3 ms·

what does jailing someone achieve here? what is with this gross authoritarianism? most of these people using these bright LEDs dont realize how bright it is for

what does jailing someone achieve here? what is with this gross authoritarianism? most of these people using these bright LEDs dont realize how bright it is for the other drivers - it's probably just to make the roads brighter because driving in America is extremely different than the rest of the world (very very rural highways - with essentially no extra lighting)

giancarlostoro 6y ago
When you are literally blinded by somebody's headlights making you momentarily blind, you are a danger to yourself and others and could kill yourself and / or others which is not even your fault to begin with! Jail time doesn't sound too insane then. I've literally had to close my eyes whilst driving due to someone's ridiculous headlights being super bright on the opposite side of the road.
- aaomidi 6y ago
  Jail should be only reserved for a time when a person is refusing to change their behavior to stop being a risk to themselves or society. It is not and should not be used as a punishment. This is ridiculous.
  - Dylan16807 6y ago
    So write a ticket the first time, and if they don't change then jail for endangering others, right? I don't think people are especially concerned about the exact punishment schedule here, they just want consequences that result in safe cars, much like with drunk driving laws. Someone mentioning jail doesn't mean they want it as an immediate first-line consequence. It's a simplification, so please recognize that before crying 'ridiculous'.
    - jacquesm 6y ago
      No, then you confiscate the car. Walk home and you will be a lot smarter by the time you get there.
      - Dylan16807 6y ago
        That sounds like a bigger punishment!
        danShumway 6y ago
        Taking away someone's transportation would be a bigger punishment than locking them inside a prison? Prisoners also can't drive cars around, so jail is a strict superset of that punishment. I'm not going to take a hard position on it, but I'm at least mildly skeptical that jail would ever be appropriate for something that can be just as easily solved by progressive fines and revoking a license. Jails in the US are really awful, so they'd need to produce great results for me to prefer putting someone into one of them. And it's not clear to me that they even reduce recidivism rates for crimes of this nature any more than other alternatives. We should be pretty hesitant to send people to prison. Particularly with the knowledge of how calls for increased "tough on crime" policing typically go in America -- well meaning people should keep in mind that advocating for the expansion of carceral laws often results in unintended consequences.
        Dylan16807 6y ago
        Jail is much more short term than prison. It can easily be a smaller punishment than having to buy a replacement car. Especially if it's something like this, where you might only spend a day or two there and have community service on top.
        namibj 6y ago
        You can have your car back if you fix the headlights. Make it be a mandatory appointment to show up at after e.g. a week and get your car checked for having fixed your headlighs. Also, have a choice of getting your car booted with some electronic boot that you can unlock after sunrise, or getting your car towed. You'll have to show up for the checkup anyways, so that's when you can drop the boot off. Either way, imprisonment won't fix the problem, which is a faulty vehicle. The inconvenience of not being able to drive the car until after sunrise, along with a typical towing/booting fee, should be sufficient incentive to not drive with faulty lights, given how easy they would be for police cars to measure/detect with an inexpensive, small camera unit at a proper location on the police car, which then signals the driver about a suspected violation. Passing a police car that doesn't have anything better to do, while you have your faulty lights on, should be common enough to make driving like that a risk too high.
    - giancarlostoro 6y ago
      You are correct, I dont care the punishment schedule as you put it, but here if you keep avoiding paying a ticket they will jail you for a few days. I have had a relative go to jail for not paying a ticket, it wasnt fun but hes highly unlikely to not pay a driving ticket or make the same mjstake. Whats worse is I think he paid for it but somehow the wrong county was involved or some mess its been a few years so I cant remember what the mixup was.
  - giancarlostoro 6y ago
    I didnt mean to imply they would immediately go to jail, but usually laws come with consequences and jail would eventually be up in that tree of consequences.
dominotw 6y ago
> most of these people using these bright LEDs dont realize how bright it is for the other drivers How can you possibly not know that. You are literally making them bighter so it would obviously be brighter for the drivers too. why do you think its illegal in the first place.
- aaomidi 6y ago
  Again because most of American roads have literally no lighting. They are not raised from the surrounding land. They have no sort of guard rails. If you want to drive safely at night on these roads you need a longer visibility distance. You're likely not thinking about if this is going to bother someone else or not. And most US law isn't even clear on whats street legal and whats not.
acituan 6y ago
> what is with this gross authoritarianism? most of these people using these bright LEDs dont realize how bright it is for the other drivers There are wishes for gross authoritarianism because US has problems with lesser, appropriate regulations. The way other countries handle this is periodic vehicle inspections - just like smog checks but with more points - which also measure from the lumens and angle of your headlights to whether your wipers work properly, failure of which bars your car off the public roads. If this was suggested in the US eyes would roll, heads would turn, nanny state arguments would be invoked. In the absence of reifying such moderate measures, people let go of their pent up frustrations of failing to be a cooperating society in the form of wishing imprisonment or worse onto each other.
- vonmoltke 6y ago
  > If this was suggested in the US eyes would roll, heads would turn, nanny state arguments would be invoked. Yet several states do this, including Texas of all places.

