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U.S. Adult Obesity Rate Tops 42 Percent; Highest Ever Recorded

102 points by bluedino 6y ago

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
vmception 6y ago
One aspect of this is that consensus shifts towards obese-normalization despite no health consensus changing or scientific advancement supporting this body form. It's merely rule by mob to accepting this because the mob is overweight and obese. Fascinating.
- SketchySeaBeast 6y ago
  I doubt it's any sort of deliberate act, just the normalization of people looking bigger and bigger and that becoming "normal". People who were fat a generation ago are now normal because the window has shifted. I don't think that the movements for obesity normalization has had as much of an effect as just seeing larger people around.
  - vmception 6y ago
    > I don't think that the movements for obesity normalization has had as much of an effect as just seeing larger people around. A distinction that doesn't really matter right? In one example, I think it's good that clothing websites will show people in their clothes that look like their larger customers. I think it's good that this is less jarring to see due to prevalence alone. There was little utility for the polar opposite at size 0 and size 2 to model for everything, aside from overvaluing the addictiveness of frustration. It still remains accurate to point out the health issues associated with obesity and the folly of remaining in that state.
    - SketchySeaBeast 6y ago
      > A distinction that doesn't really matter right? I think it does, because it's more insidious than any sort of active movement. Are websites showing plus sized models because they want to be body positive or just because that's who research shows buys their clothing. > It still remains accurate to point out the health issues associated with obesity and the folly of remaining in that state. Absolutely - it's a danger, I'm not saying it's not. My point is that you can change the narrative of a movement much more easily than you can change how a society as a whole unthinkingly deals with something. A deliberate normalization has a voice which can change what it's saying, this phenomena really doesn't.
      - vmception 6y ago
        In that case I do think active movements are having an effect. I think websites are showing plus sized models because the movements told them "look at your customer analytics instead of assuming the status quo of people imagining they'll look like size 0 models when they wear this" It is all very interrelated from my perspective. If I did have an opinion I would say that a more collaborate and holistic approach with a movement's narrative is possible and necessary. For example, if some people to go to the extreme of wanting magazines to make disclaimers that models are photoshopped to help people in all BMI ranges have higher self esteem, then people normalizing unhealthy but common BMI ranges should also have disclaimers about the issues associated with remaining in that state.
- yodsanklai 6y ago
  > despite no health consensus changing or scientific advancement supporting this body form There is a scientific consensus that being obese reduces your life expectancy.
  - danhak 6y ago
    There is a growing social consensus that all body types are beautiful and should be celebrated. This is obviously a very delicate issue. We surely don't want people to be shamed or ashamed for being overweight. Nothing good comes from shame. But there is serious mortality and morbidity associated with obesity. And as a society, we don't seem to have much of a problem shaming people who fall into other risk categories such as smoking or drug use.
    - dternyak 6y ago
      > Nothing good comes from shame. While this may seem harsh at a surface level, are you really sure nothing good comes from shame? Is shame always an unhealthy emotion to experience? It seems to me that it is effective in focusing attention on potential personal misjudgement or misbehavior, and can strengthen resolve to break bad habits or otherwise ensure a better outcome for oneself going forward.
      - danhak 6y ago
        Yes, my experience with CBT very much leads me to believe that shame is a highly destructive emotion, more likely to cause someone to withdraw and disengage from life than to promote lasting positive change in behavior.
        zionic 6y ago
        This is far from universal. Many people simply lack any motivation to change when not confronted with shame.
        zepto 6y ago
        This is probably because you were shamed for things that were actually harmless. There is definitely a problem with the level to which shame is used indiscriminately to control people. But no emotion is inherently destructive. We should feel shame at certain things. If you tripped an old lady and didn’t feel shame, I’d say you were a psychopath, or if you simply threatened to kill anyone who you didn’t like. It’s also notable that absence of shame is characteristic of psychopathy, and even Buddhist psychology states that an absence of shame is an impediment to enlightenment. I completely support the idea that excessive or inappropriate shame is a major part of many if not most psychological disorders. Nothing supports the idea that all shame is destructive. On the topic of obesity, I do agree that shame is unlikely to help. In fact I suspect that shame is more likely to be part of the cause.
- pm90 6y ago
  Body shaming is not a valid method of making people get in shape, so I don't think there's anything wrong in the acceptance of people with more mass. We do have other ways to encourage people to lose weight though, such as sugar taxes, regulating processed foods' contents, investing in making fresh produce widely available etc. which can make a difference.
  - toomuchtodo 6y ago
    People will argue this infringes on their freedom to make unhealthy life choices. I agree, you cannot force someone to make healthy life choices, only use pricing signals to encourage it. Tax them more to recoup the costs, and let them make the choices they would like (unhealthy foods, smoking, etc). I also agree that more regulation is required (States in Mexico intend to ban kids from purchasing junk food because childhood obesity there is skyrocketing [1]). [1] https://www.npr.org/2020/09/14/912029399/we-had-to-take-action-states-in-mexico-move-to-ban-junk-food-sales-to-minors https://www.npr.org/2020/09/14/912029399/we-had-to-take-acti... (NPR: 'We Had To Take Action': States In Mexico Move To Ban Junk Food Sales To Minors)
    - outside1234 6y ago
      Or said another way, there should be a standard rate for health insurance, and an increasingly discount for folks as they come closer to an ideal BMI.
  - swebs 6y ago
    It is a very effective method. It's common to do in Japan, and they have one of the lowest obesity rates of any first world country. No overbearing government regulations necessary.
    - pm90 6y ago
      Average Japanese diets are much healthier than American diets; there is less of a car culture, public transport is common. But do go on about fat shaming being effective.
- DamnYuppie 6y ago
  Yes, you are fat shaming if you mention they are unhealthy and overweight. The idea that you are in the wrong for pointing this out is mind-blowing to me. While it may not be an effective means of changing their behavior it is a valid means of framing conversations around what is desirable and healthy. If we continue to allow peoples feelings about how they feel override what we objectively know to be good we will be on the fast train to hell.
  - shajznnckfke 6y ago
    I think in general it’s considered rude to mention that someone is stupid, unattractive, poor, etc. Overall, people are already suffering from low confidence due to these issues and pointing them out only hurts them. Unless someone is seeking out honest feedback in these areas, it’s probably better not to volunteer any. On the other hand, it’s fine to talk about how society has a problem with education, poverty, or obesity and suggest society-scale solutions.
  - monkmartinez 6y ago
    Agreed... a few years ago, I was getting a bit plump in the mid-section. My wife's grandmother from Colombia strait up told me I was looking "gordo" (fat). I got on it immediately and shed the spare tire. I thanked her for being honest and open... I wish I could tell others the same. “Choose not to be harmed—and you won’t feel harmed. Don’t feel harmed—and you haven’t been.” ~ Marcus Aurelius
- mc32 6y ago
  I kind of understand the backlash against the skinny-chic look foisted upon people by the baddies in the fashion industry, but now there’s an equally bad movement which kind of says “it’s cool to be overweight, don’t sweat it, this is how we are”. Yes, true, for some people there is little recourse, their physiology is such, but a majority could become healthier with a better lifestyle choice.
  - itsoktocry 6y ago
    >I kind of understand the backlash against skinny-chic foisted upon people by the baddies in the fashion industry This is a weird trope. Most models are selected to be slender so they can, basically, simulate a clothes rack. No curves to draw attention! I'm not sure the fashion industry is telling anyone this is ideal. I can't remember, in my lifetime, when skinny models were ever really looked at by society-at-large as the "right" body type. They were always seen as "skinny models". Of course there are people with all sorts of preferences, but the most celebrated models of my youth (say, Heidi Klum or Tara Banks) were relatively fit as opposed to withering. On the other hand, many people (both men and women) end up with eating disorders trying to reach this "ideal".
    - vmception 6y ago
