4 ms·

Have you tried buying a game from Epic on Windows? The "Epic Client" asks you for payment details, collects all kinds of private information and doesn't let yo

by isodev 6y ago

Have you tried buying a game from Epic on Windows? The "Epic Client" asks you for payment details, collects all kinds of private information and doesn't let you do anything unless it's up to date and connected to the internet. (DRM hello?) Then you go to the Windows Store to buy that candy crush ad that's been sitting in your Start Menu for no reason and oh surprise, they are asking for payment details again! Doesn't sound like a win for consumers to me.

izacus 6y ago
Note how you can easily just go to another provider (Steam, GoG) to buy the same content. Something you are forever and ever forbidden from doing if Apples data collection and terms bother you.
- blibble 6y ago
  for a lot of recent releases you can't, because epic have bought exclusivity they're complaining about monopolies, while attempting to create them
  - nightski 6y ago
    It's not the same situation. I don't like exclusives either, but you still have the option to install games from other stores or publishers on your PC. The Apple situation is far, far worse.
  - colinmhayes 6y ago
    I don't think "epic bought exclusivity" is quite right. Epic store pays a larger percent of the purchase to developers than any other store. Developers really want you to buy their game on the epic store. That's the real reason epic exclusives exist, developers don't want steam taking their money. Epic gives them an advance as an excuse, but developers would not agree if they didn't want epic store to gain market share.
- input_sh 6y ago
  Epic purchases exclusivity whenever it can. Some games were kickstarted with the promise of being available on Steam until Epic gave them a sum of money to make them an Epic exclusive, screwing over their backers in the process. In some of those cases, Epic funded refunds to the backers, in others it didn't. In plenty of cases this exclusivity also shut down cross platform support of the games. Fundraisers planned macOS and Linux versions of the games, but when Epic purchased exclusive rights they were effectively made Windows exclusives as well (Epic's store is only available on Windows).
  - nightski 6y ago
    And yet the vast majority of games (probably over 99%, but that is a guesstimmate) are not exclusive to one store on the PC. We have so many options on PC that the few exclusives can be entirely ignored.
VHRanger 6y ago
Competition in platforms forces platforms to extract less value. Steam has been taking huge cuts from developers. Steam also killed discoverability. Game devs almost gave up on PC because steam killed the platform. Check out GDC talks on the "indiepocalypse". Yes, Steam has a lot of nice QoL features on their 20 year old platform that 2 year old platforms don't have. But new platforms force them to, you know, compete instead of extract value from the ecosystem. The consumer benefit is in terms of games that wouldn't have existed otherwise because they're economically viable now.
- mehlmao 6y ago
  The indiepocalypse happened because Valve made it easier to publish on Steam. In 2009, 343 games were published on Steam. In 2010, 308 games. In 2011, 300 games. In 2012, 377 games. Valve introduced Greenlight, allowing developers to create a page for their game and selling those that gathered the most interest. In 2013, 511 games. Valve expanded Greenlight, lowering the threshold to enter the platform In 2014, 1641 games. In 2015, 2732 games. In 2016, 4489 games. In 2017, 6508 games. Valve introduced Steam Direct, allowing anyone to sell their game once they complete the paperwork. In 2018, 8237 games. In 2019, 7950 games. When Valve was the gatekeeper, only a lucky few indie developers made it onto the platform. However, with less than 1 game being released per day, there was plenty of space for these new games on the front page. With over 21 games released per day, being available on Steam is no longer a competitive advantage. Valve "killed discoverability" in favor of availability. Epic's store has advantages such as a lower cut, subsidized by Fortnite money. It also has disadvantages (not available in many countries, missing features, reviews, and social functionality). There is definitely a place for a smaller, curated store, where only one or two games are put out per day, which is what Epic is aiming for.
madeofpalk 6y ago
> Have you tried buying a game from Epic on Windows? > The "Epic Client" asks you for payment details I do not find it surprising that a store asks for payment details when I purchase an item.
gruez 6y ago
>The "Epic Client" asks you for payment details This is sarcasm, right? How can you buy stuff without payment details? >collects all kinds of private information Like what? Moreover, does steam (or other digital storefronts) not collect the same information? > doesn't let you do anything unless it's up to date and connected to the internet. (DRM hello?) You clearly missed all the "steam updating" memes from the early/mid 2000s.

