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I've always been depressive and pessimistic person as far as I can remember. I've been looking at other people only to see how happy they are and how content t

by dukha 6y ago

I've always been depressive and pessimistic person as far as I can remember. I've been looking at other people only to see how happy they are and how content they with their life. They feel motivated, want something from life and in generally think that being alive is alright, which I just couldn't internalize no matter how hard I tried. Essentially, I've come to the conclusion that there _must_ be something wrong with my neurotransmitters that I just can't be happy as fellow friends around me. Many doctor appointments, many different prescriptions. Antidepressants did their job and I started to care less about what's going on, but they didn't make me any happier. They just made me less miserable. On the other side, I've started to see the world through some kind of fog, which blocked most of my previous perception. My long-term memory started to degradate. Now, after many years of taking various SSRIs I'm beginning to realize, that there's nothing wrong with my brain. That's perhaps who I am, maybe either percepting more than many people around or just more sensetive and therefore reacting stronger even on slightest stimulus in a much stronger ways. I have opinions and thougts on a topics that many do not even care about. So instead of supressing thoughts and emotions I must accept them as they are.

kilroy_jones 6y ago
Your view on this and your username are linked I assume?
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
oldsklgdfth 6y ago
Aside from medication and therapy, what other avenues have you explored?
bserge 6y ago
Have you tried other drugs? I am depressive and pessimistic by nature, too. I have accepted that. But I have to fix the extremes because otherwise I simply can't function. Different drugs can literally make you feel and think like a different person. The only problem is side effects and tolerance, you can't go on on drugs for very long. They can be invaluable for building different habits, though.
- nastyfilthy 6y ago
  What other drugs are you referring to? Other types of antidepressants or acid.
  - weknowbetter 6y ago
    My guess would be MDMA https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4502590/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4502590/
  - bserge 6y ago
    Not only MDMA (which is probably not prescribed by anyone yet) like /u/weknowbetter said, but also other stuff that has shown promise in treating depression (and has actually worked for other people). Imipramine (not really good long term), CBD, low dose THC, ketamine, gabapentin, there's some others, too. Gabapentin works really well for me, though I have to stop taking it for a week every month, so that's 2-3 days of insomnia and nightmares. Technically I'm not supposed to, but then I'd have to increase the dosage to what I consider unacceptable levels. Tapering off also works, though. CBD/THC (only with a low dose of alcohol) also works well, but I don't like the side effects (lower mental acuity, plus my already bad attention goes rock bottom), so it's more of an occasional thing. Doctors are really inflexible in what they can give me, so I have to make do. SSRI's just don't work on me, except for imipramine, but that's really temporary.
mint2 6y ago
It’s also like the Facebook effect. For the most part, people post only the best photos, so we only see their best 10%. Yet it’s easy to forget that and compare that to all our photos/experiences even though it’s not apples to apples. And out of 100 friends, if 5-10 post something cool it’s easy to overlook that the other 90-95 didn’t. fB is but an example. These effects happen more or less with everything.
- bradlys 6y ago
  The culture in America shames those who post upsetting things or express those feelings. It’s a whole thing where you have to always be happy and “positive”. I’ve rebelled against this for a long time. I post happy things here and there but since my life isn’t particularly happy, I post the more upsetting things more frequently and express those feelings in real life. I like to think I’m adding balance but I know I’m just being ignored because the culture doesn’t like to hear about suffering.
  - LouisSayers 6y ago
    > The culture in America shames those who post upsetting things or express those feelings. Yeah, because it’s bloody depressing. You get what your mind focuses on and if people actively look for depressing topics it’s no wonder they’re all doom and gloom. That’s why people don’t want to hear it - because it affects your psychology. I will actively run from people who lead negative lives, that complain about things but never lift a finger to make anything better. I refuse to be sucked into their pits of despair because I know there is good in the world, and I want to be part of that, focus my mind and attention and energy on leaving things slightly better than when I found it. I will try to help ppl where I can but the truth is a lot of people are lazy and don’t want to change. So I leave them with my thoughts and know that I have done my piece. I’m not saying this is directly attributable to your experience, simply relaying the way I feel to give you insight into perhaps a different mindset and way of seeing things.
- XCSme 6y ago
  I agree. My opinion now is actually that the more a person posts "happy" photos on Facebook/Instagram, the sadder/unfulfilled they actually are IRL.
epx 6y ago
Not sure if this is always the solution, but yes, so many people take antidepressants and let the fundamental problems of their lives go unfixed. And being a pessimist is not a problem that should be medicated. The world needs us!!