      Everything you mentioned was accurate. But we do have to recognize the effects that are also had on people, your last sentence is a heavier weighting than your perception. People have not been capable of separating an industry ideal from a non-industry related attractiveness ideal. Individuals know what they like, visually and sexually. Individuals are also aware of what the seeming consensus of "should like" is, visually and sexually. Simple put, people know when other people are considered hot and what that looks like.
  - tonyedgecombe 6y ago
    a majority could become healthier with a better lifestyle choice. When such a large portion of the population is overweight it tends to indicate a systemic problem rather than one of individual choice.
- ashleyn 6y ago
  Individuals have the right to choose obesity and pay their own costs related to it. This isn't "mob rule" because nobody is really forcing anyone else to be obese. There's no problem to solve other than being more cognizant of the costs obesity will impose on one as an individual.
  - zionic 6y ago
    >and pay their own costs related to it. Now run the numbers again with socialized healthcare. When society's tax dollars are funding your triple bypass from your 30+ BMI it's absolutely societies business.
  - i_haz_rabies 6y ago
    Society pays for it too. Less so than some countries given America's private healthcare system, but as an extreme example... what happens if America needs more soldiers? Overeating means more agriculture means more land used/more inputs required/more carbon burned. Illness and early deaths has an impact on productivity. No man is an island, everything you do has an impact on society.
- RobLach 6y ago
  A minor one, and misunderstanding of the argument. The "obese-normalization" you speak is about fat-shaming abolitionism, against discrimination in professional and social spaces because of body composition, not that such a body type is necessarily encouraged. Furthermore the categorization of "obese", and BMI in general, has a pile of research exposing all the caveats and encouraged more granular diagnoses around mass composition for humans. You can be categorized as obese and have perfectly fine physical function. For example, pretty much every football player is overweight, most are obese. BMI charts are only a cursory step towards a proper analysis. If you understand that obesity comes from a medical or mental condition, then a culture of fat-shaming is comparable to having a culture of shaming those suffering from PTSD or depression or birth abnormalities, et al. That sort of culture doesn't have many positive societal effects beyond pushing people into mental duress about things they are still trying to figure out how to manage. Any hyper-normalization of extreme obesity is a side effect of the propensity of such a shaming culture as it becomes more of a political statement than a medical one (or more fringe culture i.e kinks). Being against removing this discrimination from our culture only makes sense if you believe that an effective methodology for overcoming a health problem is by being abused by society into action conformity. Simply, if you're too fat you should be allowed to deal with that very personal issue on your own terms and not be ostracized from professional or social spaces. The main aspect is a demonization of fatty foods, propagandized heavily by the sugar and soft drink industry, which market realities have shifted food products to compensate for the lack of flavor and satiation from fat by loading them with sugar. This is all compounded by massive corn subsidies in the US making it extremely tempting to load up recipes with cheap, sweet, calorie dense, corn syrup. (some random chart after quick search about this https://imgur.com/nvWRyrh https://imgur.com/nvWRyrh)
- johnkpaul 6y ago
  As a lifelong morbidly obese person, and I admit that this is anecdata, this is categorically not true, for me. I feel no normalizations. I feel no mob, on my side. Rather, I feel a gigantic mob on the "just lose weight you fat person" side. I still have doctors that won't take any ailment seriously because their first response is "just lose weight you fat person". Everything in this HuffPo article rings completely true for me -https://highline.huffingtonpost.com/articles/en/everything-you-know-about-obesity-is-wrong/ https://highline.huffingtonpost.com/articles/en/everything-y...
throwaway4good 6y ago
What definition of obese is used here? 42% sounds like a lot.
- cj 6y ago
  Direct link to the report referenced in the press release: https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityReport_20.pdf https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityR... Page 8 defines "Overweight" as BMI 25+ and "Obesity" as 30+.
- awat 6y ago
  Likely BMI of 30+
- save_ferris 6y ago
  CDC defines obesity as having a Body Mass Index above 30[0]. Per their example, a 5'9 person weighing 203 lbs or more would be considered obese. 0: https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/adult/defining.html https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/adult/defining.html
  - throwaway4good 6y ago
    For the rest of us: If you are 1.70 m and have a BMI of above 30, your weight is more than 86.7 kg. For obese people who are 1.80 m, your weight is more than 97.2 kg. 42% is an absolutely insane number of obese people - what on earth is going on?
  - elindbe2 6y ago
    And before anyone complains about BMI, it's useful as a population-level measurement: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5896802/#:~:text=The%20analysis%20has%20indicated%20that,known%20confounders%20were%20controlled%20for https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5896802/#:~:tex....
    - Spivak 6y ago
      Yeah, it's not a particularly good statistic about an individual person's body except as a suuuuuper rough guideline but if everyone's BMI goes up something's happening.
throw1234651234 6y ago
This interesting to me, because I feel like more Americans are working out than ever, but maybe it's just my environment. Naturally, working out usually has second-order effects like watching nutrition.
- goalieca 6y ago
  I must work out because I have a desk job. There are many other kinds of jobs that aren't desk jobs where you don't get enough exercise.
  - tonyedgecombe 6y ago
    Jobs that require physical exertion have been disappearing. Even the guys putting in a new water main outside my house didn't seem to be doing much physical work. I didn't see them swinging a pick or using a shovel.
- chrisseaton 6y ago
  I guess it's bifurcated, like too many other things in our society are becoming. People are either doing no physical activity, or they're doing triathlons. People either have multiple degrees, or they didn't finish high-school. People either buy a house in their early 20s, or they're renting all their lives. People either read a book a week, or they never read a book at all. (Obviously there are practically many people in between these extremes and people are free to do whatever they want and many people are happy and successful on both sides of each of these spectrums.)
  - thinkharderdev 6y ago
    Exactly this. It is astounding how extreme the difference can be sometimes. You'll be in a major coastal city and it seems like everyone is relatively trim, works out religiously and wouldn't touch a fast food hamburger. Then you go to the midwest or the south and it seems like everyone you see is overweight/obese, subsists on a diet of fast food and smokes cigarettes. I'm shocked just noticing the number of people walking around smoking cigarettes when I get out of East Coast metro areas. I literally don't know anyone where I live who smoked anymore and rarely see anyone smoking on the street.
jononomo 6y ago
There is a simple solution to the obesity epidemic: levy a heavy tax on any kind of sugar or grain that enters the food system and use the money to subsidize red meat. A carnivore diet that avoids plant-based foods altogether is ideal for human health and is almost impossible to remain obese on. For faster or more thorough weight loss cut out dairy as well. Find more information at https://MeatRx.com/ https://MeatRx.com/
- cj 6y ago
  > A diet that avoids plant-based foods altogether is ideal for human health > MeatRx.com Those are some bold claims. Curious if there's any actual science supporting not eating plants.
  - jononomo 6y ago
    Yes, there is a ton of science supporting not eating plants. In fact, entire human societies have survived for generations on entirely animal-based diets but a human being cannot even survive on a diet devoid of animal-based foods (vegans have to supplement or else they die). There is a list of books here: https://meatrx.com/resources/books/ https://meatrx.com/resources/books/ I personally find the writing and lectures of Nina Teicholz to be especially compelling.
- bird_monster 6y ago
  Can you provided any peer reviewed studies on the benefits of the carnivore diet?
  - jononomo 6y ago
    Find resources here: https://meatrx.com/category/research-articles/ https://meatrx.com/category/research-articles/ https://meatrx.com/resources/books/ https://meatrx.com/resources/books/
    - bird_monster 6y ago
      See but those articles are about ketogenic diets, not "Carnivore". Ketogenic diets don't have to be meat centric.
vonwoodson 6y ago
Relevant The Onion clip: https://youtu.be/hRoSJ1y1FSY https://youtu.be/hRoSJ1y1FSY
tribune 6y ago
Uh... Mississippi has the highest adult obesity rate in the country at 40.8 percent and Colorado has the lowest at 23.8 percent. Seems like this must be different (or old) data by State?
- qntty 6y ago
