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You're only looking at the death rate. Take a look at the hospitalization rate (~20% for all age groups) and the amount of resources it takes to just keep one p

You're only looking at the death rate. Take a look at the hospitalization rate (~20% for all age groups) and the amount of resources it takes to just keep one person alive. ICUs and hospital staffs are stretched to the brink. People indeed are surviving, but at great expense, and the hospitals have said they can't keep this up much longer. In Houston, TX there was a doctor who had worked 117 days straight and had to be relieved by Army Medical personnel (https://abc13.com/health/85-soldiers-arriving-to-help-treat-covid-19-patients/6317426/ https://abc13.com/health/85-soldiers-arriving-to-help-treat-...). There's just not enough ICU beds and medical staff to go around. Once we run out of hospital resources, the death rate will jump 5-10x. If that happens, you're talking 20+ million deaths in the U.S., on pace with the 1918 pandemic if not worse. If you think the economy is bad now, wait til 20+ million people suddenly aren't shopping anymore. Lastly, consider all of the people who have "recovered" but haven't really recovered, this includes the young 20-30 yr old crowds. There's hundreds of support groups now focused on post-corona-syndrome where people are 100+ days into the recovery but still have symptoms, including brain damage, neurological issues, strokes, kidney failures, shortness of breath, etc. It seems as if the older people are dying, and the younger patients are surviving, but with long-term damage.

an_opabinia 6y ago
Another way of putting is that lockdowns won’t end with a vaccine, they’ll end if there was enough hospital capacity for congressmen and rich people. Why not build more hospitals?
- IgorPartola 6y ago
  Because it takes years, and even longer to ramp up the capacity fo medical and nursing schools to staff all of them. Because having ICU beds doesn’t prevent deaths, only reduce them, so a large percentage of the population will still die. Because a vaccine is cheaper and better.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- tchaffee 6y ago
  It takes a long time to build doctors and nurses.
dead_mall 6y ago
This is greatly exaggerated and it's really not as bad as you're making it sound. People are surviving at no expense, and even if anything you said were true, that still doesn't justify the reason to go get vaccinated. People here are being downvoted just for being anti-vax and skeptical about it. It seems to me a bunch of fear mongering going around. 20+ million is laughably exaggerated, Worldometer says there has only been 600k deaths total corona related. Who knows if there statistics is even real though cause just last month, it said there were only 350k deaths. There has been times where they've even been manipulated https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.republicworld.com/amp/technology-news/other-tech-news/attempts-to-hack-website-publishing-coronavirus-statistics.html https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.republicworld.com/amp/techn... On top of that, just go on google search and look up "covid X patients" where X is any number you can think of, and you'll legit get fabricated results that will fit your search narrative. Now mix this with fear mongering social media people and you've got a force of people advocating for a truly skeptic vaccine
- ModernMech 6y ago
  > Worldometer says there has only been 600k deaths total corona related. Who knows if there statistics is even real though cause just last month, it said there were only 350k deaths. That's what happens when between 4k and 5k people die per day over 50 days.
- IgorPartola 6y ago
  How do you know what you’ve been reading about how it’s all exaggerated is real? How do you know that what you google about is real? Are you sure it’s not a Russian-Chinese conspiracy? We could look at facts and decide what to do about them or we could argue about what a fact is and what a fact isn’t. If you can’t accept facts and are unable to educate yourself, nobody will do that for you.
moneywoes 6y ago
Can you provide links regarding post covid symptoms
- benjaminwootton 6y ago
  I would love to see the hundreds of support groups. This is an urban myth about the long term damage.
  - ljf 6y ago
    I can agree that there is very very limited research on the long term impacts (since this is so new) - but thousands of people are struggling to recover from this - often people who were not dangerously ill with covid to start with. The 'long haulers' covid group my wife is on has had people uncovering heart scarring, nerve damage and other issues when they have been lucky enough to find a supportive doctor. Most are currently not seeing specialists as they cannot get referrals or the waiting lists are long. I have no idea if there are 'hundreds' of support groups - my wife is on a couple that largest of which has approaching 10000 members. Every time I post about her progress to Facebook I find more friends or friends of friends who know of people that haven't yet made a connection to a group of or who are only newly considering themselves 'long term ill'. Given what we know now, and the large wave of cases, there are many more people who will be suffering long term symptoms in the months to come. I really hope there is no long term damage - but I think you have to admit it is too early to say that with any confidence. The impacts or Ebola and SARs are well understood, so I'm not sure why people find it so hard to believe in the issues covid causes. Article: ‘I feel helpless’: three people on their grueling Covid-19 recoveries https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/20/coronavirus-side-effects-long-term-recovery-symptoms?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Notepad https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/20/coronavirus-...
- ljf 6y ago
  ‘I feel helpless’: three people on their grueling Covid-19 recoveries https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/20/coronavirus-side-effects-long-term-recovery-symptoms?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Notepad https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/20/coronavirus-...
orangecat 6y ago
Take a look at the hospitalization rate (~20% for all age groups) 0.66% of NYC residents have been hospitalized (https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page). Antibody tests show that at least 20% of NYC was infected, and that's likely an underestimate (antibodies take weeks to show up and may soon drop to undetectable levels). So the hospitalization rate is at most around 3%. Once we run out of hospital resources, the death rate will jump 5-10x. If that happens, you're talking 20+ million deaths in the U.S That's just not going to happen. There was essentially uncontrolled spread in NYC, and the hospitals were strained but not overwhelmed. The hospitalization and death rates in currently hard-hit states are much lower than peak NYC, and may already be at a plateau. It seems as if the older people are dying, and the younger patients are surviving, but with long-term damage. This is a real concern, but I'd like data rather than anecdotes.
tommymachine 6y ago
https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/COVIDNet/COVID19_5.html https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/COVIDNet/COVID19_5.html This shows clear counter evidence to the claim of hospitalization rate being ~20% for all age groups. This CDC data shows a steep increase in the hospitalization rate as age increases. Not sure where you are getting your information.

