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U.S. Marshals Service online auction – Fyre festival fraud scheme
- abeppu 6y agoIt's been pointed out that there are identical items with very different bids. Maybe someone with knowledge of game theory or mechanism design or whatever can tell me: What's the "right" way (or ways?) to auction off multiple identical items? Top k bids win?
- renewiltord 6y agoIt's probably something like "each winning bid pays the next highest bid price plus one".
- wmf 6y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vickrey%E2%80%93Clarke%E2%80%93Groves_auction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vickrey%E2%80%93Clarke%E2%80%9...
- sbierwagen 6y agoI was going to remark on that ugly URL, only to discover that using en-dashes, which have to be percent-encoded in URLs, is official Wikipedia policy! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style#Dashes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style#Dash... How unbelivably braindead.
- michaelt 6y agoHacker News and Wikipedia render links containing 毛泽东 correctly, but browsers copy-and-paste them as https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%E6%AF%9B%E6%B3%BD%E4%B8%9C https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%E6%AF%9B%E6%B3%B... and somehow it's Wikipedia's fault browsers do that?
- sbierwagen 6y agoIt is most certainly Wikipedia's fault that their style guide requires –, Unicode EN DASH U+2013, rather than -, Unicode HYPHEN-MINUS U+002D out of some misguided desire for typographical "correctness". That is 100% Wikipedia's choice, and it ruins their URLs, for no good reason.
- S_A_P 6y agoIve seen one of the documentaries about this festival. IMO, I dont think the perpetrators set out to defraud anyone. I think they were just completely inept at what they were doing. They(Billy McFarland) got in over their head and realized way too late that they were. I suppose the case can be made that they did realize early enough that they could have called it off before the dumpster fyre that it was happened. Not doing so seems solid grounds for a fraud case. I think that it is also possible that if he had admitted failure there is a chance he could have salvaged the event and had it later. That said I don't think it was an intent to defraud people or else they would not have even tried to put the event together. Why would all of this merch have been created if they just wanted to bilk investors and festival attendees? This is hubris and ignorance more than fraud.
- djsumdog 6y agoYou should watch both documentaries. It's weird how they have entirely different people in them, and they spin things slightly differently. I do think McFarland was a scam artist. His past history of scams shows he's one of these hustle culture people who commits outright fraud, and he deserves more jail time than he got.
- dylan604 6y agowhy is it weird? it's told from 2 different perspectives. every story has at least as many sides as there are people involved.
- aqme28 6y agoThe road to hell is paved with good intentions. Whether they intended to defraud anyone or not, they had ample warning that they were way in over their heads. After a certain point, it was criminal.
- 55555 6y agoWatch the Netflix documentary, and pay close attention to what he does after his failed festival. Either he's a scammer or Netflix is, as he seems to be running a new business where he sells tickets to events he doesn't have tickets for, and for which he has no way of getting them, and then ghosts the buyers. I think he didn't really set out to defraud anyone, but he has an incredible ego and sense of entitlement, and he got used to living a jetsetting lifestyle and didn't want to downgrade, so he defrauded people (in his newer business, after the festival). Given how naturally he did it, I'd be surprised if he hadn't been running ticket scams on and off for years.
- aaron695 6y agoThey were pretty close to a billion $ From the docos the interesting thing is they seemed like they almost would have became Cameo. Just like Riot-E also almost became 100 millionaires through their outrageous fake it till you make it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0lrIi0ce5E https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0lrIi0ce5E (NSFW)
- Animats 6y agoThe endgame: Name: WILLIAM MCFARLAND Register Number: 91186-054 Age: 28 Race: White Sex: Male Release Date: 08/30/2023 Located At: FCI Elkton
- rsa25519 6y agoWhat's this?
- Melting_Harps 6y ago> What's this? His bio/profile and location of incarceration. I'll also add he tested positive for Corona virus [1] after confirming the prison location he was in. 1: https://nypost.com/2020/07/04/fyre-fest-fraudster-billy-mcfarland-contracts-covid-19-in-prison/ https://nypost.com/2020/07/04/fyre-fest-fraudster-billy-mcfa...
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- monadic2 6y agoWhere does the money go?
- ogre_codes 6y agoI was thinking it might be fun to have a cap or a shirt from this... then I saw the prices. $500 for a ball cap? I'm wondering if anyone is actually going to pay for this stuff or if it's just a bunch of K-Pop fans driving up prices only to abandon them.
- selectodude 6y agoIt’s a bunch of finance bros spending their bonus on this crap instead of going on vacation. Some harmless fun.
- _jal 6y ago> $500 for a ball cap? Seriously - if any more hilariously incompetent festivals come along, remember to watch the liquidation auctions.
- ogre_codes 6y agoSo I can make my own knock-off ball-caps to sell!
- msla 6y ago> $500 for a ball cap? What did you think this was, a Fyre sale? SDNY got to get paid, son.