  It seems that both numbers are from the same report. Here's an excerpt from the report: > How is it that only 12 states have adult obesity rates exceeding 35 percent, yet the national obesity rate is 42.4 percent? It’s because state obesity rates are from the BRFSS, which collects self-reported height and weight. Research has demonstrated that people tend to overestimate their height and underestimate their weight. In fact, one study found that, due to this phenomenon, the BRFSS may underestimate obesity rates by nearly 10 percent. NHANES, from which the national obesity rate is derived, calculates its obesity rate based on measurements obtained at respondents’ physical examinations. Accordingly, the higher rates found by NHANES are a more accurate reflection of obesity in the United States. https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityReport_20.pdf https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityR...
partiallypro 6y ago
I am 6' and weight 190-195, I was 175 before the pandemic. I am considered overweight now, though I don't think I quite meet the obesity requirements. I think the pandemic and its stress toll has given people something the equivalent of the "Freshman 10."
- onedognight 6y ago
  I call it the “COVID 19”.
  - SketchySeaBeast 6y ago
    You don't find it causes alarm when you say "since March I've been suffering from COVID 19" while speaking moistly?
  - dragontamer 6y ago
    I've called it the "Covid15". And when people wonder what I mean: I tell them "Its like the Freshmen 15, except its the weight gained from COVID19 lockdowns". Although more seriously, when I gained ~5 lbs, I started to eat healthier, and shed that weight back down to my normal <180lbs. For 5'10, I'm still slightly overweight by BMI (and I'm not very lean or strong, so I doubt its muscle).
- neverminder 6y ago
  This. Before the whole corona hysteria I was well on track of getting into the best shape in my life having lost 18 kg in 4 months and reduced body fat by 10%. The whole lockdown reversed all that and then some. They took away my routine, my gym, even my food temporarily and put me under house arrest.
  - low_common 6y ago
    There's always the Great Outdoors. Go on a run, a bike ride, calisthenics.
    - 6y ago
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
klmadfejno 6y ago
The part about how food insecurity causes obesity is hard to understand. Its well documented that poverty leads to unhealthier food. Its obvious that poverty leads to food insecurity. Still, wrapping ones head around how not having enough to eat leads one to be obese is tough to grok. Really emphasizes just how bad cheap is for you. The part about how 12 states have averages above 35%... didn't make sense to me if the national average is 42. Maybe I missed something.
- jononomo 6y ago
  Rice, beans, sugar, and bread are cheap foods -- if you are trapped in poverty then you will be eating a carb-heavy mostly plant-based diet and you'll probably also be consuming a lot of sugar. Carbohydrates are what lead to obesity. Cutting carbs out entirely is a healthy way to cut weight, but that would mean eating only meat, which is comparatively expensive. This is why poor people are fat.
  - steelbrain 6y ago
    I don’t understand. There are entire nations (eg. Pakistan, Bangladesh) where meat is a delicacy and Rice and Wheat is what feeds the masses, the obesity ratio I’ve personally observed is nowhere near the US.
    - jononomo 6y ago
      India and Pakistan suffer from the lowest life expectancy in the world and diabetes is exploding. They do in fact have a fair amount of obesity, but the rate is not as high as it is in the west because it is overpowered by poverty, so they are on a low-calorie version of a poor diet. There is also much more manual labor happening in India, which keeps the weight off.
      - angio 6y ago
        There are rich countries like Japan and South Korea that consume between 8 to 12 times [0] as much rice as the US and have much lower obesity rates (almost a tenth) [1]. [0] https://www.helgilibrary.com/indicators/rice-consumption-per-capita/ https://www.helgilibrary.com/indicators/rice-consumption-per... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_r...
tabtab 6y ago
I have three major comments about this. First, most countries use a lot of public transportation, which often requires walking roughly a mile to and again from work and commerce centers. This "forces" them to get regular exercise. Our car culture cuts into that. Second, we need better food labeling. "Serving size" is too arbitrary. Instead use ratios: ratio per N calories, and ratio per weight. That way we can easily compare across product types. It can be worded as "X units per N calories" and "X units per gram", or the like. The units would be standardized. Third, include percent of whole-ness of grain. It's hard to know otherwise. We need to eat more whole grains, but 100% is not very tasty to most such that a mix is decent compromise. But we need better numbers to know the mix percent.
- angio 6y ago
  > Second, we need better food labeling. "Server size" is too arbitrary. Instead use ratios: ratio per N calories, and ratio per weight. That way we can easily compare across product types. It can be worded as "X units per N calories" and "X units per gram", or the like. In Europe labels need to have nutritional information using standard units (e.g. 100g or 100ml). It seems very odd they don't require that in the US too.
  - tabtab 6y ago
    That's part of the reason why Europeans are trimmer and healthier.
    - angio 6y ago
      I'm not sure that's the reason, but for sure things like standard nutritional labels and semaphores on labels help making healthy choices.
  - XCSme 6y ago
    Wait, in the US it doesn't say kcals/100g on the package?
- thinkharderdev 6y ago
nprz 6y ago
I'd be interested to see the rates segmented by generation. Everyone in my generation (millennial) seems to be very sugar adverse, has that done anything to lower obesity rates?
lordnacho 6y ago
Ask any traveller to the US what their trip was like, and at some point they will mention how portion sizes are gigantic. I have to agree, every time I've eaten there it's been way bigger than both what's good for me and what I was happy to get get for the price. This doesn't seem to stop at restaurants, I went to a supermarket and you can mega sized versions of just about anything. Even the strawberries seem to be bigger. You can get buckets of jelly babies. The ready made pizzas seem to be bigger. Just everything. At the same time, most travellers will tell you the food was delicious. This may be good for keeping customers happy, but it's going to tend to mean things that our hunter gatherer ancestors wanted to stock up on, in quantities they would rarely find. Finally, sweets and junk food in America are like crack. I don't know what they put in it, but just about everything in that category is more enticing than the same categories in Europe. My brother had a six pack before he moved there. Now he has a beer belly.
- zeta0134 6y ago
  As a US native, this a thousand times. When I started doing meal prep for an exercise program, and really loading things up with protein, I was surprised at just how little I needed to eat throughout the day to feel satiated and energized, even while beginning a workout routine that was quite tough for a beginner. Sometimes I still like to eat out, but it's a rare treat, I can't do it every day like I used to when I was younger. Even then, I'll usually look for the junior portions, which are plenty filling.
  - EForEndeavour 6y ago
    Before COVID, I was visiting the US 2-3 times a year, but only the northeast region. Are massive portion sizes more common in certain parts of the country? My naive impression is that portion sizes are bigger in the south, but I have no idea where I absorbed this belief from.
    - zeta0134 6y ago
      I've lived in South Texas, Washington State, Missouri, and Tennessee, and I don't really recall a difference in overall portion size at restaurants, fast food locations, or typical diners. A lot of the popular chains have standardized their menus, so you can usually pull up the online menu and check out the nutritional data. For international chains, it might be interesting to compare overall calorie counts if the region specific menus are available?
yodsanklai 6y ago
No wonder, it's incredibly hard to eat healthy food in some parts of the US. And many people seem to have no idea that their diet is terrible. I'm not even sure they link their obesity to their diet.
- WalterSear 6y ago
  Food deserts are a myth. Low SES people tend to eat lower quality foods for reasons other than availability.
  - yodsanklai 6y ago
    > Food deserts are a myth It's anecdotal evidence, but as a European frequently travelling in the US, I do have a hard time finding what I consider healthy food. I usually skip one meal each day and still put on weight. I suppose that if you're really careful and cook your own food at each meal you can get by, but all the incentives are there for you to eat a lot, and a lot of junk food.
    - ghaff 6y ago
      "Food desert" mostly doesn't refer to eating out but being able to buy unprocessed food/produce/etc. which is hard to do if your only option is a convenience store. But there mostly are supermarkets available if not as plentiful or as good in low income areas. I travel a lot in the US too though (as an American) and I've rarely (in cities) had much of an issue finding restaurants I consider good--though I'm not sure most meals I get on the road really qualify as "healthy" day after day either in the US or most other places. And, certainly, if you're looking for something quick and easy, that's probably going to be some fast food franchise. I almost universally avoid but that assumes putting some time and effort into finding better places when on the road.
