch of Falcon 9 in 2009, while "Falcon 9 Heavy would be in a couple of years". Speaking at the 2008 Mars Society Conference, Musk also indicated that he expected a hydrogen-fueled upper stage would follow 2–3 years later (which would have been around 2013) - [0]
Of course Falcon Heavy didn't fly until Feb 2018, and hydrogen-fueled upper stage never materialized. Still, nobody care about that today. FH is a resounding success and are qualified to be used for NASA's Lunar Gateway and Space Force's National Security Space Launch program, which are as good as stamps of approval can get.
[0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falcon_Heavy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falcon_Heavy
- FireBeyond 6y agoI never said he was a fraud, though I am cynical. But you can't hand wave away his statements on Twitter as "Oh, that's just Elon, all Tesla's corporate statements have very explicitly (in at times very fine print) said it's contingent on 'capability' and 'regulation'" when Tesla have literally said "Elon's Twitter _is_ a Tesla corporate statement".
- jryle70 6y ago> But you can't hand wave away his statements on Twitter as "Oh, that's just Elon, all Tesla's corporate statements have very explicitly (in at times very fine print) said it's contingent on 'capability' and 'regulation'" when Tesla have literally said "Elon's Twitter _is_ a Tesla corporate statement". Yes and no. His settlement with SEC only requires vetting for tweets that have material impact to investors. Anything else is just his opinion, although I agree that's a very fine line - [0] Take his tweet sent out today about Battery Day event tomorrow: > Important note about Tesla Battery Day unveil tomorrow. This affects long-term production, especially Semi, Cybertruck & Roadster, but what we announce will not reach serious high-volume production until 2022 - [1] Clearly a vetted communication. A less serious one in contrast: > Bitte arbeiten Sie bei Tesla Giga Berlin! Es wird super Spaß machen!! - [2] [0] - https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/apr/26/tesla-elon-musk-sec-twitter-deal https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/apr/26/tesla-elo... [1] - https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1308148212876812289 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1308148212876812289 [2] - https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1304175179606695937 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1304175179606695937
- serf 6y ago> That doesn't make him a fraud. Why not? What is the point of deadlines then? Being a fraud doesn't mean you fail to deliver. fraud: 'wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.' He promises deadlines to soothe shareholders. I don't see the difference in his behavior and fraudulent behavior, other than that he has a large fan-base to validate the behavior. He profits from promises that aren't delivered.
- jryle70 6y ago> What is the point of deadlines then? I don't pretend to know his motivation, perhaps his misplaced optimism? or to motivate and set the guideline for his troop? or to indicate Tesla's priority and direction? Do you think JFK knew for sure that American would reach the moon before the end of 1960s? Or for that matter, I suppose you'd consider NASA to be fraudulent if Artemis program fails to send a crewed mission to the Moon in 2024. > Being a fraud doesn't mean you fail to deliver. Fraud usually means all talk and no substance. Can you give a counter example? > He profits from promises that aren't delivered. You need to show the evidence of this