6 ms·

I've seen studies confirming the inverse relationship between strength and all cause mortality numerous times. It seems pretty well established by now. Persona

by cheald 6y ago

I've seen studies confirming the inverse relationship between strength and all cause mortality numerous times. It seems pretty well established by now. Personally, I started lifting several years ago, and it's been the greatest change in my health in my life. I lost a lot of weight, my resting heart rate is way down, everyday tasks are easier. I move better, and I just feel better overall. Plus, it's a wonderful discipline for building determination and grit. I am certain that most people's lives would be significantly improved by the addition of a strength training program.

627467 6y ago
How did you start? Any recommended regime?
- dehrmann 6y ago
  What are your goals?
- peritpatrio 6y ago
  Here’s pretty good starting point for building overall strength: https://stronglifts.com/5x5/ https://stronglifts.com/5x5/
  - xeromal 6y ago
    You beat me by 1 minute! 5x5 is an excellent starter program. I've lifted for about 10 years and while I'm more in the advanced and intermediate lifting programs, 5x5 is my goto when I have a long hiatus in lifting. I'm definitely doing it once the COVID lockdowns are over.
  - AnonHP 6y ago
    Seems like this requires both physical space and equipment. Being stuck at home right now, what would be good enough alternatives for the exercises other than squats (perhaps with smaller dumbbells or with body weight)?
    - cheald 6y ago
      https://old.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/kb/recommended_routine https://old.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/kb/recommend... - maybe check out this program. I haven't run it myself, but I've heard a lot of people speak well of it.
- xeromal 6y ago
  5x5 is a simple and effective program. It's gone the route of marketing and sales but the principle is the same. A few big lifts a few times a week produces a lot of strength. You'll be surprised. You don't need to do 50 exercises.
- cheald 6y ago
  I started with Stronglifts 5x5. It's a good starter program if you haven't lifted before, because it'll give you the opportunity to drill and learn the movements, and the program is simple, and there's an app that holds your hand. In terms of programming, it has some deficiencies, but most people just need a structured program to start with. You can probably run it for 12-18 weeks and then have a strong foundation to switch to another program. People argue its deficiencies, but if it gets you started and gets you structure to build a routine with, that's what you need, IMO. For the last couple of years, I've been training with Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 program, and it's fantastic. I keep getting stronger and can probably happily train on it for many years to come. I've competed in a couple of local powerlifting meets, and have a routine that I feel like I can sustain forever. There is a 531 for Beginners program, too, but it's less hand-holdy than Stronglifts.
  - Scarbutt 6y ago
    Curious, what kind of deficiencies do you think 5x5 has?
    - cheald 6y ago
      My two biggest complaints about it are too little deadlift volume (and always deadlifting after you've squatted, which is just suicidal at higher working weights), and no periodization. The latter is really the biggest issue with it as anything beyond an introductory program - the benefits of periodization are well-established, and while linear progression is great as an "on ramp", the human body just can't sustain that style of progression indefinitely. When you hit the point that you stop regularly progressing linearly, it's time to stop and switch to a periodized program. If you wanted to get really picky, it lacks lacks arm (bicep and rear deltoid, primarily) and oblique accessory work, but I don't really consider those too big of a problem since most beginners need something straightforward that isn't too overwhelming.
      - benjaminjackman 6y ago
        Any suggestions for a periodized program?
- thesecretsquad 6y ago
  My opinion is the best strength training routine is the one you can stick to. Sometimes you get into a routine because someone told you it's the way to do things. You try to force yourself to do it even though you don't like it. Eventually you stop doing it because you're not motivated to do something you don't like. At that point you might think, "if this is the way I'm 'supposed to' workout, but I don't like it, then I've failed and just won't workout because anything else is not the way you're 'supposed to' do it". Don't listen to anyone who says you have to do one thing or another. Do what you like because you'll be more motivated and stick to it. This has been my experience... Personally, I don't like going to a gym. I'm not a fan of the atmosphere. I've