mensetmanusman 6y ago
Covid has been particularly devastating for the obese and diabetic.
hi41 6y ago
Is there truth to the fact that there are many body types and that each body knows what the correct weight should be and they reach that weight by consuming what is necessary? For example, when I diet and reduce weight, I gain it back in few months. May be I am meant to be at the higher weight. Many say that greedy corporations have set up the numbers for diabetes and it’s okay to have higher A1C.
- cercatrova 6y ago
  Not really. You're probably gaining it back because you (presumably) think a diet is a one time thing. It's not, it must be maintained indefinitely, since it's just calories in vs calories out.
- TACIXAT 6y ago
  Nope. My understanding is that fat cells do not go away initially but just shrink. That is why it is easy to gain back recently lost weight. It takes a sustained effort to lose and keep off weight. You're of course free to do what you want, but being overweight leads to health problems that you wouldn't otherwise have.
Ccecil 6y ago
I live in the US. In passing I have noticed quite a bit about our culture which lends to being overweight. 1) Structure: it is way too easy to get food that is horrible for you. Not only that but in a way which you can eat it in the car on the way when you are only "slightly hungry". 2) Commercial interests: Go into a Walmart and pay attention to the organization. Everything which makes you fatter (and therefore consume more) is directly in front of you and on the end of the aisles. You need to search for the healthy food, and for some reason in my experience their limited produce selection seems to spoil faster than other stores (how can my bananas be green and rotten at the same time?) 3) Rewarding excess: It is in vogue to be wasteful. Being able to live in excess and be wasteful is very popular in our culture this is not limited to food, just look at the flatscreen TV count in houses, large inefficient cars and houses, etc. 4) Exercise as an excuse: "I have a gym membership, I went this week...so I can eat an extra 3000 calories today" That coupled with the lack of walking from the car culture and you have a very low rate of calorie burn vs intake. 5) Sugar substitutes: Why does everything need sweetener? Does this sweetener have effects we don't know about? There have been studies that say it also causes obesity and diabetic issues. It is very common for people in this country to drink several "diet" sodas a day and using that as reason to allow themselves to have extra dessert/sweet things. Just my observations, also, I fall into the overweight category even knowing these things and making efforts to not continue the path which I was brought up on. If I had not made an effort to change diet and exercise...who knows how big I would be.
- thinkharderdev 6y ago
  3 really resonates. People tend to dramatically overestimate the number of calories they burn when exercising. You have to work really, really hard to burn more than 500 calories in an hour workout and most people probably burn more like 100-200 calories when they exercise. Then they go home and drink a 16oz double IPA that is 400 calories by itself.
- skim_milk 6y ago
  I agree but I wonder if there's more points? 6) Emotional support. I see less and less large people out and about and more mostly attractive people hanging outside over the past decade. I have to wonder if this is in part due to social media: a) Less attractive people feel like they deserve less social status (not sure if this is a USA-specific cultural thing but it's definitely a thing here) b) Because of point a, spend more online because of the heightened feeling of not deserving of making friends c) Social media is absolute junk, the more time you spend on it naturally the worse you're going to feel d) Feedback loop of spending more time online, feeling bad, spending less time outside with physical contact causing worse physical health, causing even more time spent online, repeat for decades More attractive people are naturally going to feel more deserving of love and emotional support and more likely to seek it out because of our culture, despite really we should all feel equally deserving of love and support. But this feedback mechanism I think exists breaks that feeling of deserving mental/physical fitness which is causes awful mental/physical fitness.
jefftk 6y ago
Full report: https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityReport_20.pdf https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityR... p26 answers a question I had: > WHY ARE REPORTED NATIONAL OBESITY RATES HIGHER THAN STATE-BY-STATE RATES? How is it that only 12 states have adult obesity rates exceeding 35 percent, yet the national obesity rate is 42.4 percent? It’s because state obesity rates are from the BRFSS, which collects self-reported height and weight. Research has demonstrated that people tend to overestimate their height and underestimate their weight. In fact, one study found that, due to this phenomenon, the BRFSS may underestimate obesity rates by nearly 10 percent.256 NHANES, from which the national obesity rate is derived, calculates its obesity rate based on measurements obtained at respondents’ physical examinations. Accordingly, the higher rates found by NHANES are a more accurate reflection of obesity in the United States.257
every 6y ago
The ability to quickly and efficiently store fat would definitely have been a positive trait under multigenerational "feast or famine" conditions. But not so much for our relatively recent "perpetual feast" largess...
mcfunk 6y ago
I find it interesting that I scrolled through this whole thread and there has been little if any discussion of excessively poor health care in the United States. Also, things like how when people develop type 2 diabetes, the solution is often getting them on expensive insulin that causes weight gain, causing more insulin need, causing more weight gain etc. Look up Dr. Jason Fung for detailed information on how the typical approach to diabetes management actually just makes it, and weight gain, much worse. Speaking of healthcare in the US, even for those who can afford a doctor -- I personally have gone to the doctor when I had unexplained blood sugar drops and weight gain despite being active (training for a century ride at the time), counting calories and eating the oft-touted '5 small meals a day'. They scoffed at me, told me they 'couldn't give me a pill to make me thin,' told me my habits were fine and I should keep doing what I was doing. As it turned out, and I learned through my own research, my frequent eating was causing me to become insulin resistant, and once I moved to 2 meals a day and a longer fast overnight my issues reversed. From talking to others there was nothing unusual about my experience with the doctor -- in the US obesity is considered a moral issue and not a health one, and our doctors have very little to offer in terms of advice based on the underlying mechanisms of obesity or taking patients seriously when they are concerned about weight gain. We have all sorts of other things contributing to causing metabolic issues in the first place -- our poorly regulated food and ag industries have been pushing completely warped ideas of what makes a 'balanced' diet for decades -- e.g. milk and empty carbohydrates are 'a balanced breakfast,' the low fat fiasco where processed foods with reduced fat and increased sugars were touted as 'healthier', and for decades kids were taught in school the 'food pyramid' which was a suggested diet written entirely by agriculture lobbyists rather than the available science on nutrition. We have an entire populace who, if they know anything about what is actually healthy for humans, came by it through having to seek it out themselves and wade through a lot of junk science sponsored by various corporate interests. Also we are stuck in cycles of constant work, presenteeism and long hours in sedentary jobs, no sick leave, little if any vacation, etc. etc. where Europe etc. have much better work practices, not to mention less car culture, walk and bikeable and transitable cities, all things that are aggressively opposed in the US. The problem is fueled by a number of systems. Imagining it to be a matter of simple will power or portion size is inane.
Simulacra 6y ago
From 2019’data. That’s an important distinction.
mncharity 6y ago
For anyone else who doesn't keep up with this, it seems at least some of Chile's efforts[1] have survived the years US food industry lobbying, lawsuits, and advertising, and have had some effect.[2] Brasil[3]... perhaps has more pressing problems now. Global push-back on Investor-State Dispute Settlement seems to have throttled it's growth, and I don't quickly find any cases on food-health regulation (though there's little transparency on threats of cases). [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/07/health/obesity-chile-sugar-regulations.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/07/health/obesity-chile-suga... [2] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/11/chiles-drastic-anti-obesity-measures-cut-sugary-drink-sales-by-23 https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/11/chiles-drastic... paper: https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/journal.pmed.1003015 https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/jo... [3] https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/09/16/health/brazil-obesity-nestle.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/09/16/health/brazil...
habanany 6y ago
Is it increases in obesity a Coronavirus lockdown fault ?