rednerrus 6y ago
What is your purpose?
twojacobtwo 6y ago
Have you looked into the possibility that you have ADD/ADHD? I ask because your description sounds spot on for how I have felt throughout life. The 'fog', lack of motivation, and sensitivity to even the slightest stimulus especially ring true. When I first took medication for ADD, I felt like I had been driving through a downpour my whole life and finally discovered the window-wipers - the storm didn't stop, but I could finally look forward and see my goals and desires clearly. Every few weeks I try to do a reset and test how I feel without medication and I definitely still feel that 'fog' that you mention. I would say my fog is more like being in a lightning storm, because I feel the constant 'patter' of thoughts hitting my subconscious (for lack of a better word), but the occasional lightning strike will pull my attention completely away from everything else momentarily. If you want to learn more, I highly recommend looking through the ADHD subreddit[0] - especially the sidebar material. [0] https://old.reddit.com/r/ADHD/ https://old.reddit.com/r/ADHD/
- viburnum 6y ago
  There’s a view that ADHD is badly named, because many ADHD people have incredible focus (at times), and many are not hyperactive in the least. It’s more of an issue about emotional dysregulation, which can be exceptionally painful for those who suffer.
  - patmorgan23 6y ago
    I do like the category ADHD is put in though. It's a form of 'executive disfunction' which I think describes it much better.
  - toomanybeersies 6y ago
    I was diagnosed in my mid-20s with inattentive-type ADHD. I had never even considered that I had ADHD until about a year prior to seeing a doctor, because I don't "look" like I have ADHD. There's this stereotype of people with ADHD being unable to sit still, constantly bouncing off the walls, which isn't really me at all. There's so much more to ADHD than that though. I'm smart enough that I never struggled academically, and wasn't hyperactive enough to cause significant enough disruption in the classroom, so externally it was never picked up that I might have ADHD. But now that I'm aware of it, I've come to realise how significant of an impact it's had in my life, all the self-destructive and self-sabotaging behaviour, the instability of my relationships, the abuse of drugs and alcohol, the lack of internal motivation, emotional hypersensitivity, a lack of emotional and object permanence, and more. I could go on for days (and have) about the less obvious effects and symptoms of ADHD.
viburnum 6y ago
This has been my experience as well. It’s taken a long time to understand how I am different than most other people. Have you read about sensory processing sensitivity/highly sensitive people?
FailMore 6y ago
Hey, I'm a therapist in training and also a developer. I built a side project called Taaalk. It's a platform for people to have public conversations, and I have done a few on mental health: https://taaalk.co/t/discussing-eating-disorders https://taaalk.co/t/discussing-eating-disorders https://taaalk.co/t/exploring-obsessive-compulsive-disorder https://taaalk.co/t/exploring-obsessive-compulsive-disorder Would you like to do one to see if anything comes up? Kind of a public anonymous therapy session... https://taaalk.co/t/invite/what-s-going-on-with-dukha https://taaalk.co/t/invite/what-s-going-on-with-dukha, invite code: 314798825 (If anyone else is interested my email is in my profile)
mistermann 6y ago
A psychedelic experience can often offer a profoundly different perspective on things like one's beliefs, perceptions, experiential phenomena, etc - have you ever investigated/considered that avenue? The effects are typically mostly temporary, but one is often left with some convincing fragment of knowledge that what we think/perceive reality to be is wildly off the mark, which can be a useful new base to build upon going forward.
staplers 6y ago
"There is no normal life that is free of pain. It’s the very wrestling with our problems that can be the impetus for our growth." -Fred Rogers
all_blue_chucks 6y ago
Your comment, "there's nothing wrong with my brain," doesn't clearly define what you mean by "wrong." From a biological standpoint, there is nothing wrong with misery. You can be miserable from birth to death, but as long as you pass on your genes your miserable self is "fit" from an evolutionary perspective. Personally I would absolutely consider persistent misery, or experiencing extreme sadness over minor things, to be a clear proof that there is something wrong with my brain. Whether I treat that with therapy or medication, I think that is very much worth treating, and definitely not worth simply accepting.
- s1artibartfast 6y ago
  >Personally I would absolutely consider persistent misery, or experiencing extreme sadness over minor things, to be a clear proof that there is something wrong with my brain. Whether I treat that with therapy or medication, I think that is very much worth treating, and definitely not worth simply accepting. I think you are making the assumption that it is treatable, or that the treatment advantages outweigh the disadvantages, which is not always the case. I think there is a general over-subscription to the idea that everything can be treated or optimized. Some diseases are incurable and sometimes a personal optimal is still poor compared to average.
  - all_blue_chucks 6y ago
    Not all cases of depression are effectively treated - some end in suicide - but every single case is worth treating. Resigning oneself to lifelong misery is the worst possible choice.
    - s1artibartfast 6y ago
