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>Facebook also plans to remove posts that both explicitly and implicitly aim to disenfranchise or prohibit people from voting; previously, the company removed o

>Facebook also plans to remove posts that both explicitly and implicitly aim to disenfranchise or prohibit people from voting; previously, the company removed only posts that actively discouraged people from voting. Now, a post that causes confusion around who is eligible to vote or some part of the voting process — such as a misstatement about what documentation is needed to receive a ballot — would also be removed. In a country where about 61% [0] of voting-age people actually take the time to vote, I can't believe there are people trying to bring that number down more. It saddens me that anybody would want to silence a voice/vote through disinformation online. It also really confuses me on who this would even affect? I haven't seen any posts about this (I haven't been on Facebook in years) so I am unsure who the "target" audience is. Would the perpetrators just want a really low turnout, hoping one side is just smart enough to not listen? Or is it to just instill more confusion? [0]: https://www.census.gov/newsroom/blogs/random-samplings/2017/05/voting_in_america.html https://www.census.gov/newsroom/blogs/random-samplings/2017/...

gameswithgo 6y ago
People try to target demographic groups that are not on their side, and discourage or inhibit their voting. For instance, if poor demographics don't tend to vote for your side, you can push for more stringent documentation being required to vote, like driver's licenses, which poor people don't have. Or you can move to limit poll locations and hours, as poor people can't get off work as easily as wealthier people. Gerrymandering is another way to game the voting system, which can be used against people rich or poor. For instance, the city of austin might very well elect a democratic member of the House, if district lines were drawn sensibly, but it is cut up into little slices of pie, then each piece slice wraps around a huge rural area that tends to vote GOP.
- chrisweekly 6y ago
  Thanks for writing that. I sometimes forget that these basic facts are not (sufficiently) common knowledge.
- mc32 6y ago
  Not everyone may have a drivers license. Some upper middle class members also don’t have driver’s licenses. What just about everyone over 18 has is a form of government ID. Without a gov ID you cannot get access gov resources: education, SNAP, medicare, Medicaid, purchase controlled groceries like alcohol, cigarettes, marijuana , power, phone plans, credit cards, etc. It’s a myth that poor people cannot get IDs. You’ll be hard pressed to find someone who doesn’t and cannot get one. I was dirt poor as a youth. I got a non drivers ID card. It was necessary in life.
  - mFixman 6y ago
    Since there are no standardised IDs in the US unlike most other countries, can't poll workers just be unnecessarily stringent on identification to deny people the vote?
    - mc32 6y ago
      I believe one of the ideas bandied about is a nationalID. People are against these as well. Non DL IDs are issued by the same state org that issues drivers licenses and they look the same, except it says Identification Card instead of Driver License. They also have no-fee options if you are homeless and reduced fee cards if you are on gov assistance.
      - fakedang 6y ago
        National IDs are always a bad idea. To give an example, when India ("world's largest democracy") decided to roll out a national ID, they touted it as a harmless and useful tool. Recently, when New Delhi erupted in violent riots, guess what was used to target and arrest the protesters, predominantly of the minority community?
        mc32 6y ago
        At this point in technology, IDs and their information are a much smaller threat than the vast information trove collected on line and from cellular devices. It’s like complaining about plastic straws but ignore the issue of nets from fishing operations. One has a better attack surface for activists but in reality the problem lay elsewhere.
- dominotw 6y ago
  > like driver's licenses, which poor people don't have. I did a cursory search and found this link[1] that says , > Across all age groups, 84.6% of all Americans have a drivers’ license. > The lowest percentage of total licensed drivers is among 16- to 19-year-olds, where 51.7% of the population have their driver’s license. Its even higher if you remove 16-19 age group, who aren't eligible for voting. Curious if you have a stat for drivers license by income. 1. https://hedgescompany.com/blog/2018/10/number-of-licensed-drivers-usa/#:~:text=Across%20all%20age%20groups%2C%2084.6,based%20on%202017%20population%20estimates https://hedgescompany.com/blog/2018/10/number-of-licensed-dr....
draugadrotten 6y ago
> Would the perpetrators just want a really low turnout, hoping one side is just smart enough to not listen? Or is it to just instill more confusion? Demoralization. Destabilization. Crisis. Normalization. Crisis Is Time of `great Opportunity'. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSVn3paVwgU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSVn3paVwgU
52-6F-62 6y ago
It seems to be a tactic not so uncommon as that. It happened here in Canada: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Canadian_federal_election_voter_suppression_scandal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Canadian_federal_election... To wit: Harper moved on to head the IDU after his last time as PM. I'm not sure if it's crazy or not to draw a line there. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Democrat_Union https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Democrat_Union
simion314 6y ago
> It also really confuses me on who this would even affect? You can have very precise targeting with FB, so you can use different tactics for different subgroups to make them vote for you or don't participate at all if they won't vote for you.
snarf21 6y ago
On a side note, can we please pass a law to make Election Day a national holiday? It is sad that companies don't help their employees and customers execute their right to vote.
- lordnacho 6y ago
  I've wondered about more than one country why they don't make it a weekend. Or just be open for longer, not everyone has the same days off.
- stronglikedan 6y ago
  Even with national holidays, it's still up to the company to give employees the day off.
apotecaryman 6y ago
If you can get people to disengage from basic politics (voting), then you can sway dozens to hundreds of seats.