102 points by bluedino 6y ago

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

One aspect of this is that consensus shifts towards obese-normalization despite no health consensus changing or scientific advancement supporting this body form. It's merely rule by mob to accepting this because the mob is overweight and obese. Fascinating.

SketchySeaBeast 6y ago
I doubt it's any sort of deliberate act, just the normalization of people looking bigger and bigger and that becoming "normal". People who were fat a generation ago are now normal because the window has shifted. I don't think that the movements for obesity normalization has had as much of an effect as just seeing larger people around.
- vmception 6y ago
  > I don't think that the movements for obesity normalization has had as much of an effect as just seeing larger people around. A distinction that doesn't really matter right? In one example, I think it's good that clothing websites will show people in their clothes that look like their larger customers. I think it's good that this is less jarring to see due to prevalence alone. There was little utility for the polar opposite at size 0 and size 2 to model for everything, aside from overvaluing the addictiveness of frustration. It still remains accurate to point out the health issues associated with obesity and the folly of remaining in that state.
  - SketchySeaBeast 6y ago
    > A distinction that doesn't really matter right? I think it does, because it's more insidious than any sort of active movement. Are websites showing plus sized models because they want to be body positive or just because that's who research shows buys their clothing. > It still remains accurate to point out the health issues associated with obesity and the folly of remaining in that state. Absolutely - it's a danger, I'm not saying it's not. My point is that you can change the narrative of a movement much more easily than you can change how a society as a whole unthinkingly deals with something. A deliberate normalization has a voice which can change what it's saying, this phenomena really doesn't.
    - vmception 6y ago
      In that case I do think active movements are having an effect. I think websites are showing plus sized models because the movements told them "look at your customer analytics instead of assuming the status quo of people imagining they'll look like size 0 models when they wear this" It is all very interrelated from my perspective. If I did have an opinion I would say that a more collaborate and holistic approach with a movement's narrative is possible and necessary. For example, if some people to go to the extreme of wanting magazines to make disclaimers that models are photoshopped to help people in all BMI ranges have higher self esteem, then people normalizing unhealthy but common BMI ranges should also have disclaimers about the issues associated with remaining in that state.
yodsanklai 6y ago
> despite no health consensus changing or scientific advancement supporting this body form There is a scientific consensus that being obese reduces your life expectancy.
- danhak 6y ago
  There is a growing social consensus that all body types are beautiful and should be celebrated. This is obviously a very delicate issue. We surely don't want people to be shamed or ashamed for being overweight. Nothing good comes from shame. But there is serious mortality and morbidity associated with obesity. And as a society, we don't seem to have much of a problem shaming people who fall into other risk categories such as smoking or drug use.
  - dternyak 6y ago
    > Nothing good comes from shame. While this may seem harsh at a surface level, are you really sure nothing good comes from shame? Is shame always an unhealthy emotion to experience? It seems to me that it is effective in focusing attention on potential personal misjudgement or misbehavior, and can strengthen resolve to break bad habits or otherwise ensure a better outcome for oneself going forward.
    - danhak 6y ago
      Yes, my experience with CBT very much leads me to believe that shame is a highly destructive emotion, more likely to cause someone to withdraw and disengage from life than to promote lasting positive change in behavior.
      - zionic 6y ago
        This is far from universal. Many people simply lack any motivation to change when not confronted with shame.
      - zepto 6y ago
        This is probably because you were shamed for things that were actually harmless. There is definitely a problem with the level to which shame is used indiscriminately to control people. But no emotion is inherently destructive. We should feel shame at certain things. If you tripped an old lady and didn’t feel shame, I’d say you were a psychopath, or if you simply threatened to kill anyone who you didn’t like. It’s also notable that absence of shame is characteristic of psychopathy, and even Buddhist psychology states that an absence of shame is an impediment to enlightenment. I completely support the idea that excessive or inappropriate shame is a major part of many if not most psychological disorders. Nothing supports the idea that all shame is destructive. On the topic of obesity, I do agree that shame is unlikely to help. In fact I suspect that shame is more likely to be part of the cause.
pm90 6y ago
Body shaming is not a valid method of making people get in shape, so I don't think there's anything wrong in the acceptance of people with more mass. We do have other ways to encourage people to lose weight though, such as sugar taxes, regulating processed foods' contents, investing in making fresh produce widely available etc. which can make a difference.
- toomuchtodo 6y ago
  People will argue this infringes on their freedom to make unhealthy life choices. I agree, you cannot force someone to make healthy life choices, only use pricing signals to encourage it. Tax them more to recoup the costs, and let them make the choices they would like (unhealthy foods, smoking, etc). I also agree that more regulation is required (States in Mexico intend to ban kids from purchasing junk food because childhood obesity there is skyrocketing [1]). [1] https://www.npr.org/2020/09/14/912029399/we-had-to-take-action-states-in-mexico-move-to-ban-junk-food-sales-to-minors https://www.npr.org/2020/09/14/912029399/we-had-to-take-acti... (NPR: 'We Had To Take Action': States In Mexico Move To Ban Junk Food Sales To Minors)
  - outside1234 6y ago
    Or said another way, there should be a standard rate for health insurance, and an increasingly discount for folks as they come closer to an ideal BMI.
- swebs 6y ago
  It is a very effective method. It's common to do in Japan, and they have one of the lowest obesity rates of any first world country. No overbearing government regulations necessary.
  - pm90 6y ago
    Average Japanese diets are much healthier than American diets; there is less of a car culture, public transport is common. But do go on about fat shaming being effective.
DamnYuppie 6y ago
Yes, you are fat shaming if you mention they are unhealthy and overweight. The idea that you are in the wrong for pointing this out is mind-blowing to me. While it may not be an effective means of changing their behavior it is a valid means of framing conversations around what is desirable and healthy. If we continue to allow peoples feelings about how they feel override what we objectively know to be good we will be on the fast train to hell.
- shajznnckfke 6y ago
  I think in general it’s considered rude to mention that someone is stupid, unattractive, poor, etc. Overall, people are already suffering from low confidence due to these issues and pointing them out only hurts them. Unless someone is seeking out honest feedback in these areas, it’s probably better not to volunteer any. On the other hand, it’s fine to talk about how society has a problem with education, poverty, or obesity and suggest society-scale solutions.
- monkmartinez 6y ago
  Agreed... a few years ago, I was getting a bit plump in the mid-section. My wife's grandmother from Colombia strait up told me I was looking "gordo" (fat). I got on it immediately and shed the spare tire. I thanked her for being honest and open... I wish I could tell others the same. “Choose not to be harmed—and you won’t feel harmed. Don’t feel harmed—and you haven’t been.” ~ Marcus Aurelius
mc32 6y ago
I kind of understand the backlash against the skinny-chic look foisted upon people by the baddies in the fashion industry, but now there’s an equally bad movement which kind of says “it’s cool to be overweight, don’t sweat it, this is how we are”. Yes, true, for some people there is little recourse, their physiology is such, but a majority could become healthier with a better lifestyle choice.
- itsoktocry 6y ago
  >I kind of understand the backlash against skinny-chic foisted upon people by the baddies in the fashion industry This is a weird trope. Most models are selected to be slender so they can, basically, simulate a clothes rack. No curves to draw attention! I'm not sure the fashion industry is telling anyone this is ideal. I can't remember, in my lifetime, when skinny models were ever really looked at by society-at-large as the "right" body type. They were always seen as "skinny models". Of course there are people with all sorts of preferences, but the most celebrated models of my youth (say, Heidi Klum or Tara Banks) were relatively fit as opposed to withering. On the other hand, many people (both men and women) end up with eating disorders trying to reach this "ideal".
  - vmception 6y ago
    Everything you mentioned was accurate. But we do have to recognize the effects that are also had on people, your last sentence is a heavier weighting than your perception. People have not been capable of separating an industry ideal from a non-industry related attractiveness ideal. Individuals know what they like, visually and sexually. Individuals are also aware of what the seeming consensus of "should like" is, visually and sexually. Simple put, people know when other people are considered hot and what that looks like.
- tonyedgecombe 6y ago
  a majority could become healthier with a better lifestyle choice. When such a large portion of the population is overweight it tends to indicate a systemic problem rather than one of individual choice.
ashleyn 6y ago
Individuals have the right to choose obesity and pay their own costs related to it. This isn't "mob rule" because nobody is really forcing anyone else to be obese. There's no problem to solve other than being more cognizant of the costs obesity will impose on one as an individual.
- zionic 6y ago
  >and pay their own costs related to it. Now run the numbers again with socialized healthcare. When society's tax dollars are funding your triple bypass from your 30+ BMI it's absolutely societies business.
- i_haz_rabies 6y ago
  Society pays for it too. Less so than some countries given America's private healthcare system, but as an extreme example... what happens if America needs more soldiers? Overeating means more agriculture means more land used/more inputs required/more carbon burned. Illness and early deaths has an impact on productivity. No man is an island, everything you do has an impact on society.
RobLach 6y ago
A minor one, and misunderstanding of the argument. The "obese-normalization" you speak is about fat-shaming abolitionism, against discrimination in professional and social spaces because of body composition, not that such a body type is necessarily encouraged. Furthermore the categorization of "obese", and BMI in general, has a pile of research exposing all the caveats and encouraged more granular diagnoses around mass composition for humans. You can be categorized as obese and have perfectly fine physical function. For example, pretty much every football player is overweight, most are obese. BMI charts are only a cursory step towards a proper analysis. If you understand that obesity comes from a medical or mental condition, then a culture of fat-shaming is comparable to having a culture of shaming those suffering from PTSD or depression or birth abnormalities, et al. That sort of culture doesn't have many positive societal effects beyond pushing people into mental duress about things they are still trying to figure out how to manage. Any hyper-normalization of extreme obesity is a side effect of the propensity of such a shaming culture as it becomes more of a political statement than a medical one (or more fringe culture i.e kinks). Being against removing this discrimination from our culture only makes sense if you believe that an effective methodology for overcoming a health problem is by being abused by society into action conformity. Simply, if you're too fat you should be allowed to deal with that very personal issue on your own terms and not be ostracized from professional or social spaces. The main aspect is a demonization of fatty foods, propagandized heavily by the sugar and soft drink industry, which market realities have shifted food products to compensate for the lack of flavor and satiation from fat by loading them with sugar. This is all compounded by massive corn subsidies in the US making it extremely tempting to load up recipes with cheap, sweet, calorie dense, corn syrup. (some random chart after quick search about this https://imgur.com/nvWRyrh https://imgur.com/nvWRyrh)
johnkpaul 6y ago
As a lifelong morbidly obese person, and I admit that this is anecdata, this is categorically not true, for me. I feel no normalizations. I feel no mob, on my side. Rather, I feel a gigantic mob on the "just lose weight you fat person" side. I still have doctors that won't take any ailment seriously because their first response is "just lose weight you fat person". Everything in this HuffPo article rings completely true for me -https://highline.huffingtonpost.com/articles/en/everything-you-know-about-obesity-is-wrong/ https://highline.huffingtonpost.com/articles/en/everything-y...

