8 ms·
I think nVidia could run into some serious anti-trust issues if they tried to interfere with the ARM ecosystem. There's far too much at stake here. Is there a p
by chongli 6y ago
I think nVidia could run into some serious anti-trust issues if they tried to interfere with the ARM ecosystem. There's far too much at stake here. Is there a phone on the planet that doesn't run ARM?
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- DaiPlusPlus 6y agoI think there’s some MIPS and SH-3/SH-4 smartphones from the early 2000s still around. I had an SH-3 PDA in 2001, but Microsoft dropped support for SH-3 and MIPS in Windows CE by the time “Windows Smartphone 2002” came out (my 2002 HTC Canary runs ARM, IIRC) so it’d have to be a non-CE platform. What did the Palm Handspring use?
- com2kid 6y agoInternally we supported SH4 through CE7! Source: I maintained the compiler test infra for it.
- DaiPlusPlus 6y agoI salute you sir! What’s the current roadmap for CE? I saw there’s a new CE environment in Win10 IoT, but it feels like too-little-too-late to save the myriad of embedded enterprise CE systems.
- pjmlp 6y agoThere is a recent post about it. https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/internet-of-things/moving-forward-with-windows-ce-using-the-windows-ce-app/ba-p/1582360 https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/internet-of-things/mo...
- com2kid 6y ago> What’s the current roadmap for CE? No clue sorry! I left many many years ago. CE7 was incredibly good, the minimum image size we had it running on was ~20MB on disk.
- DaiPlusPlus 6y agoI saw the WPF-esque XAML demos for CE7 - I was really impressed and also hopeful that it would lead to smooth fluid UIs in embedded devices like car infotainment systems and home thermostats. Oh how naive I was! (I assume the push for WPF-like XAML in CE7 was because at the time (2011-2012?) there was still hope of a CE7-based Windows Mobile competing with iOS and Android, and Microsoft realized the mistake of not modernizing CE's UI system at-all between 2002 and 2012? Windows Mobile 6.5 was a hideous eyesore (and all the pretty home-screen functionality was literally just skin-deep).
- Matthias247 6y agoNot only internally. Infotainment Systems with the CE7 and SH4 combination had been built well beyond 2012. Only around that time Arm got traction. At some point in time it got then renamed in embedded compact. Source: worked in the automotive together with a couple of supplier which built those systems.
- mappu 6y agoSH4 is out of patent now - do you know if the J-Core can run CE7?
- freemint 6y agoUnlikely, since the SoC is different.
- dmitrygr 6y agoPalm and handspring used moto 68k before PalmOS 5.0, ARM since then
- throwaway2048 6y agoWhy give them the opportunity to do so?
- momokoko 6y agoIt’s not that they will go out of their way to harm it. The ecosystem will change from being the top focus of arm to becoming more of an afterthought. Nvidia arm could end up taking more of a take it or leave it stance because those customers are no longer the top priority.
- Abishek_Muthian 6y ago>I think nVidia could run into some serious anti-trust issues if they tried to interfere with the ARM ecosystem. I seriously doubt it, Broadcom - Qualcomm sale was blocked because there were concerns that the former would inhibit the telecom technologies development of the latter, resulting in strategic disadvantage to U.S. But, in the case of supposed Nvidia-ARM sale I see the quite opposite i.e. huge strategic advantage to U.S. and so I feel the anti-trust might not be at least State initiated. But, would other U.S. Big Tech who have invested heavily in the ARM ecosystem oppose this is what to be seen. But even there, I wonder whether their fear could be substantiated? What if Nvidia just signs a good agreement with them to alleviate their fears? After all Apple and Qualcomm were strangling each other throats, now see where they are now. In the end, I think the deal would just go through and it's us who are worried about the future our Raspberry Pis among others things who would feel lost(and actually loose).
- pmontra 6y agoWouldn't the EU antitrust look into that too or is this going to be out of their jurisdiction after Brexit?
- stingraycharles 6y agoI believe as long as ARM sells their hardware in the EU, they are able to look into antitrust issues.
- qubex 6y agoNot that I disagree with you, but ARM doesn’t sell hardware—they sell licenses to designs of the aforesaid. Nonetheless, don’t forget that nVidia, insofar as it sells hardware in the EU, would definitely be within the scope of local anti-trust authorities. I don’t see this being much liked by those authorities, either. nVidia is clearly interested in doing this deal because it will give them competitive advantages, and it’s pretty clear by their behaviour versus other firms (including Apple!) that they have so much of that already that they don’t have to “play nice”. Giving them further purview to do as they please is basically what anti-trust is designed to prevent, whether you focus on industry relations or the ascendant on consumers.
- jraph 6y agoThe Asus Zenfone 2, released 5 years ago, ran on x86 (Intel Atom) [1]. I know someone who was still using it this year Eventually switched but the phone still works. So, to the question: > Is there a phone on the planet that doesn't run ARM? Well, technically, yes ;-) This does not change anything to your point though. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asus_ZenFone#Second_generation_(2015) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asus_ZenFone#Second_generation...
- slimsag 6y agoI used the ZenFone 2 for about a year ~3.5 years ago; it worked surprisingly well. It was impressive that it really "just worked" like a normal ARM device. There were some annoying software aspects (the Play Store only allowed me to download x86 apps even though it could run ARM apps), and the device was 100% a battery hog - but cool tech. Surprised Intel gave up on that effort.
- Nightshaxx 6y agoI bought the Zenfone 2 which had an Intel processor, and had a similar experience to the sister comment. The only super annoying thing that happened was when Pokemon Go came out all my friends had it but it didn't support Intel. By the time they made it available for the intel phones (which was a few weeks) the game wasn't cool anymore. :/
- justincormack 6y agoThere were a few MIPS Android phones too.
- dcow 6y agoWhat’s at steak? Why is it too much?
- znpy 6y agoAre you sure? Intel makes both CPUs and GPUs. AMD makes both CPUs and GPUs. nVidia would make both CPUs and GPUs. What would be the difference? Actually, as long as there are a number of arm design licensees, the situation would be way better than it currently is for x86: beyond Intel and AMD there is basically no other player in that field (Via? Transmeta? are they even noticeable?).
- JonathonW 6y agonVidia already makes CPUs and GPUs (they make the CPU that goes into the Nintendo Switch, for example). Buying ARM doesn’t change much in that regard, except that they can save on licensing fees and it puts them in a position to disrupt competitors who also produce ARM processors.
- stjohnswarts 6y agoI would think not licensing new IP would be the main concern. basically hogging ARM IP completely for themselves and their products. It would take a couple of years for companies and devs to switch to a different architecture, but you can be sure that there are competitors willing to fill that gap.
- mekster 6y agoWhy would nVidia disrupt competitors? They need to pay $30bn to buy ARM which means they want to maximize the return for that purchase, which would be selling more and not disrupt for competitors to look elsewhere.
- imtringued 6y agoThe difference is that Nvidia would be a customer and the owner of ARM at the same time. An Nvidia controlled ARM will primarily exist to make Nvidia happy at the expense of all other ARM customers.