      That depends on the side effects of the treatment and how bad the depression is
sandgiant 6y ago
I think you're on to something really important here. Some people (normal people if you will) just don't think too much about things. Even when they sometimes go on to make terrible choices for themselves, and others, they might regret it, they might have negative thoughts about it, but they don't become depressed. They are not inclined to ruminating hours on end about their mistakes, so the negative thoughts dissipate over time, they effectively move on. But if your personality, or brain, or whatever, is made in such a way that you like to think a lot about what could have been, or could be, or how to behave, or what others think of you, any kind of negative thought you might have will stay around, eventually leading to (symptoms of) depression. So I think you're right when you say that depression is not what's wrong with you. You might just be one of those people that are good at thinking. Perhaps sometimes a little too good at thinking, a little too sensitive. Being sensitive and good at thinking is not be a bad thing at all, but spending too much time having negative thoughts may be what leads to depression. If this is the case, realizing that you have a choice, in what to think about, is an important step on improving the quality of life, perhaps even learning to life with, or overcome some of the symptoms of anxiety and depression. Accept the negative thoughts, they are just natural thoughts after all, but choose not to dwell on them, let them pass and move on to the next thought, it might be a positive one. You may also find some inspiration in metacognitive therapy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metacognitive_therapy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metacognitive_therapy).
- zeta0134 6y ago
  A realization that came to me much later in life was that, although I am in apparently full control of which thoughts I allow to persist in my mind, I do not appear to be in full control of when memories surface. Rather, very similar to my dreaming state, it seems as though there is some process which is constantly comparing my waking events to things that occurred in my past, and trying to form a connection between them. For the most part this is good, but of course, not all memories are created equal. Sometimes this process of forming connections reminds me of a painful event, something I'd rather not think about. At first it was frustrating when these memories surfaced repeatedly. I'd dwell on some embarassing thing I'd done, or some painful thing a friend had said to me, which they maybe didn't realize I'd taken so hard. It was tempting to analyze these events to death, and have silent conversations with these figments, as though I could go back and phrase it differently, or change my actions, and perhaps it would have gone better. Eventually, however, I realized that these mental tasks were not productive. The event, the "danger" had already passed. So now, whenever I realize my mind is about to go down that path, when suddenly I am reminded of a painful event, we pause, my brain and I. "Do we really need to go down this road again? We know where it leads. Let's not." And so we don't. We reach once again into the stream of thought, allow ourselves to dwell on some happier moment, and in time, that old memory fades and we're off on a different adventure.
ip26 6y ago
I felt like that for a long time. I can't say that today I am an over-exuberant bundle of joy, but somewhere along the road of fixing my quality of sleep (caffeine, nasal obstruction), eating more fruits & vegetables, and getting regular exercise, the world has become a far more cheery place. I know it's not an illusion because I very rapidly become dour & flat when I let my diet or exercise slip.
welearnednothng 6y ago
I can relate to much of what you're saying. This seems to be the common trapping of modern society - everyone must be happy and care about the same things. I'm not professionally qualified on the subject, but my vote is embrace it - but also try to understand it. For instance, find a therapist to talk with. Don't feel like you need to settle for the first one you find, find one that feels right to you. It could be that there are deep rooted thoughts or emotions that actually are unhealthy that you may want to get to the bottom of. The goal here isn't change, it's understanding... and through understanding, determine if there's anything you'd like to change or even embrace. For example, I tend to focus on the negatives and everything wrong with the world. I realized I picked these behaviors up from my mother which not only allows me to be more aware of my behavior, but also helps me gently guide conversations with her away from being so negative and help her find positive things in her life. Psychedelics often come up in these conversations, as well. I know many people whom see their experiences with psychedelics as turning points for them. There's plenty out research out there on the subject that I won't rehash here. If you choose to go down this route, I'd suggest doing your own research and if it seems like something you'd like to try do so in a safe place with one or more persons you feel safe around. Preferably, have an experienced "guide" there with you. Lastly, I've been digging into the subject of gratitude for awhile now - both giving and receiving. There's a lot of research indicating it can be quite powerful. I tend to focus on the negative and everything that's wrong with the world (or my job, or my partner). Sometimes, just setting aside time to stop and think about something or someone you're grateful for (and especially communicating that) can do wonders. This isn't about not having or getting rid of pessimistic thoughts - it's about finding conscious space for appreciation, which can help balance things out or just help find some sparks of joy that might otherwise get drowned out by the negativity. We're all on our own journey. Embrace who you are and try to take in the sights along the way.
