4 ms·

Whole Belarus protests story just exposes flaws of democracy - probably to the point of it no longer being viable in a post-industrial world: let people really

Whole Belarus protests story just exposes flaws of democracy - probably to the point of it no longer being viable in a post-industrial world: let people really vote and they inevitably vote against their own interest, just because any sort of reality possible for the masses can't be accepted by them for being too grim: real voting can only be won by blatantly lying. I hope we will find a way to peacefully wind down the democracy in the West before it completely destroys our economy and society.

james_s_tayler 6y ago
Let's just go back to being ruled by kings and queens and having to do whatever job our last name is while we're at it.
- DmitryOlkhovoi 6y ago
  Your current life isn't so different. You do what market says, what you are paid for.
  - james_s_tayler 6y ago
    You just keep on telling yourself that.
    - DmitryOlkhovoi 6y ago
      You just keep on working hard
- anovikov 6y ago
  Not necessarily. I see Western societies of the future as a two-tier system: most countries turning to some form of Putinism - manipulative "democracies" inhabited largely by populace so dependent on the government handouts they can't even think of expressing any dissident opinion (plus low-scale, targeted repressions against those few who dare), and some islands of real democracy, inhabited and funded by money of global elite and even sort of a global middle class, who has multiple passports and siphons off the cash from countries of the first group.
  - james_s_tayler 6y ago
    Kinda hard to have real democracy when you have dictators that just kill people they don't like. Want to stay as far away from that dynamic as possible. It's garbage and always will be.
  - tekkk 6y ago
    That's ridiculously black and white. Putinism is not a stable state for any country by any means, and Russia has been hemorrhaging talent and companies left and right because of it. Your notion of "democracies funded by global elite" and a "siphoning global middle class" sound more of conspiracy theory babble than anything rational. And by the way you have concluded that there are only two paths for Western societies, I'd say your judgment has become heavily biased.
    - anovikov 6y ago
      Well, there's a third choice: police state, just accept that people will go crazy and be prepared to counter it with brute force. But this is too close to what Lukashenka does.
ganzuul 6y ago
I really wonder what interests you represent to voice such an opinion. Democracy isn't a panacea to the world's problems. It needs an informed population in order to function, which directly and without discrimination means government transparency. The process of opinion building needs to be taught in schools, and journalists need to be protected from interference. Without these pieces and more in place there is no democracy. Very few countries actually are democratic in practice. The fight for freedom and democracy is ongoing, and those who get in its way are misanthropes who deserve a bitter end to their efforts.
- anovikov 6y ago
  First and foremost democracy needs government which is funded by the people, not other way around. In today's Belarus, this is not the case; in the near future, it will not be the case in most or all large Western societies simply due to technological reasons: automation will make most people unemployable and dependent on government handouts - either direct, in form of basic income guarantee, on concealed, through public of private "bullshit jobs", that create no economic value but exists just so these people can consume and keep the wheels of economy rolling. Have that, and democratic society with freedom of speech, and you get a self-eating monster machine that will destroy itself in less than a generation. Why does someone who has no chances to be self-reliant, vote responsibly? Especially if he is well-educated and well-informed, so he realises it.
- anovikov 6y ago
  And in this particular case, these people, calling themselves Belarusian patriots, are destroying the country: if things start look like they are succeeding, of course the country will be invaded and occupied by Putin, and will just be dissolved, joining Russia as 6 regions plus the city of Minsk. The very Belarusian ethnicity will cease to exist within a generation. Is that what they really want? If they are patriots, they should hold on to Lukashenka for as long as he is alive, and pray that power transition will happen smoothly so Russia has no reason to intervene when he dies - or it will be the end of their nation as such.
rsynnott 6y ago
Belarus isn't a democratic country. It has elections, which the incumbent always wins, via cheating if required. In this instance, the cheating was a bit obvious, leading to a public backlash.
- anovikov 6y ago
  My point is that this is how it should be, and people who try to protest, are not right, for very practical reason which i have explained below, and it is a very good example displaying democracy being an outdated thing bringing disaster

james_s_tayler 6y ago

Let's just go back to being ruled by kings and queens and having to do whatever job our last name is while we're at it.

DmitryOlkhovoi 6y ago
Your current life isn't so different. You do what market says, what you are paid for.
- james_s_tayler 6y ago
  You just keep on telling yourself that.
  - DmitryOlkhovoi 6y ago
    You just keep on working hard
anovikov 6y ago
Not necessarily. I see Western societies of the future as a two-tier system: most countries turning to some form of Putinism - manipulative "democracies" inhabited largely by populace so dependent on the government handouts they can't even think of expressing any dissident opinion (plus low-scale, targeted repressions against those few who dare), and some islands of real democracy, inhabited and funded by money of global elite and even sort of a global middle class, who has multiple passports and siphons off the cash from countries of the first group.
- james_s_tayler 6y ago
  Kinda hard to have real democracy when you have dictators that just kill people they don't like. Want to stay as far away from that dynamic as possible. It's garbage and always will be.
- tekkk 6y ago
  That's ridiculously black and white. Putinism is not a stable state for any country by any means, and Russia has been hemorrhaging talent and companies left and right because of it. Your notion of "democracies funded by global elite" and a "siphoning global middle class" sound more of conspiracy theory babble than anything rational. And by the way you have concluded that there are only two paths for Western societies, I'd say your judgment has become heavily biased.
  - anovikov 6y ago
    Well, there's a third choice: police state, just accept that people will go crazy and be prepared to counter it with brute force. But this is too close to what Lukashenka does.

ganzuul 6y ago

I really wonder what interests you represent to voice such an opinion. Democracy isn't a panacea to the world's problems. It needs an informed population in order to function, which directly and without discrimination means government transparency. The process of opinion building needs to be taught in schools, and journalists need to be protected from interference. Without these pieces and more in place there is no democracy. Very few countries actually are democratic in practice. The fight for freedom and democracy is ongoing, and those who get in its way are misanthropes who deserve a bitter end to their efforts.

anovikov 6y ago
First and foremost democracy needs government which is funded by the people, not other way around. In today's Belarus, this is not the case; in the near future, it will not be the case in most or all large Western societies simply due to technological reasons: automation will make most people unemployable and dependent on government handouts - either direct, in form of basic income guarantee, on concealed, through public of private "bullshit jobs", that create no economic value but exists just so these people can consume and keep the wheels of economy rolling. Have that, and democratic society with freedom of speech, and you get a self-eating monster machine that will destroy itself in less than a generation. Why does someone who has no chances to be self-reliant, vote responsibly? Especially if he is well-educated and well-informed, so he realises it.
anovikov 6y ago
And in this particular case, these people, calling themselves Belarusian patriots, are destroying the country: if things start look like they are succeeding, of course the country will be invaded and occupied by Putin, and will just be dissolved, joining Russia as 6 regions plus the city of Minsk. The very Belarusian ethnicity will cease to exist within a generation. Is that what they really want? If they are patriots, they should hold on to Lukashenka for as long as he is alive, and pray that power transition will happen smoothly so Russia has no reason to intervene when he dies - or it will be the end of their nation as such.

rsynnott 6y ago

Belarus isn't a democratic country. It has elections, which the incumbent always wins, via cheating if required. In this instance, the cheating was a bit obvious, leading to a public backlash.

anovikov 6y ago
My point is that this is how it should be, and people who try to protest, are not right, for very practical reason which i have explained below, and it is a very good example displaying democracy being an outdated thing bringing disaster