tried several gym-based workout routines and I just never enjoyed doing them. When I say gym-based, I mean routines that really require gym equipment and access to heavier weights. I also don't like workouts that waste a lot of time. I found with gym-based workouts I always had to keep looking up each exercise because I would forget exactly how to do them and that wasted a lot of time. There also seemed to be a greater risk of injuring yourself doing certain exercises, especially those requiring heavier weight. I also found exercise routines advertised as being "simple" or "basic" would have several exercises requiring equipment my gym didn't have, so I always had to figure out alternative exercises for that muscle group, which also wasted time. I ended up doing P90X for a few years, which was great for someone like me that always has other things occupying my mind because I didn't have to think about what exercises to do. It was all laid out for me. Also, I could do it at home and it incorporates HIIT, which allows you to get in some cardio. As I got older, I found P90X felt like it was over-training and I couldn't keep up with the intense hour-long exercises. I switched to P90X3, which has 30-minute routines. That was good for a while, but personally not enough strength training for me. It had a variety of exercises (because variety is kind of the P90 way), but a lot of the exercises didn't really feel like they required enough exertion. P90X3 is probably good for someone starting out though if you need to get a basic level of physical fitness before moving on to more intense stuff. After P90X3, I purchased RIPT90 Fit, which is very similar to P90X3 (30-minute home workouts) but is cheaper and has fewer, simpler, and more impactful exercises that I think maximize your 30-minutes. I still occasionally mix in some P90X3 routines, like yoga and core workouts. HTH
  - cheald 6y ago
    This is right on the money. SL5x5 was the thing that "stuck" for me, but the best program is always the one that you stick with. Us kinds of people who are prone to read HN probably have a tendency to want to micro-optimize everything and pick the best most perfect program ever, and the truth is that the best program is the one that you do, even if it's not technically perfect. If one thing doesn't take, rather than giving up, look for another approach. The benefits are worth it.
- pfranz 6y ago
  5x5 has already been brought up a bunch of times. Starting Strength: Basic Barbell Training was a good book for me to cement each lift and I picked up 5x5 later for the routine. SS is a bit long-winded, it only covers a handful of basic lifts but dedicates a chapter to each one. Proper form is really important in not hurting yourself and maximizing your time in the gym. Being thoughtful about which muscles are getting activated and getting comfortable on how to position yourself really helps when the weight goes up. The New Encyclopedia of Modern Bodybuilding (Arnold Schwarzenegger) I remember half was life story and theory on bodybuilding and the latter part was a good reference of a bunch of variations on exercises to mix things up. Both of those books have been around forever and are generally well regarded. Your library probably has a copy you can borrow.
shpongled 6y ago
Yeah, starting a lifting program was a massive change in my life. Huge physical, emotional, and social benefits - and I quite enjoyed it! I have a feeling that I'm going to be seriously de-loading and basically restarting after we can finally go back to the gym.
gHosts 6y ago
> confirming the inverse relationship between strength and all cause mortality Ahh, but which way does the relationship go..? Unsurprisingly if I'm dying of something really serious and lying in bed sick as a dog..... ...I lose muscle mass.
- cheald 6y ago
  These studies are generally longitudinal studies across a number of years, where greater muscle mass or strength early in the study correlates with lower all-cause mortality across the duration of the study. It's not looking at survival rates for acute afflictions. Examples: * https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6427792/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6427792/ * https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12242311/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12242311/ * https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10795731/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10795731/ * https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11984288/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11984288/ (There are many, many more of these, and they all seem to agree)
  - gHosts 6y ago
    Correlation is not causation.
    - cheald 6y ago
      Of course. But given the high correlation, pursuing strength seems likely to produce the benefits of whatever the final cause happens to be.