Aperocky 6y ago
I have always been a happy and optimistic person. But I do very often wonder if and what is the objective purpose of life, and having thought of it for a long time, I came to the conclusion that there are no such objective purpose. The goal of life is entirely subjective, while the achievement/advancement of the goal is grounded in logic and hard work, the goal itself is not.
- XCSme 6y ago
  I also came to the conclusion that no one has any idea what the purpose of life is. No one. I like listening to various opinions on "how you should live your life", mostly just out of curiosity, but never really take any of them as the answer. There are people (David Goggins) saying that you should work 24/7 and be the best of version of yourself you can be while working your ass off and suffering a lot. There are others who say you shouldn't give a fuck and just enjoy the life in every way you can. Life has no purpose, just enjoy it and do whatever makes you happy and fulfilled (which could mean either slacking or achieving greatness, depending on what you want).
austincheney 6y ago
> Now, after many years of taking various SSRIs I'm beginning to realize So a failure to transmit or receive sufficient chemical stimulus in the brain describes a failure of hardware that may or may not be correctable with drugs. Because we live in a culture of convenience it is common to misrepresent a difference of personality as a defect correctable with a drug, which may explain the drive to consume and abuse stimulants. Some people, myself, literally enjoy working 80+ hours a weeks with less sleep and without preconditions, like increased compensation. Many people see that as bizarre and wonder where the increased energy and focus come from. It’s not a product of increased energy or focus, but really just a minor difference of personal interest and emotional concerns. Stimulants won’t buy you a necessary change of personal goals or the necessary continuous interest of where you value your time, and certainly won’t buy you enjoyment of working 80+ hours a week. Instead people tend to be most productive where they naturally find increased output due to personal interests whether that’s just from spending time with other people or reading literature. That’s the difference personal interests (personality) make which is not any indication of defect. There is a famous quote: “Know thyself”. The reflection to that is know what you are not or rather don’t lie to yourself.
alex504 6y ago
I found ssris to be a prison. A profound spiritual stasis. They cut me off from myself. They muted my emotions so instead of learning to deal with them I stayed passive and simply ignored them. When I got off of them I spent quite awhile learning who I was and how to live with myself. I have come a long way as a person and I wonder if that change wouldn't have taken place sooner had I not taken them. It seems that lots of very smart people take these drugs and I wonder how many are emotionally and spiritually stunted by them.
kerkeslager 6y ago
Due to a video by Dave MacLeod[1], I made some dietary changes that have had a surprising and profound effect on my mental health. The full list of sources for that video are on his blog[2], but the paper I found most helpful was the first on the list[3]. It's hard to come to any conclusions here, but it does seem like for me, the issue was at least partly chemical. However, I'll say that a lot of why I got to a point where I could even make the dietary changes, was that I had done a lot of emotional and psychological work. The reason I was interested when I saw the vlog, and read the paper, and made the dietary changes, was that I had done a lot of work to learn to even care about myself. For me, there has been a feedback loop--learning to care about myself has allowed me to discover tools to improve my brain chemistry, which in turn is now allowing me to care about myself better and do more for myself (and others). I don't think that just giving people the right food or medicines to fix their brain chemistry would work if they don't see themselves as worth making the life changes for. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPi41bSrFdI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPi41bSrFdI [2] https://www.davemacleod.com/blog/vlog15 https://www.davemacleod.com/blog/vlog15 [3] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30254980/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30254980/
JSavageOne 6y ago
It's hard not to be depressed when you realize how sad society is, and how most of how we're supposed to spend our days (working for an employer, staring at a computer screen all day) has no actual meaning to the world. Yet we're not allowed to talk about it at or you'll get fired, or people will think you're depressing. For me I've found that my happiness is mostly a function of the community of people I'm surrounded with. This means having a solid group of friends and/or significant other. It's very tough to find this, especially in the U.S. when you're already an "adult" and didn't make many friends in your childhood/university years, but it is possible. But that's just me, others don't need much social contact. Everyone is different. But for any software engineers like me who find that staring at a computer all day does little for their happiness, you are definitely not alone.