throwaway4good 6y ago

What definition of obese is used here? 42% sounds like a lot.

cj 6y ago
Direct link to the report referenced in the press release: https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityReport_20.pdf https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityR... Page 8 defines "Overweight" as BMI 25+ and "Obesity" as 30+.
awat 6y ago
Likely BMI of 30+
save_ferris 6y ago
CDC defines obesity as having a Body Mass Index above 30[0]. Per their example, a 5'9 person weighing 203 lbs or more would be considered obese. 0: https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/adult/defining.html https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/adult/defining.html
- throwaway4good 6y ago
  For the rest of us: If you are 1.70 m and have a BMI of above 30, your weight is more than 86.7 kg. For obese people who are 1.80 m, your weight is more than 97.2 kg. 42% is an absolutely insane number of obese people - what on earth is going on?
- elindbe2 6y ago
  And before anyone complains about BMI, it's useful as a population-level measurement: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5896802/#:~:text=The%20analysis%20has%20indicated%20that,known%20confounders%20were%20controlled%20for https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5896802/#:~:tex....
  - Spivak 6y ago
    Yeah, it's not a particularly good statistic about an individual person's body except as a suuuuuper rough guideline but if everyone's BMI goes up something's happening.

throw1234651234 6y ago

This interesting to me, because I feel like more Americans are working out than ever, but maybe it's just my environment. Naturally, working out usually has second-order effects like watching nutrition.

goalieca 6y ago
I must work out because I have a desk job. There are many other kinds of jobs that aren't desk jobs where you don't get enough exercise.
- tonyedgecombe 6y ago
  Jobs that require physical exertion have been disappearing. Even the guys putting in a new water main outside my house didn't seem to be doing much physical work. I didn't see them swinging a pick or using a shovel.
chrisseaton 6y ago
I guess it's bifurcated, like too many other things in our society are becoming. People are either doing no physical activity, or they're doing triathlons. People either have multiple degrees, or they didn't finish high-school. People either buy a house in their early 20s, or they're renting all their lives. People either read a book a week, or they never read a book at all. (Obviously there are practically many people in between these extremes and people are free to do whatever they want and many people are happy and successful on both sides of each of these spectrums.)
- thinkharderdev 6y ago
  Exactly this. It is astounding how extreme the difference can be sometimes. You'll be in a major coastal city and it seems like everyone is relatively trim, works out religiously and wouldn't touch a fast food hamburger. Then you go to the midwest or the south and it seems like everyone you see is overweight/obese, subsists on a diet of fast food and smokes cigarettes. I'm shocked just noticing the number of people walking around smoking cigarettes when I get out of East Coast metro areas. I literally don't know anyone where I live who smoked anymore and rarely see anyone smoking on the street.

jononomo 6y ago

There is a simple solution to the obesity epidemic: levy a heavy tax on any kind of sugar or grain that enters the food system and use the money to subsidize red meat. A carnivore diet that avoids plant-based foods altogether is ideal for human health and is almost impossible to remain obese on. For faster or more thorough weight loss cut out dairy as well. Find more information at https://MeatRx.com/ https://MeatRx.com/

cj 6y ago
> A diet that avoids plant-based foods altogether is ideal for human health > MeatRx.com Those are some bold claims. Curious if there's any actual science supporting not eating plants.
- jononomo 6y ago
  Yes, there is a ton of science supporting not eating plants. In fact, entire human societies have survived for generations on entirely animal-based diets but a human being cannot even survive on a diet devoid of animal-based foods (vegans have to supplement or else they die). There is a list of books here: https://meatrx.com/resources/books/ https://meatrx.com/resources/books/ I personally find the writing and lectures of Nina Teicholz to be especially compelling.
bird_monster 6y ago
Can you provided any peer reviewed studies on the benefits of the carnivore diet?
- jononomo 6y ago
  Find resources here: https://meatrx.com/category/research-articles/ https://meatrx.com/category/research-articles/ https://meatrx.com/resources/books/ https://meatrx.com/resources/books/
  - bird_monster 6y ago
    See but those articles are about ketogenic diets, not "Carnivore". Ketogenic diets don't have to be meat centric.

vonwoodson 6y ago

Relevant The Onion clip: https://youtu.be/hRoSJ1y1FSY https://youtu.be/hRoSJ1y1FSY

tribune 6y ago

Uh... Mississippi has the highest adult obesity rate in the country at 40.8 percent and Colorado has the lowest at 23.8 percent. Seems like this must be different (or old) data by State?

