6 ms·

> Traffic, street parking, and public spaces all get more congested A proper transit network and walkable design ensures that this doesn't become a problem. >

> Traffic, street parking, and public spaces all get more congested A proper transit network and walkable design ensures that this doesn't become a problem. > Plus a neighbor building a bigger building impacts my views and the light that falls on my property. People get so hung up on this, but that's just how it goes -- cities change. Just because you bought a place doesn't mean you're entitled to the exact same view forever.

rumanator 6y ago
> A proper transit network and walkable design ensures that this doesn't become a problem. How do you expect to put together a working transit network, which is very sensitive to urban planning, if you are also argue in favour of ignoring any restriction imposed by urban planners?
- imtringued 6y ago
  Nobody is arguing in favor of ignoring any restriction imposed by urban planners.
  - rumanator 6y ago
    You're literally commenting in a thread where people are complaining against building regulation that stops people from building extra houses in their backyard as they please. Worse than that, you're intentionally ignoring half the posts made though out this thread where people complain about urban plans that limit occupation density.
darawk 6y ago
> A proper transit network and walkable design ensures that this doesn't become a problem. While that's true, if you don't have a proper transit network, it's a real problem. And many cities aren't in a position to build a proper transit network at the drop of a hat. Don't get me wrong, I wish they did or could efficiently build one. But sometimes you have to deal with reality as it is, not as you'd like it to be, unfortunately.
- bluGill 6y ago
  To add to your point, even if you were willing to invest in a proper network it will take years to get going. People are set in their ways and so they won't stop driving, even the hard core supporters of the idea will drive everywhere for a while. Eventually something will cause them to try transport, but the first time they will fail to figure out how to ride and so be late to their... Eventually they will figure it out and over 10 years you can get a good ridership for the population density. Then over the next 30 years you can get density to increase to the point where there is enough population density to justify the network you needed to create to get there.
- ng12 6y ago
  Do you think they built the MTA before they built Manhattan? Population growth creates the tax base, density, and demand required for a successful public transportation system. Demanding that the public transport comes first is simply backwards.
  - darawk 6y ago
    They built the MTA when they still had the flexibility to do it. Portland is too developed now, too many entrenched interests, it'll never get done. Listen, I am on the same page as you - I would love for it to happen. I would vote for it. I would pay taxes for it. But the reality is that it isn't going to happen, and if you densify the city without the transit, you will have these problems.
    - ajmurmann 6y ago
      Maybe once we have the problems, people will accept the solution
      - freeone3000 6y ago
        We need to make driving suck so much that people would rather take the bus.
scollet 6y ago
Let me also plug biking infra. This, imo, should be an accessible alternative to balance the inefficiencies of motor vehicles (too much space for too little passengers) and rail/bus (too many passengers and dilated commute time).
- xyhopguy 6y ago
  in the denser parts of portland it already is!

rumanator 6y ago

> A proper transit network and walkable design ensures that this doesn't become a problem. How do you expect to put together a working transit network, which is very sensitive to urban planning, if you are also argue in favour of ignoring any restriction imposed by urban planners?

imtringued 6y ago
Nobody is arguing in favor of ignoring any restriction imposed by urban planners.
- rumanator 6y ago
  You're literally commenting in a thread where people are complaining against building regulation that stops people from building extra houses in their backyard as they please. Worse than that, you're intentionally ignoring half the posts made though out this thread where people complain about urban plans that limit occupation density.

darawk 6y ago

> A proper transit network and walkable design ensures that this doesn't become a problem. While that's true, if you don't have a proper transit network, it's a real problem. And many cities aren't in a position to build a proper transit network at the drop of a hat. Don't get me wrong, I wish they did or could efficiently build one. But sometimes you have to deal with reality as it is, not as you'd like it to be, unfortunately.

bluGill 6y ago
To add to your point, even if you were willing to invest in a proper network it will take years to get going. People are set in their ways and so they won't stop driving, even the hard core supporters of the idea will drive everywhere for a while. Eventually something will cause them to try transport, but the first time they will fail to figure out how to ride and so be late to their... Eventually they will figure it out and over 10 years you can get a good ridership for the population density. Then over the next 30 years you can get density to increase to the point where there is enough population density to justify the network you needed to create to get there.
ng12 6y ago
Do you think they built the MTA before they built Manhattan? Population growth creates the tax base, density, and demand required for a successful public transportation system. Demanding that the public transport comes first is simply backwards.
- darawk 6y ago
  They built the MTA when they still had the flexibility to do it. Portland is too developed now, too many entrenched interests, it'll never get done. Listen, I am on the same page as you - I would love for it to happen. I would vote for it. I would pay taxes for it. But the reality is that it isn't going to happen, and if you densify the city without the transit, you will have these problems.
  - ajmurmann 6y ago
    Maybe once we have the problems, people will accept the solution
    - freeone3000 6y ago
      We need to make driving suck so much that people would rather take the bus.

scollet 6y ago

Let me also plug biking infra. This, imo, should be an accessible alternative to balance the inefficiencies of motor vehicles (too much space for too little passengers) and rail/bus (too many passengers and dilated commute time).

xyhopguy 6y ago
in the denser parts of portland it already is!