6 ms·

....most of which are mild, and which accompany any virus: ”According to Segura, who co-authored the study, the most common symptoms experienced by coronavirus

by irq11 6y ago

....most of which are mild, and which accompany any virus: ”According to Segura, who co-authored the study, the most common symptoms experienced by coronavirus patients were myalgia, headaches and dizziness.” And the truly killer quote: ”Another large-scale study...showed that 90% of cases simultaneously experienced changes to, or the loss of, the sense of smell and taste. In most of these cases, these changes were the only clinical expression of coronavirus or were accompanied by other minor symptoms.”

deelowe 6y ago
There is a reason we get so concerned when there is evidence of CNS infection. It's not as simple as "loss of smell."
- irq11 6y ago
  The reason you “get so concerned” is because you are spreading fear, and you systematically attempt to censor anyone who points out that your fear isn’t supported by evidence.
  - deelowe 6y ago
    Does your statement change if I personally know several people who are ill and a few who have died? I have first hand experience. Do you? Yes, I am afraid, but that fear is backed by empirical evidence and my study of the science of this disease, not the media. You should be afraid as well.
    - HeroOfAges 6y ago
      I personally only know of one person that has tested positive for Covid-19 and she recovered fully after about two weeks. Can you tell us more about the people you know that died due to Covid-19? General demographic info, like sex, age, that type of thing.
      - matwood 6y ago
        I know 2 people with older relatives who died. My wife's grandmother caught it in a nursing home and remained asymptomatic the best we could tell (she has dementia). Other people around her in the nursing did die from the virus. I know of multiple people in their 20s-30s-40s who have said it's the worst sickness they have ever felt. Some others who were really sick for a day or 2 and now seem fine. I'm not a doomsday person, but it's something I'd like to avoid rolling the dice on (and I do have fear of older relatives catching it). Then there are the possible long term health effects still unknown. Unfortunately for whatever reason people have to be scared into taking the simple, basic precautions.
      - deelowe 6y ago
        I cannot share details due to HIPAA, other than one was not in an at risk group. The other was. Additionally, some individuals who have gotten ill have "recovered" as in they aren't going to the doctor/hospital, but still cannot walk long distances or think clearly months later. The thing about the disease is that it attacks some people much much more severely than others. We do not know why yet, but I'm positive that we'll eventually find out there are biological reasons (blood type, genetics, Vit D levels, etc).
      - zaphod4prez 6y ago
        My good friend is a healthy & fit 24-yr old male. He bikes about 60-80miles every week, doesn't smoke or drink (ever), has no medical conditions, and takes no medication. He had a mild case a few weeks ago— tested positive for antibodies, felt like a really nasty flu plus trouble breathing but felt mostly better in 2 weeks. He is having persistent symptoms that are really affecting his day-to-day life. He experiences serious fatigue about two days a week, to the point where it's difficult to work, and has occasional brain fog. It's really scary, I'm worried for him. And now I really don't want to get it.
        m0llusk 6y ago
        Just throwing this out there: Persistent symptoms are correlated with low vitamin D levels which are common.
      - 6y ago
    - irq11 6y ago
      No. Facts are facts.
  - gnusty_gnurc 6y ago
    COVID-19 fear entered moral conviction territory long ago. It's useless to argue the numbers or even suggest the possibility of evidence that tempers the doomsday fear. It's like arguing against the religious.
    - titzer 6y ago