by isodev 6y ago

izacus 6y ago

Note how you can easily just go to another provider (Steam, GoG) to buy the same content. Something you are forever and ever forbidden from doing if Apples data collection and terms bother you.

blibble 6y ago
for a lot of recent releases you can't, because epic have bought exclusivity they're complaining about monopolies, while attempting to create them
- nightski 6y ago
  It's not the same situation. I don't like exclusives either, but you still have the option to install games from other stores or publishers on your PC. The Apple situation is far, far worse.
- colinmhayes 6y ago
  I don't think "epic bought exclusivity" is quite right. Epic store pays a larger percent of the purchase to developers than any other store. Developers really want you to buy their game on the epic store. That's the real reason epic exclusives exist, developers don't want steam taking their money. Epic gives them an advance as an excuse, but developers would not agree if they didn't want epic store to gain market share.
input_sh 6y ago
Epic purchases exclusivity whenever it can. Some games were kickstarted with the promise of being available on Steam until Epic gave them a sum of money to make them an Epic exclusive, screwing over their backers in the process. In some of those cases, Epic funded refunds to the backers, in others it didn't. In plenty of cases this exclusivity also shut down cross platform support of the games. Fundraisers planned macOS and Linux versions of the games, but when Epic purchased exclusive rights they were effectively made Windows exclusives as well (Epic's store is only available on Windows).
- nightski 6y ago
  And yet the vast majority of games (probably over 99%, but that is a guesstimmate) are not exclusive to one store on the PC. We have so many options on PC that the few exclusives can be entirely ignored.

VHRanger 6y ago

Competition in platforms forces platforms to extract less value. Steam has been taking huge cuts from developers. Steam also killed discoverability. Game devs almost gave up on PC because steam killed the platform. Check out GDC talks on the "indiepocalypse". Yes, Steam has a lot of nice QoL features on their 20 year old platform that 2 year old platforms don't have. But new platforms force them to, you know, compete instead of extract value from the ecosystem. The consumer benefit is in terms of games that wouldn't have existed otherwise because they're economically viable now.

mehlmao 6y ago
The indiepocalypse happened because Valve made it easier to publish on Steam. In 2009, 343 games were published on Steam. In 2010, 308 games. In 2011, 300 games. In 2012, 377 games. Valve introduced Greenlight, allowing developers to create a page for their game and selling those that gathered the most interest. In 2013, 511 games. Valve expanded Greenlight, lowering the threshold to enter the platform In 2014, 1641 games. In 2015, 2732 games. In 2016, 4489 games. In 2017, 6508 games. Valve introduced Steam Direct, allowing anyone to sell their game once they complete the paperwork. In 2018, 8237 games. In 2019, 7950 games. When Valve was the gatekeeper, only a lucky few indie developers made it onto the platform. However, with less than 1 game being released per day, there was plenty of space for these new games on the front page. With over 21 games released per day, being available on Steam is no longer a competitive advantage. Valve "killed discoverability" in favor of availability. Epic's store has advantages such as a lower cut, subsidized by Fortnite money. It also has disadvantages (not available in many countries, missing features, reviews, and social functionality). There is definitely a place for a smaller, curated store, where only one or two games are put out per day, which is what Epic is aiming for.

madeofpalk 6y ago

> Have you tried buying a game from Epic on Windows? > The "Epic Client" asks you for payment details I do not find it surprising that a store asks for payment details when I purchase an item.

gruez 6y ago

>The "Epic Client" asks you for payment details This is sarcasm, right? How can you buy stuff without payment details? >collects all kinds of private information Like what? Moreover, does steam (or other digital storefronts) not collect the same information? > doesn't let you do anything unless it's up to date and connected to the internet. (DRM hello?) You clearly missed all the "steam updating" memes from the early/mid 2000s.