- pbhjpbhj 6y agoNormally auction houses require pre-registration and demonstration of payment ability and signing a contract promising to pay. They verify ID by taking credit card details. If they're thinking of ducking out on large amounts they're taking a large risk; it's probably worth sending a $500 tab (plus storage charges and administration) to collections ... plus they have your credit card info. Maybe though.
- kevin_thibedeau 6y agoJust have one made. Nobody's going to protect the trademark.
- edsouza 6y agoFyre Festival information: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fyre_Festival https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fyre_Festival
- msla 6y agoInternet Historian has a video on the subject: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBPg5ftCMv8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBPg5ftCMv8
- nrmitchi 6y agoI first thought these were bids for lots of items, like... cases of the item. Am I mistaken that these are actually bids on a single, quantity=1, item? It's actually impressive if they're auctioning off failed-festival merch at Supreme prices.
- adjkant 6y agoI think you're underestimating how much of a meme this is. Some of these I actually considered for a hot second in my head.
- onetimemanytime 6y ago>>Am I mistaken that these are actually bids on a single, quantity=1, item? Ja Rule was in the vicinity of such items, we are lucky they're so cheap considering ;)
- frostburg 6y agoIt's basically the same thing, and I say this as someone who gives money to Rick Owens.
- tyingq 6y agoI sort of wonder if someone is trolling them with a credit card that's going to be invalid before the auction ends. Who bids $500 for a single hat you can reproduce on any custom hat site?
- evolve2k 6y agoI just assumed it was rich influencer fashion types who were keen to own a piece of infamy and had the disposal wealth to not over think it and just bid on homepage items. “Hey is that hat from Fyre festival?” “Yeah it’s real, I got it online for $500”
- wyclif 6y agoPerfect to wear to that next Kool-Aid drinking SV investor meeting.
- m3kw9 6y agoThey robbing people again with those prices.
- Reedx 6y agoExcept it's an auction... It seems people are just determined to keep throwing money into the Fyre.
- shadowgovt 6y agoThis would be more surprising to me if I hadn't seen the guys who make Cards Against Humanity get a bunch of money thrown at them to dig a hole a few years back.
- gkoberger 6y agoIt's an auction, so the prices are set by how much people are willing to bid.
- sebastien_b 6y agoOr how stupid the people running the police departments think people are.
- TallGuyShort 6y agoYou can see the number of bids on each item. The $505 adjustable baseball cap isn't a price set by the police, it's what the 45th bid was.
- chrisco255 6y agoThe more they run the name down, the more the price goes up.
- refurb 6y agoFor the first item there are 45 bids, so obviously there are people that disagree this is "robbery".
- sebastien_b 6y agoMy work is having a “clear the office out before the move” auction - I can try for a few macMinis for about $200 total, or help fund a police department for Fyre swag, single item. Tough choice.
- rsa25519 6y agoI assume you're being sarcastic, but a Fyre hat sounds very badass. If I had the disposable income, I'd love one
- Galaxity 6y agoIt's not badass.
- bottlelion 6y agoIt is badass.
- downrightmike 6y agoIs it ho?
- sebastien_b 6y agoMaybe $1 badass. But not $500.
- tootie 6y agoDoes the SDNY keep this money or does it go to restitution?
- nickphx 6y agoGoes to the victims.
- djsumdog 6y agoI was wondering that too. I'm glad, although I'm guessing it won't be that much compared to how much they defrauded people. I'm guessing everyone might get like $50 back for a $1k ticket?
- adjkant 6y agoThe people who bought the tickets are likely not the victims it's going to, or at least I hope not. Watch the Hulu documentary if you want more context.
- djsumdog 6y agoI've seen both documentaries. I know that one women who owned the restaurant and provided a bunch of workers did have a gofundme that helped get back a lot of what she lost.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- strstr 6y agoOh man these are collector’s items. I’d love to have one of the hats. Not $500 want, but I’d probably have spent double the price of the hat on them. Maybe $50-60 or something.
- evan_ 6y agoyou could probably just print one on RedBubble. I don't think anyone will stop you.
- thelean12 6y agoThen it's not collectible or particularly interesting. That's just a hat.
- Galaxity 6y agoWho could tell the difference?
- verroq 6y agoPeople who buy collectibles are going to ask for proof of authenticity and the chain of custody.
- throwawaygh 6y agoThe value of these sorts of things will drop precipitously with time. Who's going to remember/care about fyre in 20 years?
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- khazhoux 6y ago"Bob, I wanna show you something, hang on... OK, here it is.. Remember that Fyre festival a few year ago?" "The scam thing?" "Yes! This... is a real Fyre merch hat!! Got it at auction." "Huh."
- barkingcat 6y agothe auction is also a fraud meant to recoup funds from the festival fraud...
