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Brexiteers won't be reasoned with and being reasonable is seen as weakness by them. But that's not true at all. If you asked a Brexiteer, they would say Articl

Brexiteers won't be reasoned with and being reasonable is seen as weakness by them. But that's not true at all. If you asked a Brexiteer, they would say Article 50 could have been invoked the day after the referendum, and instead they spent 2 whole years trying to find an accommodation that would satisfy Remainers too, you can't ask for any more "reasoning with" than that. But Remainers wouldn't budge from the position of ignoring the referendum result completely, they had no regard whatsoever for the wishes of Brexiteers. None at all. We could have had such a soft Brexit that it would have been indistinguishable from remaining, but hardline Remainers made that all but impossible with their intransigence. Eventually the entire country grew tired of those antics and delivered Boris an 80-seat majority on his single mantra of "get Brexit done". I know this is off-narrative but the Brexiteers bent over backwards to be reasonable.

jjgreen 6y ago
I think you will find that that is Cummings's mantra; credit where it's due.
pjc50 6y ago
No, it was the insistence on avoiding ECJ jurisdiction and ending free movement that caused hard Brexit. Nothing more. There was no support from conservatives for the softer "indicative votes".
ben_w 6y ago
That’s not what it looked like from the outside. From the outside, Leavers ran the government. Leavers insisted that May was a great negotiator by holding her cards close to her chest (and then fired her ASAP when they saw her cards). From the outside, Leavers openly told Remainers that Leavers had no reason to compromise with anyone — not the EU, not Remainers, and not each other. Every time I discussed anything with a Leaver, my concerns were always and without fail dismissed as “Project Fear” — the other party would even say that about the possibility of no deal while saying no deal was their negotiating tactic. Now, I don’t doubt that you’ve seen some idiots promoting Remain just as I’ve seen idiots promoting Leave — but can you give any example of Leave trying to compromise with Remain? Not with each other (basically everyone hates what May came up with, Remain and Leave alike), not with the EU, but with Remain?
- disgruntledphd2 6y ago
  May's deal was the worst possible Brexit deal, except for all the others :) It would have been about as good as Brexit could have been, conditional on reducing immigration bring the primary goal.

jjgreen 6y ago

I think you will find that that is Cummings's mantra; credit where it's due.

pjc50 6y ago

No, it was the insistence on avoiding ECJ jurisdiction and ending free movement that caused hard Brexit. Nothing more. There was no support from conservatives for the softer "indicative votes".

ben_w 6y ago

That’s not what it looked like from the outside. From the outside, Leavers ran the government. Leavers insisted that May was a great negotiator by holding her cards close to her chest (and then fired her ASAP when they saw her cards). From the outside, Leavers openly told Remainers that Leavers had no reason to compromise with anyone — not the EU, not Remainers, and not each other. Every time I discussed anything with a Leaver, my concerns were always and without fail dismissed as “Project Fear” — the other party would even say that about the possibility of no deal while saying no deal was their negotiating tactic. Now, I don’t doubt that you’ve seen some idiots promoting Remain just as I’ve seen idiots promoting Leave — but can you give any example of Leave trying to compromise with Remain? Not with each other (basically everyone hates what May came up with, Remain and Leave alike), not with the EU, but with Remain?

disgruntledphd2 6y ago
May's deal was the worst possible Brexit deal, except for all the others :) It would have been about as good as Brexit could have been, conditional on reducing immigration bring the primary goal.