gameswithgo 6y ago

People try to target demographic groups that are not on their side, and discourage or inhibit their voting. For instance, if poor demographics don't tend to vote for your side, you can push for more stringent documentation being required to vote, like driver's licenses, which poor people don't have. Or you can move to limit poll locations and hours, as poor people can't get off work as easily as wealthier people. Gerrymandering is another way to game the voting system, which can be used against people rich or poor. For instance, the city of austin might very well elect a democratic member of the House, if district lines were drawn sensibly, but it is cut up into little slices of pie, then each piece slice wraps around a huge rural area that tends to vote GOP.

chrisweekly 6y ago
Thanks for writing that. I sometimes forget that these basic facts are not (sufficiently) common knowledge.
mc32 6y ago
Not everyone may have a drivers license. Some upper middle class members also don’t have driver’s licenses. What just about everyone over 18 has is a form of government ID. Without a gov ID you cannot get access gov resources: education, SNAP, medicare, Medicaid, purchase controlled groceries like alcohol, cigarettes, marijuana , power, phone plans, credit cards, etc. It’s a myth that poor people cannot get IDs. You’ll be hard pressed to find someone who doesn’t and cannot get one. I was dirt poor as a youth. I got a non drivers ID card. It was necessary in life.
- mFixman 6y ago
  Since there are no standardised IDs in the US unlike most other countries, can't poll workers just be unnecessarily stringent on identification to deny people the vote?
  - mc32 6y ago
    I believe one of the ideas bandied about is a nationalID. People are against these as well. Non DL IDs are issued by the same state org that issues drivers licenses and they look the same, except it says Identification Card instead of Driver License. They also have no-fee options if you are homeless and reduced fee cards if you are on gov assistance.
    - fakedang 6y ago
      National IDs are always a bad idea. To give an example, when India ("world's largest democracy") decided to roll out a national ID, they touted it as a harmless and useful tool. Recently, when New Delhi erupted in violent riots, guess what was used to target and arrest the protesters, predominantly of the minority community?
      - mc32 6y ago
        At this point in technology, IDs and their information are a much smaller threat than the vast information trove collected on line and from cellular devices. It’s like complaining about plastic straws but ignore the issue of nets from fishing operations. One has a better attack surface for activists but in reality the problem lay elsewhere.
dominotw 6y ago
> like driver's licenses, which poor people don't have. I did a cursory search and found this link[1] that says , > Across all age groups, 84.6% of all Americans have a drivers’ license. > The lowest percentage of total licensed drivers is among 16- to 19-year-olds, where 51.7% of the population have their driver’s license. Its even higher if you remove 16-19 age group, who aren't eligible for voting. Curious if you have a stat for drivers license by income. 1. https://hedgescompany.com/blog/2018/10/number-of-licensed-drivers-usa/#:~:text=Across%20all%20age%20groups%2C%2084.6,based%20on%202017%20population%20estimates https://hedgescompany.com/blog/2018/10/number-of-licensed-dr....

draugadrotten 6y ago

> Would the perpetrators just want a really low turnout, hoping one side is just smart enough to not listen? Or is it to just instill more confusion? Demoralization. Destabilization. Crisis. Normalization. Crisis Is Time of `great Opportunity'. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSVn3paVwgU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSVn3paVwgU

52-6F-62 6y ago

It seems to be a tactic not so uncommon as that. It happened here in Canada: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Canadian_federal_election_voter_suppression_scandal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Canadian_federal_election... To wit: Harper moved on to head the IDU after his last time as PM. I'm not sure if it's crazy or not to draw a line there. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Democrat_Union https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Democrat_Union

simion314 6y ago

> It also really confuses me on who this would even affect? You can have very precise targeting with FB, so you can use different tactics for different subgroups to make them vote for you or don't participate at all if they won't vote for you.

snarf21 6y ago

On a side note, can we please pass a law to make Election Day a national holiday? It is sad that companies don't help their employees and customers execute their right to vote.

lordnacho 6y ago
I've wondered about more than one country why they don't make it a weekend. Or just be open for longer, not everyone has the same days off.
stronglikedan 6y ago
Even with national holidays, it's still up to the company to give employees the day off.

apotecaryman 6y ago

If you can get people to disengage from basic politics (voting), then you can sway dozens to hundreds of seats.