qntty 6y ago
It seems that both numbers are from the same report. Here's an excerpt from the report: > How is it that only 12 states have adult obesity rates exceeding 35 percent, yet the national obesity rate is 42.4 percent? It’s because state obesity rates are from the BRFSS, which collects self-reported height and weight. Research has demonstrated that people tend to overestimate their height and underestimate their weight. In fact, one study found that, due to this phenomenon, the BRFSS may underestimate obesity rates by nearly 10 percent. NHANES, from which the national obesity rate is derived, calculates its obesity rate based on measurements obtained at respondents’ physical examinations. Accordingly, the higher rates found by NHANES are a more accurate reflection of obesity in the United States. https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityReport_20.pdf https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityR...

partiallypro 6y ago

I am 6' and weight 190-195, I was 175 before the pandemic. I am considered overweight now, though I don't think I quite meet the obesity requirements. I think the pandemic and its stress toll has given people something the equivalent of the "Freshman 10."

onedognight 6y ago
I call it the “COVID 19”.
- SketchySeaBeast 6y ago
  You don't find it causes alarm when you say "since March I've been suffering from COVID 19" while speaking moistly?
- dragontamer 6y ago
  I've called it the "Covid15". And when people wonder what I mean: I tell them "Its like the Freshmen 15, except its the weight gained from COVID19 lockdowns". Although more seriously, when I gained ~5 lbs, I started to eat healthier, and shed that weight back down to my normal <180lbs. For 5'10, I'm still slightly overweight by BMI (and I'm not very lean or strong, so I doubt its muscle).
neverminder 6y ago
This. Before the whole corona hysteria I was well on track of getting into the best shape in my life having lost 18 kg in 4 months and reduced body fat by 10%. The whole lockdown reversed all that and then some. They took away my routine, my gym, even my food temporarily and put me under house arrest.
- low_common 6y ago
  There's always the Great Outdoors. Go on a run, a bike ride, calisthenics.
  - 6y ago

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

klmadfejno 6y ago

The part about how food insecurity causes obesity is hard to understand. Its well documented that poverty leads to unhealthier food. Its obvious that poverty leads to food insecurity. Still, wrapping ones head around how not having enough to eat leads one to be obese is tough to grok. Really emphasizes just how bad cheap is for you. The part about how 12 states have averages above 35%... didn't make sense to me if the national average is 42. Maybe I missed something.

jononomo 6y ago
Rice, beans, sugar, and bread are cheap foods -- if you are trapped in poverty then you will be eating a carb-heavy mostly plant-based diet and you'll probably also be consuming a lot of sugar. Carbohydrates are what lead to obesity. Cutting carbs out entirely is a healthy way to cut weight, but that would mean eating only meat, which is comparatively expensive. This is why poor people are fat.
- steelbrain 6y ago
  I don’t understand. There are entire nations (eg. Pakistan, Bangladesh) where meat is a delicacy and Rice and Wheat is what feeds the masses, the obesity ratio I’ve personally observed is nowhere near the US.
  - jononomo 6y ago
    India and Pakistan suffer from the lowest life expectancy in the world and diabetes is exploding. They do in fact have a fair amount of obesity, but the rate is not as high as it is in the west because it is overpowered by poverty, so they are on a low-calorie version of a poor diet. There is also much more manual labor happening in India, which keeps the weight off.
    - angio 6y ago
      There are rich countries like Japan and South Korea that consume between 8 to 12 times [0] as much rice as the US and have much lower obesity rates (almost a tenth) [1]. [0] https://www.helgilibrary.com/indicators/rice-consumption-per-capita/ https://www.helgilibrary.com/indicators/rice-consumption-per... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_r...

tabtab 6y ago

I have three major comments about this. First, most countries use a lot of public transportation, which often requires walking roughly a mile to and again from work and commerce centers. This "forces" them to get regular exercise. Our car culture cuts into that. Second, we need better food labeling. "Serving size" is too arbitrary. Instead use ratios: ratio per N calories, and ratio per weight. That way we can easily compare across product types. It can be worded as "X units per N calories" and "X units per gram", or the like. The units would be standardized. Third, include percent of whole-ness of grain. It's hard to know otherwise. We need to eat more whole grains, but 100% is not very tasty to most such that a mix is decent compromise. But we need better numbers to know the mix percent.

angio 6y ago
> Second, we need better food labeling. "Server size" is too arbitrary. Instead use ratios: ratio per N calories, and ratio per weight. That way we can easily compare across product types. It can be worded as "X units per N calories" and "X units per gram", or the like. In Europe labels need to have nutritional information using standard units (e.g. 100g or 100ml). It seems very odd they don't require that in the US too.
- tabtab 6y ago
  That's part of the reason why Europeans are trimmer and healthier.
  - angio 6y ago
    I'm not sure that's the reason, but for sure things like standard nutritional labels and semaphores on labels help making healthy choices.
- XCSme 6y ago
  Wait, in the US it doesn't say kcals/100g on the package?
thinkharderdev 6y ago

nprz 6y ago

I'd be interested to see the rates segmented by generation. Everyone in my generation (millennial) seems to be very sugar adverse, has that done anything to lower obesity rates?

lordnacho 6y ago

Ask any traveller to the US what their trip was like, and at some point they will mention how portion sizes are gigantic. I have to agree, every time I've eaten there it's been way bigger than both what's good for me and what I was happy to get get for the price. This doesn't seem to stop at restaurants, I went to a supermarket and you can mega sized versions of just about anything. Even the strawberries seem to be bigger. You can get buckets of jelly babies. The ready made pizzas seem to be bigger. Just everything. At the same time, most travellers will tell you the food was delicious. This may be good for keeping customers happy, but it's going to tend to mean things that our hunter gatherer ancestors wanted to stock up on, in quantities they would rarely find. Finally, sweets and junk food in America are like crack. I don't know what they put in it, but just about everything in that category is more enticing than the same categories in Europe. My brother had a six pack before he moved there. Now he has a beer belly.

zeta0134 6y ago
As a US native, this a thousand times. When I started doing meal prep for an exercise program, and really loading things up with protein, I was surprised at just how little I needed to eat throughout the day to feel satiated and energized, even while beginning a workout routine that was quite tough for a beginner. Sometimes I still like to eat out, but it's a rare treat, I can't do it every day like I used to when I was younger. Even then, I'll usually look for the junior portions, which are plenty filling.
- EForEndeavour 6y ago
  Before COVID, I was visiting the US 2-3 times a year, but only the northeast region. Are massive portion sizes more common in certain parts of the country? My naive impression is that portion sizes are bigger in the south, but I have no idea where I absorbed this belief from.
  - zeta0134 6y ago
    I've lived in South Texas, Washington State, Missouri, and Tennessee, and I don't really recall a difference in overall portion size at restaurants, fast food locations, or typical diners. A lot of the popular chains have standardized their menus, so you can usually pull up the online menu and check out the nutritional data. For international chains, it might be interesting to compare overall calorie counts if the region specific menus are available?

yodsanklai 6y ago

No wonder, it's incredibly hard to eat healthy food in some parts of the US. And many people seem to have no idea that their diet is terrible. I'm not even sure they link their obesity to their diet.