by dukha 6y ago

kilroy_jones 6y ago

Your view on this and your username are linked I assume?

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

oldsklgdfth 6y ago

Aside from medication and therapy, what other avenues have you explored?

bserge 6y ago

Have you tried other drugs? I am depressive and pessimistic by nature, too. I have accepted that. But I have to fix the extremes because otherwise I simply can't function. Different drugs can literally make you feel and think like a different person. The only problem is side effects and tolerance, you can't go on on drugs for very long. They can be invaluable for building different habits, though.

nastyfilthy 6y ago
What other drugs are you referring to? Other types of antidepressants or acid.
- weknowbetter 6y ago
  My guess would be MDMA https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4502590/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4502590/
- bserge 6y ago
  Not only MDMA (which is probably not prescribed by anyone yet) like /u/weknowbetter said, but also other stuff that has shown promise in treating depression (and has actually worked for other people). Imipramine (not really good long term), CBD, low dose THC, ketamine, gabapentin, there's some others, too. Gabapentin works really well for me, though I have to stop taking it for a week every month, so that's 2-3 days of insomnia and nightmares. Technically I'm not supposed to, but then I'd have to increase the dosage to what I consider unacceptable levels. Tapering off also works, though. CBD/THC (only with a low dose of alcohol) also works well, but I don't like the side effects (lower mental acuity, plus my already bad attention goes rock bottom), so it's more of an occasional thing. Doctors are really inflexible in what they can give me, so I have to make do. SSRI's just don't work on me, except for imipramine, but that's really temporary.

mint2 6y ago

It’s also like the Facebook effect. For the most part, people post only the best photos, so we only see their best 10%. Yet it’s easy to forget that and compare that to all our photos/experiences even though it’s not apples to apples. And out of 100 friends, if 5-10 post something cool it’s easy to overlook that the other 90-95 didn’t. fB is but an example. These effects happen more or less with everything.

bradlys 6y ago
The culture in America shames those who post upsetting things or express those feelings. It’s a whole thing where you have to always be happy and “positive”. I’ve rebelled against this for a long time. I post happy things here and there but since my life isn’t particularly happy, I post the more upsetting things more frequently and express those feelings in real life. I like to think I’m adding balance but I know I’m just being ignored because the culture doesn’t like to hear about suffering.
- LouisSayers 6y ago
  > The culture in America shames those who post upsetting things or express those feelings. Yeah, because it’s bloody depressing. You get what your mind focuses on and if people actively look for depressing topics it’s no wonder they’re all doom and gloom. That’s why people don’t want to hear it - because it affects your psychology. I will actively run from people who lead negative lives, that complain about things but never lift a finger to make anything better. I refuse to be sucked into their pits of despair because I know there is good in the world, and I want to be part of that, focus my mind and attention and energy on leaving things slightly better than when I found it. I will try to help ppl where I can but the truth is a lot of people are lazy and don’t want to change. So I leave them with my thoughts and know that I have done my piece. I’m not saying this is directly attributable to your experience, simply relaying the way I feel to give you insight into perhaps a different mindset and way of seeing things.
XCSme 6y ago
I agree. My opinion now is actually that the more a person posts "happy" photos on Facebook/Instagram, the sadder/unfulfilled they actually are IRL.

epx 6y ago

Not sure if this is always the solution, but yes, so many people take antidepressants and let the fundamental problems of their lives go unfixed. And being a pessimist is not a problem that should be medicated. The world needs us!!

rednerrus 6y ago

What is your purpose?

