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"the Silicon Valley crowd is strangely avoidant of examining evidence or explaining their opposition with real-world data. It's all 101ism and polemics." It's

by calyth2018 6y ago

"the Silicon Valley crowd is strangely avoidant of examining evidence or explaining their opposition with real-world data. It's all 101ism and polemics." It's not strange at all. It's self-interest.

Red_Leaves_Flyy 6y ago
What's strange is that the same cohort that doesn't deeply discuss higher tax rates on tens of millions in wealth, love to get out tomes of research to support the social cause du jour.
rtx 6y ago
Wealth tax is majoritism and nothing else. And we all know how that ends.
- dodnest 6y ago
  In order for your snarky statement to be correct, the wealthy would have to be a 'social minority'. Sure, they're a statistical minority, but they're not in danger of being oppressed because they own a greater share of social power in any given country than the majority of people. I can't believe you've gone around thinking that 'minority' just meant numbers and nothing else.
- giantg2 6y ago
  Once a democracy realizes it has the keys to the treasury...
- damnyou 6y ago
  Majoritarianism is bad because it can oppress powerless minorities. The wealthy are not a powerless minority.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - philwelch 6y ago
    Majoritarianism usually justifies itself via populist arguments that some particular minority is too powerful and needs to be cut down. This is the basis of nearly every conspiracy theory about the Jews, for instance.
    - dodnest 6y ago
      Except that you can provide evidence for why the wealthy minority is too powerful whereas jews are just attacked for... being jewish. You know, the nazis for example were a minority, that doesn't mean attacking them was bad... populism isn't inherently bad...
      - philwelch 6y ago
        You can provide “evidence” that the Jews are “too powerful”, too.
        heylook 6y ago
        Bad faith actors can fabricate "evidence". Therefore all evidence is useless?
        damnyou 6y ago
        What you're saying is that critical thinking is required to determine morality. That is indeed true. To oppose a wealth tax on majoritarian grounds you need to demonstrate that the wealthy are oppressed in some way. Simply saying "but majoritarianism" is not sufficient, and appealing to Jewish oppression is plain whataboutism. I'm not advocating for guillotines or whatever. Simply that a small percentage of individual wealth over a certain amount (say $10MM) be redistributed to the rest of society. The end result of this is that individuals are still going to be able to hold $10MM even if the wealth tax redistributed 100% of the rest of their wealth. They will still be incredibly rich and not have any meaningful financial constraints on their lives. Calling this oppression is absurd.
        philwelch 6y ago
ashtonkem 6y ago
It’s often not even self interest; fairly often it’s obvious that some participants in these discussions are searching for arguments to validate pre-held beliefs and policy positions. Although sometimes self interest is also a factor.
- donw 6y ago
  I hate to break it to you, but literally all of humanity does that, most of the time: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias This includes me. And you. And everybody else here. Changing your mind is actually really hard.
  - ashtonkem 6y ago
    > I hate to break it to you, but literally all of humanity does that, most of the time I'm not sure why you'd assume that you're breaking anything to me.
    - donw 6y ago
      Stating that "some participants are searching for arguments to validate pre-held beliefs and policy positions" is roughly akin to saying "some participants eat food and breathe air". Confirmation bias is part of the human condition, and should be expected by default.
- jimbokun 6y ago
  > fairly often it’s obvious that participants in these discussions are searching for arguments to validate pre-held beliefs and policy positions. This is true of discussion of almost any topic by almost anyone ever.
  - BurningFrog 6y ago
    Yeah, this is just how the human brain works. The big thing to understand is that we lie about these things to ourselves, so we can easier lie about them to others. Unconscious parts of your brain lies to the conscious part!! I learned this here: https://www.amazon.com/Elephant-Brain-Hidden-Motives-Everyday/dp/0190495995 https://www.amazon.com/Elephant-Brain-Hidden-Motives-Everyda...

"the Silicon Valley crowd is strangely avoidant of examining evidence or explaining their opposition with real-world data. It's all 101ism and polemics." It's not strange at all. It's self-interest.

Red_Leaves_Flyy 6y ago

What's strange is that the same cohort that doesn't deeply discuss higher tax rates on tens of millions in wealth, love to get out tomes of research to support the social cause du jour.

rtx 6y ago

Wealth tax is majoritism and nothing else. And we all know how that ends.

dodnest 6y ago
In order for your snarky statement to be correct, the wealthy would have to be a 'social minority'. Sure, they're a statistical minority, but they're not in danger of being oppressed because they own a greater share of social power in any given country than the majority of people. I can't believe you've gone around thinking that 'minority' just meant numbers and nothing else.
giantg2 6y ago
Once a democracy realizes it has the keys to the treasury...
damnyou 6y ago
Majoritarianism is bad because it can oppress powerless minorities. The wealthy are not a powerless minority.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- philwelch 6y ago
  Majoritarianism usually justifies itself via populist arguments that some particular minority is too powerful and needs to be cut down. This is the basis of nearly every conspiracy theory about the Jews, for instance.
  - dodnest 6y ago
    Except that you can provide evidence for why the wealthy minority is too powerful whereas jews are just attacked for... being jewish. You know, the nazis for example were a minority, that doesn't mean attacking them was bad... populism isn't inherently bad...
    - philwelch 6y ago
      You can provide “evidence” that the Jews are “too powerful”, too.
      - heylook 6y ago
        Bad faith actors can fabricate "evidence". Therefore all evidence is useless?
      - damnyou 6y ago
        What you're saying is that critical thinking is required to determine morality. That is indeed true. To oppose a wealth tax on majoritarian grounds you need to demonstrate that the wealthy are oppressed in some way. Simply saying "but majoritarianism" is not sufficient, and appealing to Jewish oppression is plain whataboutism. I'm not advocating for guillotines or whatever. Simply that a small percentage of individual wealth over a certain amount (say $10MM) be redistributed to the rest of society. The end result of this is that individuals are still going to be able to hold $10MM even if the wealth tax redistributed 100% of the rest of their wealth. They will still be incredibly rich and not have any meaningful financial constraints on their lives. Calling this oppression is absurd.
        philwelch 6y ago

ashtonkem 6y ago

It’s often not even self interest; fairly often it’s obvious that some participants in these discussions are searching for arguments to validate pre-held beliefs and policy positions. Although sometimes self interest is also a factor.

donw 6y ago
I hate to break it to you, but literally all of humanity does that, most of the time: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias This includes me. And you. And everybody else here. Changing your mind is actually really hard.
- ashtonkem 6y ago
  > I hate to break it to you, but literally all of humanity does that, most of the time I'm not sure why you'd assume that you're breaking anything to me.
  - donw 6y ago
    Stating that "some participants are searching for arguments to validate pre-held beliefs and policy positions" is roughly akin to saying "some participants eat food and breathe air". Confirmation bias is part of the human condition, and should be expected by default.
jimbokun 6y ago
> fairly often it’s obvious that participants in these discussions are searching for arguments to validate pre-held beliefs and policy positions. This is true of discussion of almost any topic by almost anyone ever.
- BurningFrog 6y ago
  Yeah, this is just how the human brain works. The big thing to understand is that we lie about these things to ourselves, so we can easier lie about them to others. Unconscious parts of your brain lies to the conscious part!! I learned this here: https://www.amazon.com/Elephant-Brain-Hidden-Motives-Everyday/dp/0190495995 https://www.amazon.com/Elephant-Brain-Hidden-Motives-Everyda...