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I'm an American and have only seen the police rioting. Defunding the police is the most reasonable option I have heard in my lifetime. Seems like the perfect so

I'm an American and have only seen the police rioting. Defunding the police is the most reasonable option I have heard in my lifetime. Seems like the perfect solution, there is nothing bad to say about it, it's opponents are left to make up "widespread rioting".

Rebelgecko 6y ago
Would you mind elaborating? Are you not aware of the rioting, looting, and arson that has stricken many cities across America?
arkis22 6y ago
> I'm an American and have only seen the police rioting I'm an American. I can't believe you can say that with a straight face. As soon as you say that ONLY the police are doing something wrong means you have an understanding of the situation that no facts will fix.
- shirakawasuna 6y ago
  As someone who was personally targeted by violent police for kneeling and holding my hands up, let me assure you that they are correct. Have you gone to any protests where the police used chemical weapons?
  - arkis22 6y ago
    Were you personally targeted? As in there was a line of people that they walked past to personally give you a dose of chemical weapons? Gas is a chemical weapon. Pepper spray is a chemical weapon. Please don't compare Assad's use of chemical weapons to tear gas.
    - shirakawasuna 6y ago
      I mean I was targeted. By personally I meant that I had that personal experience. It was as part of a group - the cops tend to use "collective punishment" when it comes to protests, after all. The use of tear gas is the use of a chemical weapon and a war crime, but when you turn it against civilians in your own country we give it a pass.
      - arkis22 6y ago
        So you weren't personally targeted. In what way were you targeted? Were you doing nothing to arouse police attention? I think most first world countries have a gas they can use for riot control. Are you insisting that most first world countries are regularly engaging in what you would call war crimes... that are worse than other countries?
        shirakawasuna 6y ago
        > So you weren't personally targeted. I think I've clarified what I meant. I was targeted. I can't specify the exact degree to which anyone was skipped over to get to me. > In what way were you targeted? First time, it was indiscriminate use of teargas. Second time, indiscriminate use of teargas and a flashbang shot at my feet. > Were you doing nothing to arouse police attention? I was standing in a protest. > I think most first world countries have a gas they can use for riot control. Are you insisting that most first world countries are regularly engaging in what you would call war crimes... that are worse than other countries? It would be a war crime if it were a foreign military force using it against the exact same crowd, but not if it's cops. War crimes have a way of being selectively (un)enforced when it comes to those in power, in any case. Police are fairly atrocious in most countries, so I don't think there's much point in trying to figure out exactly where I'd rank the police in the US. It wouldn't make it right if it were average or not.
        arkis22 6y ago
        You've done it poorly. You can't specify the degree to which you think you were personally selected. And you've given two examples of them shooting indiscriminately. So no, they didn't personally target you.
        shirakawasuna 6y ago
        > You've done it poorly. The other commenter seemed to understand well enough. Maybe instead of playing a blame game you could accept my clarification and move on? > You can't specify the degree to which you think you were personally selected. And I never claimed to. > And you've given two examples of them shooting indiscriminately. So no, they didn't personally target you. The second example was closer to me than anyone else and I was at the rear of the crowd. I don't know how productive it is for me to keep telling you what I mean by saying I was personally targeted. But okay, I'll try again with the same substitution: I had a first-hand experience being targeted by police with chemical and explosive weapons.
  - lawnchair_larry 6y ago
    The scare words really kill your credibility. It’s tear gas and pepper spray, not mustard gas. Stop trying to manufacture an oppressed victim narrative. We can call a water cannon a chemical weapon too.
    - shirakawasuna 6y ago
      > The scare words really kill your credibility. It’s tear gas and pepper spray, not mustard gas. If it were a foreign military doing the exact same action to the exact same people, it would be a war crime. There are serious impacts from using tear gas, including poorly-understood hormonal impacts to women, particularly pregnant women. > Stop trying to manufacture an oppressed victim narrative. I haven't manufactured anything, these are things that have been happening for three months via aggressive, proactive police action. You can go see it for yourself by attending a protest at a major city. Or you can review the countless videos. Or you can listen to people (like me) who were there. > We can call a water cannon a chemical weapon too. No we can't. Water cannons are also unacceptable in these situations, however. People like to act like these weapons are relatively harmless, but people have been disabled, nearly killed, or straight-up killed with them.
_-david-_ 6y ago
Over 30 people have been killed by the rioters not the police during these violent riots,
- jessaustin 6y ago
  Police kill 1000 people in USA every year.
  - lawnchair_larry 6y ago
    That’s not a useful or relevant statistic and you know it.
    - NotQuantum 6y ago
      Perhaps the statistic that 40% of cops are domestic abusers is relevant to you. https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/09/police-officers-who-hit-their-wives-or-girlfriends/380329/ https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/09/police-...
      - _-david-_ 6y ago
        Rioters committing murder is not related to cops committing domestic abuse.
      - lawnchair_larry 6y ago
        It’s not, because it was debunked ages ago.
    - jessaustin 6y ago
      I'm just trying to put GP's dubious numbers in their proper context. Of those 1000, how many would you estimate are killed without reasonable cause? Could it be 30? 300? 970? We shouldn't turn off our brains just because somebody said someone died. USA society is fine with the carnage on the highway and throughout the Middle East; I think we can deal with a tiny amount of carnage in order to improve.
lawnchair_larry 6y ago
This is hilariously dishonest. How can you expect to be taken seriously?