twojacobtwo 6y ago

Have you looked into the possibility that you have ADD/ADHD? I ask because your description sounds spot on for how I have felt throughout life. The 'fog', lack of motivation, and sensitivity to even the slightest stimulus especially ring true. When I first took medication for ADD, I felt like I had been driving through a downpour my whole life and finally discovered the window-wipers - the storm didn't stop, but I could finally look forward and see my goals and desires clearly. Every few weeks I try to do a reset and test how I feel without medication and I definitely still feel that 'fog' that you mention. I would say my fog is more like being in a lightning storm, because I feel the constant 'patter' of thoughts hitting my subconscious (for lack of a better word), but the occasional lightning strike will pull my attention completely away from everything else momentarily. If you want to learn more, I highly recommend looking through the ADHD subreddit[0] - especially the sidebar material. [0] https://old.reddit.com/r/ADHD/ https://old.reddit.com/r/ADHD/

viburnum 6y ago
There’s a view that ADHD is badly named, because many ADHD people have incredible focus (at times), and many are not hyperactive in the least. It’s more of an issue about emotional dysregulation, which can be exceptionally painful for those who suffer.
- patmorgan23 6y ago
  I do like the category ADHD is put in though. It's a form of 'executive disfunction' which I think describes it much better.
- toomanybeersies 6y ago
  I was diagnosed in my mid-20s with inattentive-type ADHD. I had never even considered that I had ADHD until about a year prior to seeing a doctor, because I don't "look" like I have ADHD. There's this stereotype of people with ADHD being unable to sit still, constantly bouncing off the walls, which isn't really me at all. There's so much more to ADHD than that though. I'm smart enough that I never struggled academically, and wasn't hyperactive enough to cause significant enough disruption in the classroom, so externally it was never picked up that I might have ADHD. But now that I'm aware of it, I've come to realise how significant of an impact it's had in my life, all the self-destructive and self-sabotaging behaviour, the instability of my relationships, the abuse of drugs and alcohol, the lack of internal motivation, emotional hypersensitivity, a lack of emotional and object permanence, and more. I could go on for days (and have) about the less obvious effects and symptoms of ADHD.

viburnum 6y ago

This has been my experience as well. It’s taken a long time to understand how I am different than most other people. Have you read about sensory processing sensitivity/highly sensitive people?

FailMore 6y ago

Hey, I'm a therapist in training and also a developer. I built a side project called Taaalk. It's a platform for people to have public conversations, and I have done a few on mental health: https://taaalk.co/t/discussing-eating-disorders https://taaalk.co/t/discussing-eating-disorders https://taaalk.co/t/exploring-obsessive-compulsive-disorder https://taaalk.co/t/exploring-obsessive-compulsive-disorder Would you like to do one to see if anything comes up? Kind of a public anonymous therapy session... https://taaalk.co/t/invite/what-s-going-on-with-dukha https://taaalk.co/t/invite/what-s-going-on-with-dukha, invite code: 314798825 (If anyone else is interested my email is in my profile)

mistermann 6y ago

A psychedelic experience can often offer a profoundly different perspective on things like one's beliefs, perceptions, experiential phenomena, etc - have you ever investigated/considered that avenue? The effects are typically mostly temporary, but one is often left with some convincing fragment of knowledge that what we think/perceive reality to be is wildly off the mark, which can be a useful new base to build upon going forward.

staplers 6y ago

"There is no normal life that is free of pain. It’s the very wrestling with our problems that can be the impetus for our growth." -Fred Rogers

all_blue_chucks 6y ago

Your comment, "there's nothing wrong with my brain," doesn't clearly define what you mean by "wrong." From a biological standpoint, there is nothing wrong with misery. You can be miserable from birth to death, but as long as you pass on your genes your miserable self is "fit" from an evolutionary perspective. Personally I would absolutely consider persistent misery, or experiencing extreme sadness over minor things, to be a clear proof that there is something wrong with my brain. Whether I treat that with therapy or medication, I think that is very much worth treating, and definitely not worth simply accepting.