      > It's useless to argue the numbers With very few exceptions, those "arguing the numbers" present a systematically biased and intentionally deceptive view that this virus is not dangerous and systematically hamper the collective action necessary to slow its spread. Instead of merely presenting a "balanced view", it's a rather irresponsible level of misinformation by...let's be frank...rather uninformed armchair epidemiologists who often have zero background in medicine, zero background in infectious diseases, and hardly any science background at all. The virus is killing and maiming people worldwide. It's highly infectious. Basic shit like wearing masks is now political. I don't mean to unload on you, because you are making a meta point, but seriously, most people arguing "the numbers" are completely full of shit. Listen to experts on infectious diseases, and shun internet crackheads, no matter what research papers they think they understand, and don't. You should take this seriously because people are actually dying.
      - amitkapit 6y ago
        you just made his point (;
      - Consultant32452 6y ago
        >Basic shit like wearing masks is now political. Masks became political the moment the CDC, WHO, and US Surgeon General lied to the public by telling them that masks don't help and would even be worse than not wearing a mask. The world's leading experts made it political, don't blame nobodies with no power for that. >You should take this seriously because people are actually dying. "People are actually dying" isn't the adult conversation. The adult conversation acknowledges that there may never be a vaccine or even a good treatment for this disease. Many countries have their infection "under control" but this is only because of fairly draconian policies which cannot be implemented forever. Once the draconian policies are pulled back, the infection will hit them again because there is no herd immunity and no vaccine. The adults in the room are having a discussion that balances the understanding that there is a dangerous disease out there with the further understanding that draconian measures cannot be permanent and at some point the world may just have to deal with the consequences of returning to normalish life. The only question that matters is "How long do we wait?" and that question is not primarily an epidemiological one. For you personally, the answer to that question may be "forever," but it seems pretty clear that "forever" is not an answer most people will accept.
  - mr_overalls 6y ago
    ". . . isn't supported by evidence." This thread is _literally_ about the gold-standard scientific evidence (gathered by Spanish doctors) about how COVID is attacking the nervous system.
    - Duller-Finite 6y ago
      COVID-19 patients may have neurological symptoms, but that doesn't mean that SARS-CoV-2 directly attacks the CNS. As noted recently, most neurological symptoms associated with COVID-19 can be explained by vasculopathies and coagulopathies rather than the direct infection of neurons [1]. Such results are consistent with findings from autopsies. In contrast, neither of the papers mentioned in the linked article provide any evidence that SARS-CoV-2 is "directly attacking the brain". [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7328585/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7328585/
    - irq11 6y ago
      The comment I made was _literally_ just two quotes from the gold-standard spanish doctors. Such evidence is good when it supoorts your narrative, and bad when it doesn’t. Think about that for a second.
  - titzer 6y ago
    It's worthwhile pointing out that being "censored" and being a moron feel subjectively pretty similar at first blush, especially without some introspection. With no introspection, the odds are stacked heavily to one side on that.
  - fzeroracer 6y ago
    It seems more like you're trying to censor people talking about the scientific details and facts around covid-19.
  - ivalm 6y ago
    Covid is only the single biggest cause of death in the US for the past few months, so safe!
- irq11 6y ago
  No, the reason you “get so concerned” is because you are scared, and intent on spreading fear to others. You downvote factual comments simply because you don’t agree with them, and don’t want others to see them.