- anonymfus 6y agoI wonder if a merch for other fraud schemes existed how much would it cost and who would buy it? Imagine Bernie Madoff's t-shorts.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- anonymfus 6y agoImmediately after writing that I realised that Donald Trump's merch is essentially this.
- mguerville 6y agoSo I happen to know a bit of that world. I’m a collector of memorabilia of failed capitalist endeavors. The point others have made is very true about merch being hard to authenticate when you could just recreate on any custom T shirt / hat / mug site. But for some companies, Enron, Pets.com, and a couple others, merch still commands a high price (not Fyre level though). Personally I prefer to seek more rare and “inside baseball” artefacts but in some cases merch is the best I can do (or an autographed book).
- gen220 6y agoMy dad still has a ton of Netscape, Novell, and mp3.com branded gear from when he worked there in the 90s. The last time I went home I saw it just laying around in the garage with his bootleg cassettes and my childhood beach toys. Now some of it makes an awesome talk piece at the office, or at least it did when we still had one. :)
- mguerville 6y agoIf your dad is open to it, these three happen to be among the ones i have never been able to find anything (mp3.com especially) so I’d be interested They would fit nicely : http://mattmg83.github.io/cynicalcapitalist/portfolio.html http://mattmg83.github.io/cynicalcapitalist/portfolio.html
- 6y ago
- mrnobody_67 6y ago$400 for a hat?
- bravoetch 6y agoThe money apparently goes to the victims. Maybe people are being charitable.
- rjmunro 6y agoIf it's anything like bankruptcy in the UK, it will go to the subset of the "victims" who have the best lawyers. Fees for Lawyers and accountants dealing with the bankruptcy will be deducted first. Any money owed to banks will be paid next. If there is any left, it will go to pay any taxes owed to the government or the local authorities. Eventually whatever is left will be divided proportionally between whoever is left owed money, but this will probably be a tiny fraction of the amount they are owed, if anything at all.
- alasdair_ 6y agoI wonder at what point the logo and other IP goes up for sale. Also, if those caps get major media attention, I can see them going for thousands of dollars to a celebrity (someone like Kanye West). I’d bet wearing the cap alone would generate several articles and other press coverage.
- bmitc 6y agoWho gets the money from such an auction? Does it act as repayment for those defrauded? Does it go to the government?
- rootsudo 6y agohttps://www.etsy.com/listing/834383864/ https://www.etsy.com/listing/834383864/ Here you go guys, you're welcome.
- londons_explore 6y agoWhere does the revenue from this auction go? Presumably it's given to creditors of the fyre festival? What if there is an excess?
- sumtechguy 6y agoOne of a few possible places. If the festival has fines they can not pay. It goes towards that any leftover would be credited back to the people who were fined. If it is just seized material that was abandoned or seized in the act of criminality then back into the treasury or the marshals general funds.
- dmschulman 6y agohacker news: "if left unchecked, the powers of the federal government will prove quite onerous" also hacker news: "i need this hat" [pays $700 to u.s. marshalls]
- Archit3ch 6y agoFraud associations aside, Fyre would be a great name for a startup.
- saddestcatever 6y agoThey tried! "Fyre Media" was the talent-boooking app/startup that Billy was trying to get off the ground in parallel with the festival :P https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/fyre-media-inc https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/fyre-media-inc > Fyre Media, an app that ostensibly allows customers to book performing artists for private events, and the Fyre Festival was intended to be an extension of that brand. https://www.vice.com/en_ca/article/qvz5m3/fyre-festivals-25-year-old-organizer-this-is-the-worst-day-of-my-life https://www.vice.com/en_ca/article/qvz5m3/fyre-festivals-25-...
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- webel0 6y agoI also think that most of these “lots” are just for one item. However, I think that the bids are probably mostly earnest. As streetware a lot of this could probably be considered collector’s items among the hype beast crowd. The prices seem to be in a range similar to supreme and similar.
- atwebb 6y agoThis must be how people feel when I talk about databases, I am speculating on meanings from context.
- shadowprofile77 6y agoThese prices are insane! And the weird thing is that the site's showing multiple (in some cases dozens) of bids for items like single perfectly ordinary, even boring looking T shirts for over $100 dollars. Who'd be bidding at these prices and why? (Note: I have absolutely no knowledge of what the Fyre festival is/was or its relevance to anything, but even then, what makes it momentous enough for these prices?)
- Doxin 6y agoFor some context: fyre festival was supposed to be a high end luxury all-inclusive festival. Essentially everything in the planning -- aside perhaps from the advertising -- went poorly to the extreme. In the end all that managed to actually get arranged was the flight to the island location. Once there people more or less found themselves stranded in a tent camp with no food and too few mattresses instead of the luxury festival they were promised. There's a couple documentaries on the whole thing which I can recommend watching, it's almost impressive how monumentally poor everything got planned. The whole thing of course strikes a chord with the ironic-fashion crowd.