7 ms·

> many companies have already started building core infra in Rust. Facebook with Mononoke, Libra, Eden, and Hack. Dropbox for storage servers. Mozilla with Fire

> many companies have already started building core infra in Rust. Facebook with Mononoke, Libra, Eden, and Hack. Dropbox for storage servers. Mozilla with Firefox. You missed Amazon, Google, the Linux kernel, Microsoft, Apple, ... which big company isn't using Rust at this point in production? The main difference between Rust as Haskell is that, while I really like doing competitive programming with Haskell, what I really like doing with Rust is shipping products to customers. In my free time, I don't use Rust, right now I mostly use Idris2. But the main reason I can do that is that since we moved from C++ to Rust, nobody really call us on the weekend anymore to fix something that can't wait till monday.

mkl 6y ago
The Linux kernel isn't using Rust in production. They've said they're open to the possibility, but that isn't even a start.
- fluffything 6y ago
  All our linux kernel module and driver development have been using Rust for a while. I've written a Linux kernel module in Rust that we use in production, and so have many others. What the Linux kernel is discussing is how to integrate these kernel modules and drivers into the Linux tree. They are not discussing whether this is worth doing, but how to do it. Linux is quite stable if you stick to the right APIs, and maintaining these out-of-tree is not too bad, but the current situation is not sustainable in general. For us it doesn't matter, because our code is not open source. But it matters to quite a bit of people.
  - mkl 6y ago
    Sure, but out-of-tree third party modules and drivers is not what the comment I replied to said.
joshxyz 6y ago
> nobody really call us on the weekend anymore to fix something that can't wait till monday I'm freakin sold, gonna learn rust now.
darthrupert 6y ago
Did you threaten them that you would change languages again if they called you over the weekend?
pjmlp 6y ago
I never get called to fix stuff on weekend unless I get a nice pay check for my weekend going bust, no matter what language we get to use, so is the beauty of union agreements affecting everyone across the company.
- Aeolun 6y ago
  That’s nice of course, but I’d argue that not getting called at all is still better.
username90 6y ago
> Google, ... which big company isn't using Rust at this point in production? I worked with C++ at Google recently. I didn't see any push to switch to rust and I don't know of a single production server running rust binaries. Edit: The best evidence that Google doesn't use rust in production is that they don't have an official protocol buffer implementation in Rust. Until they have that nobody will use it for servers at Google. https://developers.google.com/protocol-buffers/docs/cpptutorial https://developers.google.com/protocol-buffers/docs/cpptutor...
- steveklabnik 6y ago
  You're assuming a specific kind of deployment. Google does more than servers. Currently, the big known projects are: 1. in ChromeOS, via crosvm (they collaborate with rust-vmm with Amazon, who originally forked crosvm for Firecracker) 2. in Fuchsia, whose employees also have helped significantly with the language and implementation on company time 3. Smaller projects, like sponsoring some font tooling work Additionally, the Chrome team has a branch with Rust code in it and they're evaluating it currently. We'll see.
  - nsonha 6y ago
    why is there no source? What is the point of comments like this if it doesn't have source?
    - steveklabnik 6y ago
      It should be easy enough to google. So I didn't bother. * ChromeOS: https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/platform/crosvm/ https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/platform/crosvm... * Fuchisa: https://fuchsia.googlesource.com/fuchsia/+/refs/heads/master/docs/development/languages/rust/ https://fuchsia.googlesource.com/fuchsia/+/refs/heads/master... (I picked this bit sort of at random because it talks about a bunch of stuff) * https://raphlinus.github.io/rust/druid/2019/10/31/rust-2020.html https://raphlinus.github.io/rust/druid/2019/10/31/rust-2020.... ("Runebender is generously supported financially by Google Fonts, for which I am very grateful, as it makes it more of a serious and professional project.") * Chrome: https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/q/project:experimental/chromium/src+branch:refs/wip/rust-experimental-branch https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/q/project:experimen... This is as direct of links as I can give, but there's a ton of commentary around all of these topics; they've been covered on HN before, even.
AshamedCaptain 6y ago
> You missed Amazon, Google, the Linux kernel, Microsoft, Apple, ... which big company isn't using Rust at this point in production? You could have said the same thing about Haskell (hell, you could even say MS invented Haskell, or at least MS research people, fwiw) . It's absolute meaningless. Big companies have many projects and in random languages.

