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Actually. I avoid buying products made in the USA if I possibly can. I don't like supporting aggressive militaristic regimes. https://i.imgur.com/Lt5akKR.png

Actually. I avoid buying products made in the USA if I possibly can. I don't like supporting aggressive militaristic regimes. https://i.imgur.com/Lt5akKR.png https://i.imgur.com/Lt5akKR.png [Feel free to swap North Korea for China in that graphic. The end result is pretty much the same.]

natcombs 6y ago
The graphic is inaccurate And clearly has an objective. North Korea often invaded South Korea after the war ended > A total of 3,693 armed North Korean agents have infiltrated into South Korea between 1954 and 1992 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_border_incidents_involving_North_and_South_Korea https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_border_incidents_inv...
- Normille 6y ago
  So, instead of 44-0, the USA is a mere 44-1 up on the aggression front. And as I said, since we're talking about China here, swap China for North Korea. How many countries have China invaded, bombed or staged coups in, since the end of the Korean war?
  - strictnein 6y ago
    I mean, you're double and triple (even quadruple and quintuple) counting on that a fair amount, and a fair number of those are pretty dubious. But the point isn't to provide accurate information, it's to provide something that tries to makes a point and would be a huge pain to bother refuting or diminishing, as all propaganda is designed to be.
  - natcombs 6y ago
    Tibet and Vietnam come to mind. Hong Kong most recently (violation of treaty). here is a full list for you https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_P... Also, as a democracy the US has released information about those events. We don’t expect the PRC to release evidence they behaved poorly (since they already forbid talking about TS)
- Normille 6y ago
  >The graphic is inaccurate... The data on the graphic is taken from this much longer list: https://sites.evergreen.edu/zoltan/interventions/ https://sites.evergreen.edu/zoltan/interventions/ Which events do you deny happened?
  - natcombs 6y ago
    I explained that already
solarkraft 6y ago
Are you claiming China to not be aggressive? Because some of its actions may suggest that it is.
- Normille 6y ago
  Nope. I'm not claiming China hasn't been flexing its muscles in the South China Sea, of late [which at least could be claimed is its own back yard]. But the graphic speaks for itself. The USA has an unrivalled history of wars, military aggressions and destabilising of governments all over the globe since the end of the Korean war. But you [and the rest of the western world] still seem to unquestioningly believe that you're the 'Good Guys' [0]. I mean, having a fondness for the land of your birth is all well and good, but it never fails to amaze me how many Americans just have this complete mental block when it comes to the actions of their own country. If any other country had carried out a tenth of the actions that the USA has done, throughout recent history, it would be a pariah nation. But the US gets away with it, time after time, after time. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWvpvlT9pJU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWvpvlT9pJU
  - strictnein 6y ago
    > If any other country had carried out a tenth of the actions that the USA has done, throughout recent history, it would be a pariah nation. Considering that quite a few countries now fit in that category (you're now talking ~4 incidents), well into the double digits, you're argument is now just boiling down to "US bad!".
gnusty_gnurc 6y ago
I had a friend who would explain to us how the actions of North Korea are just reactions to imperialism. I think it’s a sign you’ve gone off the deep end when you’re elevating the morally bereft.
- Normille 6y ago
  Not elevating the morally bereft. More like asking why one aggressive militaristic nation on the planet has a 'Get Out of Jail Free Card' when it comes to being held accountable for its actions.
verylittlemeat 6y ago
I just finished a great book called "All the Shah's Men" about the history of the Iranian revolution. To have everything that happened in Iran boiled down to "countries invaded by, bombed by or had coups instigated by the USA, since the end of the Korean War" is really a stretch lacking basically all context. As a casual reader of history I always thought US interference in Iran was a pretty clear cut example of wrong doing but now I'm not so sure. I can't speak on the other examples in that image but knowing more now about Iran it makes me question the narrative of the nefarious motivations behind US interference.

natcombs 6y ago

The graphic is inaccurate And clearly has an objective. North Korea often invaded South Korea after the war ended > A total of 3,693 armed North Korean agents have infiltrated into South Korea between 1954 and 1992 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_border_incidents_involving_North_and_South_Korea https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_border_incidents_inv...

Normille 6y ago
So, instead of 44-0, the USA is a mere 44-1 up on the aggression front. And as I said, since we're talking about China here, swap China for North Korea. How many countries have China invaded, bombed or staged coups in, since the end of the Korean war?
- strictnein 6y ago
  I mean, you're double and triple (even quadruple and quintuple) counting on that a fair amount, and a fair number of those are pretty dubious. But the point isn't to provide accurate information, it's to provide something that tries to makes a point and would be a huge pain to bother refuting or diminishing, as all propaganda is designed to be.
- natcombs 6y ago
  Tibet and Vietnam come to mind. Hong Kong most recently (violation of treaty). here is a full list for you https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_P... Also, as a democracy the US has released information about those events. We don’t expect the PRC to release evidence they behaved poorly (since they already forbid talking about TS)
Normille 6y ago
>The graphic is inaccurate... The data on the graphic is taken from this much longer list: https://sites.evergreen.edu/zoltan/interventions/ https://sites.evergreen.edu/zoltan/interventions/ Which events do you deny happened?
- natcombs 6y ago
  I explained that already

solarkraft 6y ago

Are you claiming China to not be aggressive? Because some of its actions may suggest that it is.

Normille 6y ago
Nope. I'm not claiming China hasn't been flexing its muscles in the South China Sea, of late [which at least could be claimed is its own back yard]. But the graphic speaks for itself. The USA has an unrivalled history of wars, military aggressions and destabilising of governments all over the globe since the end of the Korean war. But you [and the rest of the western world] still seem to unquestioningly believe that you're the 'Good Guys' [0]. I mean, having a fondness for the land of your birth is all well and good, but it never fails to amaze me how many Americans just have this complete mental block when it comes to the actions of their own country. If any other country had carried out a tenth of the actions that the USA has done, throughout recent history, it would be a pariah nation. But the US gets away with it, time after time, after time. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWvpvlT9pJU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWvpvlT9pJU
- strictnein 6y ago
  > If any other country had carried out a tenth of the actions that the USA has done, throughout recent history, it would be a pariah nation. Considering that quite a few countries now fit in that category (you're now talking ~4 incidents), well into the double digits, you're argument is now just boiling down to "US bad!".

gnusty_gnurc 6y ago

I had a friend who would explain to us how the actions of North Korea are just reactions to imperialism. I think it’s a sign you’ve gone off the deep end when you’re elevating the morally bereft.

Normille 6y ago
Not elevating the morally bereft. More like asking why one aggressive militaristic nation on the planet has a 'Get Out of Jail Free Card' when it comes to being held accountable for its actions.

verylittlemeat 6y ago

I just finished a great book called "All the Shah's Men" about the history of the Iranian revolution. To have everything that happened in Iran boiled down to "countries invaded by, bombed by or had coups instigated by the USA, since the end of the Korean War" is really a stretch lacking basically all context. As a casual reader of history I always thought US interference in Iran was a pretty clear cut example of wrong doing but now I'm not so sure. I can't speak on the other examples in that image but knowing more now about Iran it makes me question the narrative of the nefarious motivations behind US interference.