an_opabinia 6y ago

Another way of putting is that lockdowns won’t end with a vaccine, they’ll end if there was enough hospital capacity for congressmen and rich people. Why not build more hospitals?

IgorPartola 6y ago
Because it takes years, and even longer to ramp up the capacity fo medical and nursing schools to staff all of them. Because having ICU beds doesn’t prevent deaths, only reduce them, so a large percentage of the population will still die. Because a vaccine is cheaper and better.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
tchaffee 6y ago
It takes a long time to build doctors and nurses.

dead_mall 6y ago

This is greatly exaggerated and it's really not as bad as you're making it sound. People are surviving at no expense, and even if anything you said were true, that still doesn't justify the reason to go get vaccinated. People here are being downvoted just for being anti-vax and skeptical about it. It seems to me a bunch of fear mongering going around. 20+ million is laughably exaggerated, Worldometer says there has only been 600k deaths total corona related. Who knows if there statistics is even real though cause just last month, it said there were only 350k deaths. There has been times where they've even been manipulated https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.republicworld.com/amp/technology-news/other-tech-news/attempts-to-hack-website-publishing-coronavirus-statistics.html https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.republicworld.com/amp/techn... On top of that, just go on google search and look up "covid X patients" where X is any number you can think of, and you'll legit get fabricated results that will fit your search narrative. Now mix this with fear mongering social media people and you've got a force of people advocating for a truly skeptic vaccine

ModernMech 6y ago
> Worldometer says there has only been 600k deaths total corona related. Who knows if there statistics is even real though cause just last month, it said there were only 350k deaths. That's what happens when between 4k and 5k people die per day over 50 days.
IgorPartola 6y ago
How do you know what you’ve been reading about how it’s all exaggerated is real? How do you know that what you google about is real? Are you sure it’s not a Russian-Chinese conspiracy? We could look at facts and decide what to do about them or we could argue about what a fact is and what a fact isn’t. If you can’t accept facts and are unable to educate yourself, nobody will do that for you.

moneywoes 6y ago

Can you provide links regarding post covid symptoms

benjaminwootton 6y ago
I would love to see the hundreds of support groups. This is an urban myth about the long term damage.
- ljf 6y ago
  I can agree that there is very very limited research on the long term impacts (since this is so new) - but thousands of people are struggling to recover from this - often people who were not dangerously ill with covid to start with. The 'long haulers' covid group my wife is on has had people uncovering heart scarring, nerve damage and other issues when they have been lucky enough to find a supportive doctor. Most are currently not seeing specialists as they cannot get referrals or the waiting lists are long. I have no idea if there are 'hundreds' of support groups - my wife is on a couple that largest of which has approaching 10000 members. Every time I post about her progress to Facebook I find more friends or friends of friends who know of people that haven't yet made a connection to a group of or who are only newly considering themselves 'long term ill'. Given what we know now, and the large wave of cases, there are many more people who will be suffering long term symptoms in the months to come. I really hope there is no long term damage - but I think you have to admit it is too early to say that with any confidence. The impacts or Ebola and SARs are well understood, so I'm not sure why people find it so hard to believe in the issues covid causes. Article: ‘I feel helpless’: three people on their grueling Covid-19 recoveries https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/20/coronavirus-side-effects-long-term-recovery-symptoms?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Notepad https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/20/coronavirus-...
ljf 6y ago
‘I feel helpless’: three people on their grueling Covid-19 recoveries https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/20/coronavirus-side-effects-long-term-recovery-symptoms?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Notepad https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/20/coronavirus-...

orangecat 6y ago

Take a look at the hospitalization rate (~20% for all age groups) 0.66% of NYC residents have been hospitalized (https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page). Antibody tests show that at least 20% of NYC was infected, and that's likely an underestimate (antibodies take weeks to show up and may soon drop to undetectable levels). So the hospitalization rate is at most around 3%. Once we run out of hospital resources, the death rate will jump 5-10x. If that happens, you're talking 20+ million deaths in the U.S That's just not going to happen. There was essentially uncontrolled spread in NYC, and the hospitals were strained but not overwhelmed. The hospitalization and death rates in currently hard-hit states are much lower than peak NYC, and may already be at a plateau. It seems as if the older people are dying, and the younger patients are surviving, but with long-term damage. This is a real concern, but I'd like data rather than anecdotes.

tommymachine 6y ago

https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/COVIDNet/COVID19_5.html https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/COVIDNet/COVID19_5.html This shows clear counter evidence to the claim of hospitalization rate being ~20% for all age groups. This CDC data shows a steep increase in the hospitalization rate as age increases. Not sure where you are getting your information.