mkl 6y ago

The Linux kernel isn't using Rust in production. They've said they're open to the possibility, but that isn't even a start.

fluffything 6y ago
All our linux kernel module and driver development have been using Rust for a while. I've written a Linux kernel module in Rust that we use in production, and so have many others. What the Linux kernel is discussing is how to integrate these kernel modules and drivers into the Linux tree. They are not discussing whether this is worth doing, but how to do it. Linux is quite stable if you stick to the right APIs, and maintaining these out-of-tree is not too bad, but the current situation is not sustainable in general. For us it doesn't matter, because our code is not open source. But it matters to quite a bit of people.
- mkl 6y ago
  Sure, but out-of-tree third party modules and drivers is not what the comment I replied to said.

joshxyz 6y ago

> nobody really call us on the weekend anymore to fix something that can't wait till monday I'm freakin sold, gonna learn rust now.

darthrupert 6y ago

Did you threaten them that you would change languages again if they called you over the weekend?

pjmlp 6y ago

I never get called to fix stuff on weekend unless I get a nice pay check for my weekend going bust, no matter what language we get to use, so is the beauty of union agreements affecting everyone across the company.

Aeolun 6y ago
That’s nice of course, but I’d argue that not getting called at all is still better.

username90 6y ago

> Google, ... which big company isn't using Rust at this point in production? I worked with C++ at Google recently. I didn't see any push to switch to rust and I don't know of a single production server running rust binaries. Edit: The best evidence that Google doesn't use rust in production is that they don't have an official protocol buffer implementation in Rust. Until they have that nobody will use it for servers at Google. https://developers.google.com/protocol-buffers/docs/cpptutorial https://developers.google.com/protocol-buffers/docs/cpptutor...

steveklabnik 6y ago
You're assuming a specific kind of deployment. Google does more than servers. Currently, the big known projects are: 1. in ChromeOS, via crosvm (they collaborate with rust-vmm with Amazon, who originally forked crosvm for Firecracker) 2. in Fuchsia, whose employees also have helped significantly with the language and implementation on company time 3. Smaller projects, like sponsoring some font tooling work Additionally, the Chrome team has a branch with Rust code in it and they're evaluating it currently. We'll see.
- nsonha 6y ago
  why is there no source? What is the point of comments like this if it doesn't have source?
  - steveklabnik 6y ago
    It should be easy enough to google. So I didn't bother. * ChromeOS: https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/platform/crosvm/ https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/platform/crosvm... * Fuchisa: https://fuchsia.googlesource.com/fuchsia/+/refs/heads/master/docs/development/languages/rust/ https://fuchsia.googlesource.com/fuchsia/+/refs/heads/master... (I picked this bit sort of at random because it talks about a bunch of stuff) * https://raphlinus.github.io/rust/druid/2019/10/31/rust-2020.html https://raphlinus.github.io/rust/druid/2019/10/31/rust-2020.... ("Runebender is generously supported financially by Google Fonts, for which I am very grateful, as it makes it more of a serious and professional project.") * Chrome: https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/q/project:experimental/chromium/src+branch:refs/wip/rust-experimental-branch https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/q/project:experimen... This is as direct of links as I can give, but there's a ton of commentary around all of these topics; they've been covered on HN before, even.

AshamedCaptain 6y ago

> You missed Amazon, Google, the Linux kernel, Microsoft, Apple, ... which big company isn't using Rust at this point in production? You could have said the same thing about Haskell (hell, you could even say MS invented Haskell, or at least MS research people, fwiw) . It's absolute meaningless. Big companies have many projects and in random languages.