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If the kind of open source you mention were actually valuable, there would be a market for it. You make a common mistake many people make when trying to calcula

If the kind of open source you mention were actually valuable, there would be a market for it. You make a common mistake many people make when trying to calculate value: it has nothing to do with how much something is used, it has to do with the incentives for those creating it. People do not casually write open source to make money (unless sponsored by a company). They do it for the recognition and for vanity, and I’d argue that popular open source software is not scarce as evidenced by how much there is of it. People will in fact rush to fill the void of open source such that the popular open source is more of a fluke than anything: if it wasn’t the react-router it would be something other nearly identical, where there are plenty of people waiting in line behind that.

i_cannot_hack 6y ago
1. It feels like you are at risk of some survivorship bias here. Yes, the software that currently exist were apparently made anyway, and is popular enough to be replaced if it went missing. But you have no way to quantify how many possibly useful or innovative OSS projects were never made because of the lack of financial opportunities. 2. I feel the whole idea of this kind of open source patronage / funding is to decouple the market value of the software (which is $0) from the compensation to the contributors for their time and effort (which I think should be above $0 in an ideal world)
imtringued 6y ago
I have a very nice pet project with a user base in the single digits and I'd like to keep it that way. I know all my users personally and I am even using it for several hours per week myself. I couldn't care less about recognition or vanity. People create opensource software because they have an itch they need to scratch, not because they want to get attention. Attention is expensive and involves scratching other people's itches, not yours. It means nagging users who demand things from you and drain your sanity all while making money off of your work. It's only natural that you want something in return. >If the kind of open source you mention were actually valuable, there would be a market for it. This argument makes no sense. If the software isn't valuable (as in worth a lot) then nobody would use it. Opensource software cannot become popular without providing value. Open source software is not valuable in the sense that it cannot be valued. You can't put a price tag on a non exclusive good if you're not selling it in the first place. Another flaw in your argument is that you are assuming that because there is no market for something there will never be one. Github sponorships, liberapay, patreon and lots of other platforms are clearly in the process of creating a market for these things. People are clearly willing to fund opensource software if it is possible. Just take a look at neovim! [0] [0] https://salt.bountysource.com/teams/neovim https://salt.bountysource.com/teams/neovim
rikroots 6y ago
> People do not casually write open source to make money (unless sponsored by a company). They do it for the recognition and for vanity. 1. I would like to make a little bit of money from my open source projects. I like money. But if no money comes ... that's okay too. It won't stop me coding for fun. 2. I write open source code because I enjoy the freedom to work on what interests me, and I can devote some time to it. I expect many developers would like to contribute to open source but can't; they have to put their time and effort into other areas of their life. People are weird. They often do stuff without the need for an incentive to do it. Code up a pet project, write poetry or stories in their diaries, build an entire constructed world that nobody else will ever be interested in - all just for the fun of it.

i_cannot_hack 6y ago

1. It feels like you are at risk of some survivorship bias here. Yes, the software that currently exist were apparently made anyway, and is popular enough to be replaced if it went missing. But you have no way to quantify how many possibly useful or innovative OSS projects were never made because of the lack of financial opportunities. 2. I feel the whole idea of this kind of open source patronage / funding is to decouple the market value of the software (which is $0) from the compensation to the contributors for their time and effort (which I think should be above $0 in an ideal world)

imtringued 6y ago

I have a very nice pet project with a user base in the single digits and I'd like to keep it that way. I know all my users personally and I am even using it for several hours per week myself. I couldn't care less about recognition or vanity. People create opensource software because they have an itch they need to scratch, not because they want to get attention. Attention is expensive and involves scratching other people's itches, not yours. It means nagging users who demand things from you and drain your sanity all while making money off of your work. It's only natural that you want something in return. >If the kind of open source you mention were actually valuable, there would be a market for it. This argument makes no sense. If the software isn't valuable (as in worth a lot) then nobody would use it. Opensource software cannot become popular without providing value. Open source software is not valuable in the sense that it cannot be valued. You can't put a price tag on a non exclusive good if you're not selling it in the first place. Another flaw in your argument is that you are assuming that because there is no market for something there will never be one. Github sponorships, liberapay, patreon and lots of other platforms are clearly in the process of creating a market for these things. People are clearly willing to fund opensource software if it is possible. Just take a look at neovim! [0] [0] https://salt.bountysource.com/teams/neovim https://salt.bountysource.com/teams/neovim

rikroots 6y ago

> People do not casually write open source to make money (unless sponsored by a company). They do it for the recognition and for vanity. 1. I would like to make a little bit of money from my open source projects. I like money. But if no money comes ... that's okay too. It won't stop me coding for fun. 2. I write open source code because I enjoy the freedom to work on what interests me, and I can devote some time to it. I expect many developers would like to contribute to open source but can't; they have to put their time and effort into other areas of their life. People are weird. They often do stuff without the need for an incentive to do it. Code up a pet project, write poetry or stories in their diaries, build an entire constructed world that nobody else will ever be interested in - all just for the fun of it.