by irq11 6y ago

deelowe 6y ago

There is a reason we get so concerned when there is evidence of CNS infection. It's not as simple as "loss of smell."

irq11 6y ago
The reason you “get so concerned” is because you are spreading fear, and you systematically attempt to censor anyone who points out that your fear isn’t supported by evidence.
- deelowe 6y ago
  Does your statement change if I personally know several people who are ill and a few who have died? I have first hand experience. Do you? Yes, I am afraid, but that fear is backed by empirical evidence and my study of the science of this disease, not the media. You should be afraid as well.
  - HeroOfAges 6y ago
    I personally only know of one person that has tested positive for Covid-19 and she recovered fully after about two weeks. Can you tell us more about the people you know that died due to Covid-19? General demographic info, like sex, age, that type of thing.
    - matwood 6y ago
      I know 2 people with older relatives who died. My wife's grandmother caught it in a nursing home and remained asymptomatic the best we could tell (she has dementia). Other people around her in the nursing did die from the virus. I know of multiple people in their 20s-30s-40s who have said it's the worst sickness they have ever felt. Some others who were really sick for a day or 2 and now seem fine. I'm not a doomsday person, but it's something I'd like to avoid rolling the dice on (and I do have fear of older relatives catching it). Then there are the possible long term health effects still unknown. Unfortunately for whatever reason people have to be scared into taking the simple, basic precautions.
    - deelowe 6y ago
      I cannot share details due to HIPAA, other than one was not in an at risk group. The other was. Additionally, some individuals who have gotten ill have "recovered" as in they aren't going to the doctor/hospital, but still cannot walk long distances or think clearly months later. The thing about the disease is that it attacks some people much much more severely than others. We do not know why yet, but I'm positive that we'll eventually find out there are biological reasons (blood type, genetics, Vit D levels, etc).
    - zaphod4prez 6y ago
      My good friend is a healthy & fit 24-yr old male. He bikes about 60-80miles every week, doesn't smoke or drink (ever), has no medical conditions, and takes no medication. He had a mild case a few weeks ago— tested positive for antibodies, felt like a really nasty flu plus trouble breathing but felt mostly better in 2 weeks. He is having persistent symptoms that are really affecting his day-to-day life. He experiences serious fatigue about two days a week, to the point where it's difficult to work, and has occasional brain fog. It's really scary, I'm worried for him. And now I really don't want to get it.
      - m0llusk 6y ago
        Just throwing this out there: Persistent symptoms are correlated with low vitamin D levels which are common.
    - 6y ago
  - irq11 6y ago
    No. Facts are facts.
- gnusty_gnurc 6y ago
  COVID-19 fear entered moral conviction territory long ago. It's useless to argue the numbers or even suggest the possibility of evidence that tempers the doomsday fear. It's like arguing against the religious.
  - titzer 6y ago
    > It's useless to argue the numbers With very few exceptions, those "arguing the numbers" present a systematically biased and intentionally deceptive view that this virus is not dangerous and systematically hamper the collective action necessary to slow its spread. Instead of merely presenting a "balanced view", it's a rather irresponsible level of misinformation by...let's be frank...rather uninformed armchair epidemiologists who often have zero background in medicine, zero background in infectious diseases, and hardly any science background at all. The virus is killing and maiming people worldwide. It's highly infectious. Basic shit like wearing masks is now political. I don't mean to unload on you, because you are making a meta point, but seriously, most people arguing "the numbers" are completely full of shit. Listen to experts on infectious diseases, and shun internet crackheads, no matter what research papers they think they understand, and don't. You should take this seriously because people are actually dying.
    - amitkapit 6y ago
      you just made his point (;
    - Consultant32452 6y ago
      >Basic shit like wearing masks is now political. Masks became political the moment the CDC, WHO, and US Surgeon General lied to the public by telling them that masks don't help and would even be worse than not wearing a mask. The world's leading experts made it political, don't blame nobodies with no power for that. >You should take this seriously because people are actually dying. "People are actually dying" isn't the adult conversation. The adult conversation acknowledges that there may never be a vaccine or even a good treatment for this disease. Many countries have their infection "under control" but this is only because of fairly draconian policies which cannot be implemented forever. Once the draconian policies are pulled back, the infection will hit them again because there is no herd immunity and no vaccine. The adults in the room are having a discussion that balances the understanding that there is a dangerous disease out there with the further understanding that draconian measures cannot be permanent and at some point the world may just have to deal with the consequences of returning to normalish life. The only question that matters is "How long do we wait?" and that question is not primarily an epidemiological one. For you personally, the answer to that question may be "forever," but it seems pretty clear that "forever" is not an answer most people will accept.
- mr_overalls 6y ago
  ". . . isn't supported by evidence." This thread is _literally_ about the gold-standard scientific evidence (gathered by Spanish doctors) about how COVID is attacking the nervous system.
  - Duller-Finite 6y ago
    COVID-19 patients may have neurological symptoms, but that doesn't mean that SARS-CoV-2 directly attacks the CNS. As noted recently, most neurological symptoms associated with COVID-19 can be explained by vasculopathies and coagulopathies rather than the direct infection of neurons [1]. Such results are consistent with findings from autopsies. In contrast, neither of the papers mentioned in the linked article provide any evidence that SARS-CoV-2 is "directly attacking the brain". [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7328585/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7328585/
  - irq11 6y ago
    The comment I made was _literally_ just two quotes from the gold-standard spanish doctors. Such evidence is good when it supoorts your narrative, and bad when it doesn’t. Think about that for a second.
- titzer 6y ago
  It's worthwhile pointing out that being "censored" and being a moron feel subjectively pretty similar at first blush, especially without some introspection. With no introspection, the odds are stacked heavily to one side on that.
- fzeroracer 6y ago
  It seems more like you're trying to censor people talking about the scientific details and facts around covid-19.
- ivalm 6y ago
  Covid is only the single biggest cause of death in the US for the past few months, so safe!
irq11 6y ago
No, the reason you “get so concerned” is because you are scared, and intent on spreading fear to others. You downvote factual comments simply because you don’t agree with them, and don’t want others to see them.