s1artibartfast 6y ago
>Personally I would absolutely consider persistent misery, or experiencing extreme sadness over minor things, to be a clear proof that there is something wrong with my brain. Whether I treat that with therapy or medication, I think that is very much worth treating, and definitely not worth simply accepting. I think you are making the assumption that it is treatable, or that the treatment advantages outweigh the disadvantages, which is not always the case. I think there is a general over-subscription to the idea that everything can be treated or optimized. Some diseases are incurable and sometimes a personal optimal is still poor compared to average.
- all_blue_chucks 6y ago
  Not all cases of depression are effectively treated - some end in suicide - but every single case is worth treating. Resigning oneself to lifelong misery is the worst possible choice.
  - s1artibartfast 6y ago
    That depends on the side effects of the treatment and how bad the depression is

sandgiant 6y ago

I think you're on to something really important here. Some people (normal people if you will) just don't think too much about things. Even when they sometimes go on to make terrible choices for themselves, and others, they might regret it, they might have negative thoughts about it, but they don't become depressed. They are not inclined to ruminating hours on end about their mistakes, so the negative thoughts dissipate over time, they effectively move on. But if your personality, or brain, or whatever, is made in such a way that you like to think a lot about what could have been, or could be, or how to behave, or what others think of you, any kind of negative thought you might have will stay around, eventually leading to (symptoms of) depression. So I think you're right when you say that depression is not what's wrong with you. You might just be one of those people that are good at thinking. Perhaps sometimes a little too good at thinking, a little too sensitive. Being sensitive and good at thinking is not be a bad thing at all, but spending too much time having negative thoughts may be what leads to depression. If this is the case, realizing that you have a choice, in what to think about, is an important step on improving the quality of life, perhaps even learning to life with, or overcome some of the symptoms of anxiety and depression. Accept the negative thoughts, they are just natural thoughts after all, but choose not to dwell on them, let them pass and move on to the next thought, it might be a positive one. You may also find some inspiration in metacognitive therapy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metacognitive_therapy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metacognitive_therapy).

zeta0134 6y ago
A realization that came to me much later in life was that, although I am in apparently full control of which thoughts I allow to persist in my mind, I do not appear to be in full control of when memories surface. Rather, very similar to my dreaming state, it seems as though there is some process which is constantly comparing my waking events to things that occurred in my past, and trying to form a connection between them. For the most part this is good, but of course, not all memories are created equal. Sometimes this process of forming connections reminds me of a painful event, something I'd rather not think about. At first it was frustrating when these memories surfaced repeatedly. I'd dwell on some embarassing thing I'd done, or some painful thing a friend had said to me, which they maybe didn't realize I'd taken so hard. It was tempting to analyze these events to death, and have silent conversations with these figments, as though I could go back and phrase it differently, or change my actions, and perhaps it would have gone better. Eventually, however, I realized that these mental tasks were not productive. The event, the "danger" had already passed. So now, whenever I realize my mind is about to go down that path, when suddenly I am reminded of a painful event, we pause, my brain and I. "Do we really need to go down this road again? We know where it leads. Let's not." And so we don't. We reach once again into the stream of thought, allow ourselves to dwell on some happier moment, and in time, that old memory fades and we're off on a different adventure.

ip26 6y ago

I felt like that for a long time. I can't say that today I am an over-exuberant bundle of joy, but somewhere along the road of fixing my quality of sleep (caffeine, nasal obstruction), eating more fruits & vegetables, and getting regular exercise, the world has become a far more cheery place. I know it's not an illusion because I very rapidly become dour & flat when I let my diet or exercise slip.

welearnednothng 6y ago

I can relate to much of what you're saying. This seems to be the common trapping of modern society - everyone must be happy and care about the same things. I'm not professionally qualified on the subject, but my vote is embrace it - but also try to understand it. For instance, find a therapist to talk with. Don't feel like you need to settle for the first one you find, find one that feels right to you. It could be that there are deep rooted thoughts or emotions that actually are unhealthy that you may want to get to the bottom of. The goal here isn't change, it's understanding... and through understanding, determine if there's anything you'd like to change or even embrace. For example, I tend to focus on the negatives and everything wrong with the world. I realized I picked these behaviors up from my mother which not only allows me to be more aware of my behavior, but also helps me gently guide conversations with her away from being so negative and help her find positive things in her life. Psychedelics often come up in these conversations, as well. I know many people whom see their experiences with psychedelics as turning points for them. There's plenty out research out there on the subject that I won't rehash here. If you choose to go down this route, I'd suggest doing your own research and if it seems like something you'd like to try do so in a safe place with one or more persons you feel safe around. Preferably, have an experienced "guide" there with you. Lastly, I've been digging into the subject of gratitude for awhile now - both giving and receiving. There's a lot of research indicating it can be quite powerful. I tend to focus on the negative and everything that's wrong with the world (or my job, or my partner). Sometimes, just setting aside time to stop and think about something or someone you're grateful for (and especially communicating that) can do wonders. This isn't about not having or getting rid of pessimistic thoughts - it's about finding conscious space for appreciation, which can help balance things out or just help find some sparks of joy that might otherwise get drowned out by the negativity. We're all on our own journey. Embrace who you are and try to take in the sights along the way.