Rebelgecko 6y ago

Would you mind elaborating? Are you not aware of the rioting, looting, and arson that has stricken many cities across America?

arkis22 6y ago

> I'm an American and have only seen the police rioting I'm an American. I can't believe you can say that with a straight face. As soon as you say that ONLY the police are doing something wrong means you have an understanding of the situation that no facts will fix.

shirakawasuna 6y ago
As someone who was personally targeted by violent police for kneeling and holding my hands up, let me assure you that they are correct. Have you gone to any protests where the police used chemical weapons?
- arkis22 6y ago
  Were you personally targeted? As in there was a line of people that they walked past to personally give you a dose of chemical weapons? Gas is a chemical weapon. Pepper spray is a chemical weapon. Please don't compare Assad's use of chemical weapons to tear gas.
  - shirakawasuna 6y ago
    I mean I was targeted. By personally I meant that I had that personal experience. It was as part of a group - the cops tend to use "collective punishment" when it comes to protests, after all. The use of tear gas is the use of a chemical weapon and a war crime, but when you turn it against civilians in your own country we give it a pass.
    - arkis22 6y ago
      So you weren't personally targeted. In what way were you targeted? Were you doing nothing to arouse police attention? I think most first world countries have a gas they can use for riot control. Are you insisting that most first world countries are regularly engaging in what you would call war crimes... that are worse than other countries?
      - shirakawasuna 6y ago
        > So you weren't personally targeted. I think I've clarified what I meant. I was targeted. I can't specify the exact degree to which anyone was skipped over to get to me. > In what way were you targeted? First time, it was indiscriminate use of teargas. Second time, indiscriminate use of teargas and a flashbang shot at my feet. > Were you doing nothing to arouse police attention? I was standing in a protest. > I think most first world countries have a gas they can use for riot control. Are you insisting that most first world countries are regularly engaging in what you would call war crimes... that are worse than other countries? It would be a war crime if it were a foreign military force using it against the exact same crowd, but not if it's cops. War crimes have a way of being selectively (un)enforced when it comes to those in power, in any case. Police are fairly atrocious in most countries, so I don't think there's much point in trying to figure out exactly where I'd rank the police in the US. It wouldn't make it right if it were average or not.
        arkis22 6y ago
        You've done it poorly. You can't specify the degree to which you think you were personally selected. And you've given two examples of them shooting indiscriminately. So no, they didn't personally target you.
        shirakawasuna 6y ago
        > You've done it poorly. The other commenter seemed to understand well enough. Maybe instead of playing a blame game you could accept my clarification and move on? > You can't specify the degree to which you think you were personally selected. And I never claimed to. > And you've given two examples of them shooting indiscriminately. So no, they didn't personally target you. The second example was closer to me than anyone else and I was at the rear of the crowd. I don't know how productive it is for me to keep telling you what I mean by saying I was personally targeted. But okay, I'll try again with the same substitution: I had a first-hand experience being targeted by police with chemical and explosive weapons.
- lawnchair_larry 6y ago
  The scare words really kill your credibility. It’s tear gas and pepper spray, not mustard gas. Stop trying to manufacture an oppressed victim narrative. We can call a water cannon a chemical weapon too.
  - shirakawasuna 6y ago
    > The scare words really kill your credibility. It’s tear gas and pepper spray, not mustard gas. If it were a foreign military doing the exact same action to the exact same people, it would be a war crime. There are serious impacts from using tear gas, including poorly-understood hormonal impacts to women, particularly pregnant women. > Stop trying to manufacture an oppressed victim narrative. I haven't manufactured anything, these are things that have been happening for three months via aggressive, proactive police action. You can go see it for yourself by attending a protest at a major city. Or you can review the countless videos. Or you can listen to people (like me) who were there. > We can call a water cannon a chemical weapon too. No we can't. Water cannons are also unacceptable in these situations, however. People like to act like these weapons are relatively harmless, but people have been disabled, nearly killed, or straight-up killed with them.

_-david-_ 6y ago

Over 30 people have been killed by the rioters not the police during these violent riots,

jessaustin 6y ago
Police kill 1000 people in USA every year.
- lawnchair_larry 6y ago
  That’s not a useful or relevant statistic and you know it.
  - NotQuantum 6y ago
    Perhaps the statistic that 40% of cops are domestic abusers is relevant to you. https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/09/police-officers-who-hit-their-wives-or-girlfriends/380329/ https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/09/police-...
    - _-david-_ 6y ago
      Rioters committing murder is not related to cops committing domestic abuse.
    - lawnchair_larry 6y ago
      It’s not, because it was debunked ages ago.
  - jessaustin 6y ago
    I'm just trying to put GP's dubious numbers in their proper context. Of those 1000, how many would you estimate are killed without reasonable cause? Could it be 30? 300? 970? We shouldn't turn off our brains just because somebody said someone died. USA society is fine with the carnage on the highway and throughout the Middle East; I think we can deal with a tiny amount of carnage in order to improve.

lawnchair_larry 6y ago

This is hilariously dishonest. How can you expect to be taken seriously?