WalterSear 6y ago
Food deserts are a myth. Low SES people tend to eat lower quality foods for reasons other than availability.
- yodsanklai 6y ago
  > Food deserts are a myth It's anecdotal evidence, but as a European frequently travelling in the US, I do have a hard time finding what I consider healthy food. I usually skip one meal each day and still put on weight. I suppose that if you're really careful and cook your own food at each meal you can get by, but all the incentives are there for you to eat a lot, and a lot of junk food.
  - ghaff 6y ago
    "Food desert" mostly doesn't refer to eating out but being able to buy unprocessed food/produce/etc. which is hard to do if your only option is a convenience store. But there mostly are supermarkets available if not as plentiful or as good in low income areas. I travel a lot in the US too though (as an American) and I've rarely (in cities) had much of an issue finding restaurants I consider good--though I'm not sure most meals I get on the road really qualify as "healthy" day after day either in the US or most other places. And, certainly, if you're looking for something quick and easy, that's probably going to be some fast food franchise. I almost universally avoid but that assumes putting some time and effort into finding better places when on the road.

mensetmanusman 6y ago

Covid has been particularly devastating for the obese and diabetic.

hi41 6y ago

Is there truth to the fact that there are many body types and that each body knows what the correct weight should be and they reach that weight by consuming what is necessary? For example, when I diet and reduce weight, I gain it back in few months. May be I am meant to be at the higher weight. Many say that greedy corporations have set up the numbers for diabetes and it’s okay to have higher A1C.

cercatrova 6y ago
Not really. You're probably gaining it back because you (presumably) think a diet is a one time thing. It's not, it must be maintained indefinitely, since it's just calories in vs calories out.
TACIXAT 6y ago
Nope. My understanding is that fat cells do not go away initially but just shrink. That is why it is easy to gain back recently lost weight. It takes a sustained effort to lose and keep off weight. You're of course free to do what you want, but being overweight leads to health problems that you wouldn't otherwise have.

Ccecil 6y ago

I live in the US. In passing I have noticed quite a bit about our culture which lends to being overweight. 1) Structure: it is way too easy to get food that is horrible for you. Not only that but in a way which you can eat it in the car on the way when you are only "slightly hungry". 2) Commercial interests: Go into a Walmart and pay attention to the organization. Everything which makes you fatter (and therefore consume more) is directly in front of you and on the end of the aisles. You need to search for the healthy food, and for some reason in my experience their limited produce selection seems to spoil faster than other stores (how can my bananas be green and rotten at the same time?) 3) Rewarding excess: It is in vogue to be wasteful. Being able to live in excess and be wasteful is very popular in our culture this is not limited to food, just look at the flatscreen TV count in houses, large inefficient cars and houses, etc. 4) Exercise as an excuse: "I have a gym membership, I went this week...so I can eat an extra 3000 calories today" That coupled with the lack of walking from the car culture and you have a very low rate of calorie burn vs intake. 5) Sugar substitutes: Why does everything need sweetener? Does this sweetener have effects we don't know about? There have been studies that say it also causes obesity and diabetic issues. It is very common for people in this country to drink several "diet" sodas a day and using that as reason to allow themselves to have extra dessert/sweet things. Just my observations, also, I fall into the overweight category even knowing these things and making efforts to not continue the path which I was brought up on. If I had not made an effort to change diet and exercise...who knows how big I would be.

thinkharderdev 6y ago
3 really resonates. People tend to dramatically overestimate the number of calories they burn when exercising. You have to work really, really hard to burn more than 500 calories in an hour workout and most people probably burn more like 100-200 calories when they exercise. Then they go home and drink a 16oz double IPA that is 400 calories by itself.
skim_milk 6y ago
I agree but I wonder if there's more points? 6) Emotional support. I see less and less large people out and about and more mostly attractive people hanging outside over the past decade. I have to wonder if this is in part due to social media: a) Less attractive people feel like they deserve less social status (not sure if this is a USA-specific cultural thing but it's definitely a thing here) b) Because of point a, spend more online because of the heightened feeling of not deserving of making friends c) Social media is absolute junk, the more time you spend on it naturally the worse you're going to feel d) Feedback loop of spending more time online, feeling bad, spending less time outside with physical contact causing worse physical health, causing even more time spent online, repeat for decades More attractive people are naturally going to feel more deserving of love and emotional support and more likely to seek it out because of our culture, despite really we should all feel equally deserving of love and support. But this feedback mechanism I think exists breaks that feeling of deserving mental/physical fitness which is causes awful mental/physical fitness.

jefftk 6y ago

Full report: https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityReport_20.pdf https://www.tfah.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/TFAHObesityR... p26 answers a question I had: > WHY ARE REPORTED NATIONAL OBESITY RATES HIGHER THAN STATE-BY-STATE RATES? How is it that only 12 states have adult obesity rates exceeding 35 percent, yet the national obesity rate is 42.4 percent? It’s because state obesity rates are from the BRFSS, which collects self-reported height and weight. Research has demonstrated that people tend to overestimate their height and underestimate their weight. In fact, one study found that, due to this phenomenon, the BRFSS may underestimate obesity rates by nearly 10 percent.256 NHANES, from which the national obesity rate is derived, calculates its obesity rate based on measurements obtained at respondents’ physical examinations. Accordingly, the higher rates found by NHANES are a more accurate reflection of obesity in the United States.257

every 6y ago

The ability to quickly and efficiently store fat would definitely have been a positive trait under multigenerational "feast or famine" conditions. But not so much for our relatively recent "perpetual feast" largess...

mcfunk 6y ago

I find it interesting that I scrolled through this whole thread and there has been little if any discussion of excessively poor health care in the United States. Also, things like how when people develop type 2 diabetes, the solution is often getting them on expensive insulin that causes weight gain, causing more insulin need, causing more weight gain etc. Look up Dr. Jason Fung for detailed information on how the typical approach to diabetes management actually just makes it, and weight gain, much worse. Speaking of healthcare in the US, even for those who can afford a doctor -- I personally have gone to the doctor when I had unexplained blood sugar drops and weight gain despite being active (training for a century ride at the time), counting calories and eating the oft-touted '5 small meals a day'. They scoffed at me, told me they 'couldn't give me a pill to make me thin,' told me my habits were fine and I should keep doing what I was doing. As it turned out, and I learned through my own research, my frequent eating was causing me to become insulin resistant, and once I moved to 2 meals a day and a longer fast overnight my issues reversed. From talking to others there was nothing unusual about my experience with the doctor -- in the US obesity is considered a moral issue and not a health one, and our doctors have very little to offer in terms of advice based on the underlying mechanisms of obesity or taking patients seriously when they are concerned about weight gain. We have all sorts of other things contributing to causing metabolic issues in the first place -- our poorly regulated food and ag industries have been pushing completely warped ideas of what makes a 'balanced' diet for decades -- e.g. milk and empty carbohydrates are 'a balanced breakfast,' the low fat fiasco where processed foods with reduced fat and increased sugars were touted as 'healthier', and for decades kids were taught in school the 'food pyramid' which was a suggested diet written entirely by agriculture lobbyists rather than the available science on nutrition. We have an entire populace who, if they know anything about what is actually healthy for humans, came by it through having to seek it out themselves and wade through a lot of junk science sponsored by various corporate interests. Also we are stuck in cycles of constant work, presenteeism and long hours in sedentary jobs, no sick leave, little if any vacation, etc. etc. where Europe etc. have much better work practices, not to mention less car culture, walk and bikeable and transitable cities, all things that are aggressively opposed in the US. The problem is fueled by a number of systems. Imagining it to be a matter of simple will power or portion size is inane.

Simulacra 6y ago

From 2019’data. That’s an important distinction.

mncharity 6y ago

For anyone else who doesn't keep up with this, it seems at least some of Chile's efforts[1] have survived the years US food industry lobbying, lawsuits, and advertising, and have had some effect.[2] Brasil[3]... perhaps has more pressing problems now. Global push-back on Investor-State Dispute Settlement seems to have throttled it's growth, and I don't quickly find any cases on food-health regulation (though there's little transparency on threats of cases). [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/07/health/obesity-chile-sugar-regulations.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/07/health/obesity-chile-suga... [2] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/11/chiles-drastic-anti-obesity-measures-cut-sugary-drink-sales-by-23 https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/11/chiles-drastic... paper: https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/journal.pmed.1003015 https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/jo... [3] https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/09/16/health/brazil-obesity-nestle.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/09/16/health/brazil...

habanany 6y ago

Is it increases in obesity a Coronavirus lockdown fault ?