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What if consciousness requires an active synapse loop to be maintained, kind of like a magnetic field, with little hysteresis eddies etc, but one that if it los

What if consciousness requires an active synapse loop to be maintained, kind of like a magnetic field, with little hysteresis eddies etc, but one that if it loses all power, it disappears forever?

ogennadi 6y ago
Hi @russfink. That can't be the case since, as mentioned in the debate, there are medical procedures [1] where a person's neural activity ceases and the patients recover their (long-term) memories [1] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0013469489900333 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/001346...
- mlyle 6y ago
  This doesn't fix the philosophical issue, though. Is it the same person? Or did that thread of individual conscious perception disappear forever and was replaced by someone "new" who acts the same? In the end, this is a philosophical discussion because consciousness is not something we can observe in a way to test and falsify hypotheses.
- ralfd 6y ago
  Hm. The cessation of electrical activity is just that which is measured on scalp EEG; ie, we can only really be certain that the most superficial layers of cortex aren't firing and what we are measuring.
  - porejide 6y ago
    Very fair point. There are other examples that go beyond DHCA, though, and point clearly in the same direction. One example is that sometimes people suffer cardiac arrests and lose consciousness for minutes to hours 10.1016/j.resuscitation.2014.06.015. Coordinated electrical activity stops after a few minutes following cardiac arrest, but people can (rarely) be revived with their apparent memories and personality intact.
Baeocystin 6y ago
You should read Ted Chiang's Exhalation. Full text is here: https://www.lightspeedmagazine.com/fiction/exhalation/ https://www.lightspeedmagazine.com/fiction/exhalation/ It's a short story. A worthy, on-topic read, I promise!
the8472 6y ago
ECT would be 100% deadly if that were the case.

What if consciousness requires an active synapse loop to be maintained, kind of like a magnetic field, with little hysteresis eddies etc, but one that if it loses all power, it disappears forever?

ogennadi 6y ago

Hi @russfink. That can't be the case since, as mentioned in the debate, there are medical procedures [1] where a person's neural activity ceases and the patients recover their (long-term) memories [1] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0013469489900333 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/001346...

mlyle 6y ago
This doesn't fix the philosophical issue, though. Is it the same person? Or did that thread of individual conscious perception disappear forever and was replaced by someone "new" who acts the same? In the end, this is a philosophical discussion because consciousness is not something we can observe in a way to test and falsify hypotheses.
ralfd 6y ago
Hm. The cessation of electrical activity is just that which is measured on scalp EEG; ie, we can only really be certain that the most superficial layers of cortex aren't firing and what we are measuring.
- porejide 6y ago
  Very fair point. There are other examples that go beyond DHCA, though, and point clearly in the same direction. One example is that sometimes people suffer cardiac arrests and lose consciousness for minutes to hours 10.1016/j.resuscitation.2014.06.015. Coordinated electrical activity stops after a few minutes following cardiac arrest, but people can (rarely) be revived with their apparent memories and personality intact.

Baeocystin 6y ago

You should read Ted Chiang's Exhalation. Full text is here: https://www.lightspeedmagazine.com/fiction/exhalation/ https://www.lightspeedmagazine.com/fiction/exhalation/ It's a short story. A worthy, on-topic read, I promise!

the8472 6y ago

ECT would be 100% deadly if that were the case.