Aperocky 6y ago

I have always been a happy and optimistic person. But I do very often wonder if and what is the objective purpose of life, and having thought of it for a long time, I came to the conclusion that there are no such objective purpose. The goal of life is entirely subjective, while the achievement/advancement of the goal is grounded in logic and hard work, the goal itself is not.

XCSme 6y ago
I also came to the conclusion that no one has any idea what the purpose of life is. No one. I like listening to various opinions on "how you should live your life", mostly just out of curiosity, but never really take any of them as the answer. There are people (David Goggins) saying that you should work 24/7 and be the best of version of yourself you can be while working your ass off and suffering a lot. There are others who say you shouldn't give a fuck and just enjoy the life in every way you can. Life has no purpose, just enjoy it and do whatever makes you happy and fulfilled (which could mean either slacking or achieving greatness, depending on what you want).

austincheney 6y ago

> Now, after many years of taking various SSRIs I'm beginning to realize So a failure to transmit or receive sufficient chemical stimulus in the brain describes a failure of hardware that may or may not be correctable with drugs. Because we live in a culture of convenience it is common to misrepresent a difference of personality as a defect correctable with a drug, which may explain the drive to consume and abuse stimulants. Some people, myself, literally enjoy working 80+ hours a weeks with less sleep and without preconditions, like increased compensation. Many people see that as bizarre and wonder where the increased energy and focus come from. It’s not a product of increased energy or focus, but really just a minor difference of personal interest and emotional concerns. Stimulants won’t buy you a necessary change of personal goals or the necessary continuous interest of where you value your time, and certainly won’t buy you enjoyment of working 80+ hours a week. Instead people tend to be most productive where they naturally find increased output due to personal interests whether that’s just from spending time with other people or reading literature. That’s the difference personal interests (personality) make which is not any indication of defect. There is a famous quote: “Know thyself”. The reflection to that is know what you are not or rather don’t lie to yourself.

alex504 6y ago

I found ssris to be a prison. A profound spiritual stasis. They cut me off from myself. They muted my emotions so instead of learning to deal with them I stayed passive and simply ignored them. When I got off of them I spent quite awhile learning who I was and how to live with myself. I have come a long way as a person and I wonder if that change wouldn't have taken place sooner had I not taken them. It seems that lots of very smart people take these drugs and I wonder how many are emotionally and spiritually stunted by them.

kerkeslager 6y ago

Due to a video by Dave MacLeod[1], I made some dietary changes that have had a surprising and profound effect on my mental health. The full list of sources for that video are on his blog[2], but the paper I found most helpful was the first on the list[3]. It's hard to come to any conclusions here, but it does seem like for me, the issue was at least partly chemical. However, I'll say that a lot of why I got to a point where I could even make the dietary changes, was that I had done a lot of emotional and psychological work. The reason I was interested when I saw the vlog, and read the paper, and made the dietary changes, was that I had done a lot of work to learn to even care about myself. For me, there has been a feedback loop--learning to care about myself has allowed me to discover tools to improve my brain chemistry, which in turn is now allowing me to care about myself better and do more for myself (and others). I don't think that just giving people the right food or medicines to fix their brain chemistry would work if they don't see themselves as worth making the life changes for. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPi41bSrFdI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPi41bSrFdI [2] https://www.davemacleod.com/blog/vlog15 https://www.davemacleod.com/blog/vlog15 [3] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30254980/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30254980/

JSavageOne 6y ago

It's hard not to be depressed when you realize how sad society is, and how most of how we're supposed to spend our days (working for an employer, staring at a computer screen all day) has no actual meaning to the world. Yet we're not allowed to talk about it at or you'll get fired, or people will think you're depressing. For me I've found that my happiness is mostly a function of the community of people I'm surrounded with. This means having a solid group of friends and/or significant other. It's very tough to find this, especially in the U.S. when you're already an "adult" and didn't make many friends in your childhood/university years, but it is possible. But that's just me, others don't need much social contact. Everyone is different. But for any software engineers like me who find that staring at a computer all day does little for their happiness, you are definitely not alone.