giancarlostoro 6y ago

When you are literally blinded by somebody's headlights making you momentarily blind, you are a danger to yourself and others and could kill yourself and / or others which is not even your fault to begin with! Jail time doesn't sound too insane then. I've literally had to close my eyes whilst driving due to someone's ridiculous headlights being super bright on the opposite side of the road.

aaomidi 6y ago
Jail should be only reserved for a time when a person is refusing to change their behavior to stop being a risk to themselves or society. It is not and should not be used as a punishment. This is ridiculous.
- Dylan16807 6y ago
  So write a ticket the first time, and if they don't change then jail for endangering others, right? I don't think people are especially concerned about the exact punishment schedule here, they just want consequences that result in safe cars, much like with drunk driving laws. Someone mentioning jail doesn't mean they want it as an immediate first-line consequence. It's a simplification, so please recognize that before crying 'ridiculous'.
  - jacquesm 6y ago
    No, then you confiscate the car. Walk home and you will be a lot smarter by the time you get there.
    - Dylan16807 6y ago
      That sounds like a bigger punishment!
      - danShumway 6y ago
        Taking away someone's transportation would be a bigger punishment than locking them inside a prison? Prisoners also can't drive cars around, so jail is a strict superset of that punishment. I'm not going to take a hard position on it, but I'm at least mildly skeptical that jail would ever be appropriate for something that can be just as easily solved by progressive fines and revoking a license. Jails in the US are really awful, so they'd need to produce great results for me to prefer putting someone into one of them. And it's not clear to me that they even reduce recidivism rates for crimes of this nature any more than other alternatives. We should be pretty hesitant to send people to prison. Particularly with the knowledge of how calls for increased "tough on crime" policing typically go in America -- well meaning people should keep in mind that advocating for the expansion of carceral laws often results in unintended consequences.
        Dylan16807 6y ago
        Jail is much more short term than prison. It can easily be a smaller punishment than having to buy a replacement car. Especially if it's something like this, where you might only spend a day or two there and have community service on top.
        namibj 6y ago
        You can have your car back if you fix the headlights. Make it be a mandatory appointment to show up at after e.g. a week and get your car checked for having fixed your headlighs. Also, have a choice of getting your car booted with some electronic boot that you can unlock after sunrise, or getting your car towed. You'll have to show up for the checkup anyways, so that's when you can drop the boot off. Either way, imprisonment won't fix the problem, which is a faulty vehicle. The inconvenience of not being able to drive the car until after sunrise, along with a typical towing/booting fee, should be sufficient incentive to not drive with faulty lights, given how easy they would be for police cars to measure/detect with an inexpensive, small camera unit at a proper location on the police car, which then signals the driver about a suspected violation. Passing a police car that doesn't have anything better to do, while you have your faulty lights on, should be common enough to make driving like that a risk too high.
  - giancarlostoro 6y ago
    You are correct, I dont care the punishment schedule as you put it, but here if you keep avoiding paying a ticket they will jail you for a few days. I have had a relative go to jail for not paying a ticket, it wasnt fun but hes highly unlikely to not pay a driving ticket or make the same mjstake. Whats worse is I think he paid for it but somehow the wrong county was involved or some mess its been a few years so I cant remember what the mixup was.
- giancarlostoro 6y ago
  I didnt mean to imply they would immediately go to jail, but usually laws come with consequences and jail would eventually be up in that tree of consequences.

dominotw 6y ago

> most of these people using these bright LEDs dont realize how bright it is for the other drivers How can you possibly not know that. You are literally making them bighter so it would obviously be brighter for the drivers too. why do you think its illegal in the first place.

aaomidi 6y ago
Again because most of American roads have literally no lighting. They are not raised from the surrounding land. They have no sort of guard rails. If you want to drive safely at night on these roads you need a longer visibility distance. You're likely not thinking about if this is going to bother someone else or not. And most US law isn't even clear on whats street legal and whats not.

acituan 6y ago

> what is with this gross authoritarianism? most of these people using these bright LEDs dont realize how bright it is for the other drivers There are wishes for gross authoritarianism because US has problems with lesser, appropriate regulations. The way other countries handle this is periodic vehicle inspections - just like smog checks but with more points - which also measure from the lumens and angle of your headlights to whether your wipers work properly, failure of which bars your car off the public roads. If this was suggested in the US eyes would roll, heads would turn, nanny state arguments would be invoked. In the absence of reifying such moderate measures, people let go of their pent up frustrations of failing to be a cooperating society in the form of wishing imprisonment or worse onto each other.

vonmoltke 6y ago
> If this was suggested in the US eyes would roll, heads would turn, nanny state arguments would be invoked. Yet several states do this, including Texas of all places.