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We're in strange times if you can't call a flat-earther an idiot and a moron. What's next, I can't call a Nazi a piece of shit? There are objectively correct t

by jbob2000 6y ago

We're in strange times if you can't call a flat-earther an idiot and a moron. What's next, I can't call a Nazi a piece of shit? There are objectively correct times to use insults, this is definitely one of them.

chrisseaton 6y ago
I disagree I think personal abuse is always wrong. You can deal with even the most extreme situations and even the worst people while still being respectful.
- pavel_lishin 6y ago
  You can, but you ain't gotta. Not everyone deserves our respect, especially not those calling for ethnic cleansing.
- IgorPartola 6y ago
  Honest question: do you believe everyone deserves respect no matter what they do? I am all for keeping things civil as much as possible and keeping conversations polite. But to me respect is earned, not a given.
  - chrisseaton 6y ago
    A basic standard of respect, yes. You can think someone isn't good at their job, or that they're mistaken, or that they make bad choices. But there's never any reason to resort to using personal abuse.
    - IgorPartola 6y ago
      So if you are in a building held hostage by a terrorist they deserve your basic respect? You’d never use violence or abuse against them? Or a mugger? Or a Nazi camp guard? Or a gay conversion therapist? Or a rapist who violated you? Or someone who falsely accused you of rape? Or someone who murdered someone you love?
- eplanit 6y ago
  Meh. When a person identifies with a stupid idea (i.e. "I'm a flat earther"), then the person is stupid along with the idea, and it's okay to say so (IMHO). It's good for evolution to give such "corrections".
- TeaDrunk 6y ago
  I think it’s possible to approach all situations respectfully but that the difficulty bound to do so varies depending on the parties and position being discussed. At some point and some edge cases it’s extremely unfair to expect polite responses. (Eg. Blaming a Black person for responding “fuck off” to a white person who says “lynching was good actually it keeps blacks in their place” is distinctly unfair to the black person as they are then expected to take and accept dehumanization and abusive language without responding as if they’ve been dehumanized or abused).
- bluecalm 6y ago
  Insulting someone is not abuse or at least shouldn't be. It's only abuse if you have power over someone and your insults cause them to experience social repercussions.
krapp 6y ago
> We're in strange times if you can't call a flat-earther an idiot and a moron. What's next, I can't call a Nazi a piece of shit? The context here is someone being banned from a platform for violating their requirement that posters be polite on their platform. This isn't a "sign of the times," nor does it conflate to some greater societal or cultural shift, or have any implications on mores, values or free speech. No one is saying you can't call flat earthers idiots or Nazis pieces of shit in general. If Quora requires you to be polite when giving answers to questions, they're well within their rights to boot you if you aren't, regardless of how justified it might be.
- jbob2000 6y ago
  A platform isn’t some magical place with no basis in society, they don’t exist in some walled-off world where the real world is alien. They are still part of the general culture. It’s a fault of Quora to have dogmatic rules like this, there are justifications for impoliteness.
  - krapp 6y ago
    It's not a fault of theirs, it's a business decision. They want to project an image of authoritativeness and professionalism, and rules of polite candor accomplish that. It's no different than Hacker News requiring civility or Stack Overflow requiring on-topic, non general discussion. Not every platform does, or should, have the purpose of allowing free flowing discussion.

chrisseaton 6y ago

I disagree I think personal abuse is always wrong. You can deal with even the most extreme situations and even the worst people while still being respectful.

pavel_lishin 6y ago
You can, but you ain't gotta. Not everyone deserves our respect, especially not those calling for ethnic cleansing.
IgorPartola 6y ago
Honest question: do you believe everyone deserves respect no matter what they do? I am all for keeping things civil as much as possible and keeping conversations polite. But to me respect is earned, not a given.
- chrisseaton 6y ago
  A basic standard of respect, yes. You can think someone isn't good at their job, or that they're mistaken, or that they make bad choices. But there's never any reason to resort to using personal abuse.
  - IgorPartola 6y ago
    So if you are in a building held hostage by a terrorist they deserve your basic respect? You’d never use violence or abuse against them? Or a mugger? Or a Nazi camp guard? Or a gay conversion therapist? Or a rapist who violated you? Or someone who falsely accused you of rape? Or someone who murdered someone you love?
eplanit 6y ago
Meh. When a person identifies with a stupid idea (i.e. "I'm a flat earther"), then the person is stupid along with the idea, and it's okay to say so (IMHO). It's good for evolution to give such "corrections".
TeaDrunk 6y ago
I think it’s possible to approach all situations respectfully but that the difficulty bound to do so varies depending on the parties and position being discussed. At some point and some edge cases it’s extremely unfair to expect polite responses. (Eg. Blaming a Black person for responding “fuck off” to a white person who says “lynching was good actually it keeps blacks in their place” is distinctly unfair to the black person as they are then expected to take and accept dehumanization and abusive language without responding as if they’ve been dehumanized or abused).
bluecalm 6y ago
Insulting someone is not abuse or at least shouldn't be. It's only abuse if you have power over someone and your insults cause them to experience social repercussions.

krapp 6y ago

> We're in strange times if you can't call a flat-earther an idiot and a moron. What's next, I can't call a Nazi a piece of shit? The context here is someone being banned from a platform for violating their requirement that posters be polite on their platform. This isn't a "sign of the times," nor does it conflate to some greater societal or cultural shift, or have any implications on mores, values or free speech. No one is saying you can't call flat earthers idiots or Nazis pieces of shit in general. If Quora requires you to be polite when giving answers to questions, they're well within their rights to boot you if you aren't, regardless of how justified it might be.

jbob2000 6y ago
A platform isn’t some magical place with no basis in society, they don’t exist in some walled-off world where the real world is alien. They are still part of the general culture. It’s a fault of Quora to have dogmatic rules like this, there are justifications for impoliteness.
- krapp 6y ago
  It's not a fault of theirs, it's a business decision. They want to project an image of authoritativeness and professionalism, and rules of polite candor accomplish that. It's no different than Hacker News requiring civility or Stack Overflow requiring on-topic, non general discussion. Not every platform does, or should, have the purpose of allowing free flowing discussion.