by cheald 6y ago

627467 6y ago

How did you start? Any recommended regime?

dehrmann 6y ago
What are your goals?
peritpatrio 6y ago
Here’s pretty good starting point for building overall strength: https://stronglifts.com/5x5/ https://stronglifts.com/5x5/
- xeromal 6y ago
  You beat me by 1 minute! 5x5 is an excellent starter program. I've lifted for about 10 years and while I'm more in the advanced and intermediate lifting programs, 5x5 is my goto when I have a long hiatus in lifting. I'm definitely doing it once the COVID lockdowns are over.
- AnonHP 6y ago
  Seems like this requires both physical space and equipment. Being stuck at home right now, what would be good enough alternatives for the exercises other than squats (perhaps with smaller dumbbells or with body weight)?
  - cheald 6y ago
    https://old.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/kb/recommended_routine https://old.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/kb/recommend... - maybe check out this program. I haven't run it myself, but I've heard a lot of people speak well of it.
xeromal 6y ago
5x5 is a simple and effective program. It's gone the route of marketing and sales but the principle is the same. A few big lifts a few times a week produces a lot of strength. You'll be surprised. You don't need to do 50 exercises.
cheald 6y ago
I started with Stronglifts 5x5. It's a good starter program if you haven't lifted before, because it'll give you the opportunity to drill and learn the movements, and the program is simple, and there's an app that holds your hand. In terms of programming, it has some deficiencies, but most people just need a structured program to start with. You can probably run it for 12-18 weeks and then have a strong foundation to switch to another program. People argue its deficiencies, but if it gets you started and gets you structure to build a routine with, that's what you need, IMO. For the last couple of years, I've been training with Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 program, and it's fantastic. I keep getting stronger and can probably happily train on it for many years to come. I've competed in a couple of local powerlifting meets, and have a routine that I feel like I can sustain forever. There is a 531 for Beginners program, too, but it's less hand-holdy than Stronglifts.
- Scarbutt 6y ago
  Curious, what kind of deficiencies do you think 5x5 has?
  - cheald 6y ago
    My two biggest complaints about it are too little deadlift volume (and always deadlifting after you've squatted, which is just suicidal at higher working weights), and no periodization. The latter is really the biggest issue with it as anything beyond an introductory program - the benefits of periodization are well-established, and while linear progression is great as an "on ramp", the human body just can't sustain that style of progression indefinitely. When you hit the point that you stop regularly progressing linearly, it's time to stop and switch to a periodized program. If you wanted to get really picky, it lacks lacks arm (bicep and rear deltoid, primarily) and oblique accessory work, but I don't really consider those too big of a problem since most beginners need something straightforward that isn't too overwhelming.
    - benjaminjackman 6y ago
      Any suggestions for a periodized program?
thesecretsquad 6y ago
My opinion is the best strength training routine is the one you can stick to. Sometimes you get into a routine because someone told you it's the way to do things. You try to force yourself to do it even though you don't like it. Eventually you stop doing it because you're not motivated to do something you don't like. At that point you might think, "if this is the way I'm 'supposed to' workout, but I don't like it, then I've failed and just won't workout because anything else is not the way you're 'supposed to' do it". Don't listen to anyone who says you have to do one thing or another. Do what you like because you'll be more motivated and stick to it. This has been my experience... Personally, I don't like going to a gym. I'm not a fan of the atmosphere. I've tried several gym-based workout routines and I just never enjoyed doing them. When I say gym-based, I mean routines that really require gym equipment and access to heavier weights. I also don't like workouts that waste a lot of time. I found with gym-based workouts I always had to keep looking up each exercise because I would forget exactly how to do them and that wasted a lot of time. There also seemed to be a greater risk of injuring yourself doing certain exercises, especially those requiring heavier weight. I also found exercise routines advertised as being "simple" or "basic" would have several exercises requiring equipment my gym didn't have, so I always had to figure out alternative exercises for that muscle group, which also wasted time. I ended up doing P90X for a few years, which was great for someone like me that always has other things occupying my mind because I didn't have to think about what exercises to do. It was all laid out for me. Also, I could do it at home and it incorporates HIIT, which allows you to get in some cardio. As I got older, I found P90X felt like it was over-training and I couldn't keep up with the intense hour-long exercises. I switched to P90X3, which has 30-minute routines. That was good for a while, but personally not enough strength training for me. It had a variety of exercises (because variety is kind of the P90 way), but a lot of the exercises didn't really feel like they required enough exertion. P90X3 is probably good for someone starting out though if you need to get a basic level of physical fitness before moving on to more intense stuff. After P90X3, I purchased RIPT90 Fit, which is very similar to P90X3 (30-minute home workouts) but is cheaper and has fewer, simpler, and more impactful exercises that I think maximize your 30-minutes. I still occasionally mix in some P90X3 routines, like yoga and core workouts. HTH
- cheald 6y ago
  This is right on the money. SL5x5 was the thing that "stuck" for me, but the best program is always the one that you stick with. Us kinds of people who are prone to read HN probably have a tendency to want to micro-optimize everything and pick the best most perfect program ever, and the truth is that the best program is the one that you do, even if it's not technically perfect. If one thing doesn't take, rather than giving up, look for another approach. The benefits are worth it.
pfranz 6y ago
5x5 has already been brought up a bunch of times. Starting Strength: Basic Barbell Training was a good book for me to cement each lift and I picked up 5x5 later for the routine. SS is a bit long-winded, it only covers a handful of basic lifts but dedicates a chapter to each one. Proper form is really important in not hurting yourself and maximizing your time in the gym. Being thoughtful about which muscles are getting activated and getting comfortable on how to position yourself really helps when the weight goes up. The New Encyclopedia of Modern Bodybuilding (Arnold Schwarzenegger) I remember half was life story and theory on bodybuilding and the latter part was a good reference of a bunch of variations on exercises to mix things up. Both of those books have been around forever and are generally well regarded. Your library probably has a copy you can borrow.

shpongled 6y ago

Yeah, starting a lifting program was a massive change in my life. Huge physical, emotional, and social benefits - and I quite enjoyed it! I have a feeling that I'm going to be seriously de-loading and basically restarting after we can finally go back to the gym.

gHosts 6y ago

> confirming the inverse relationship between strength and all cause mortality Ahh, but which way does the relationship go..? Unsurprisingly if I'm dying of something really serious and lying in bed sick as a dog..... ...I lose muscle mass.

cheald 6y ago
These studies are generally longitudinal studies across a number of years, where greater muscle mass or strength early in the study correlates with lower all-cause mortality across the duration of the study. It's not looking at survival rates for acute afflictions. Examples: * https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6427792/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6427792/ * https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12242311/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12242311/ * https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10795731/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10795731/ * https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11984288/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11984288/ (There are many, many more of these, and they all seem to agree)
- gHosts 6y ago
  Correlation is not causation.
  - cheald 6y ago
    Of course. But given the high correlation, pursuing strength seems likely to produce the benefits of whatever the final cause happens to be.