6 ms·

"Many men are finding that having sex with a single woman of average attractiveness just doesn't cut it." Given that ~30% of young men are sexless and only ~15

by raducu 6y ago

"Many men are finding that having sex with a single woman of average attractiveness just doesn't cut it." Given that ~30% of young men are sexless and only ~15% of young women are sexless in the previous year, that just reeks of 3d wave feminism bullshit. Just as men are polyamorous, women are hypergamous, but nobody dares try to limit that. If we want normal birthrates and normal involvment from young men, we should: eliminate tax havens, tax, tax and tax some more owning more than one house, eliminate education borrowing, have affordable/public healthcare and education. Have a hard, data driven look of the population self-sustainability of cities, and tax cities that benefit from influx of population, and use that money to develop areas that have higher birth rates.

raxxorrax 6y ago
Both suggestions from both of you don't fit with my observations at all. People that do actually found families are overwhelmingly faithful in monogamous relationships, complete penguin style with house, dog and kids. Yes, yes, of course every second couple has a secret BDSM-basement and countless affairs... or maybe not. I think the evolutionary explanation we often hear are mostly horseshit to be honest and wouldn't even make sense since humans need decades to mature. The only trend I see is that people not married by 30 mostly aren't going to do it later and in many cases the men and women don't even want a relationship anymore. The sudden decision of settling down after having countless relationships is certainly a lifestyle lie to yourself and others. Just accept that marriage might not be for you, which is completely fine. Contrary to popular belief there is no pope forcing you to marry anyone. Some say there is societal pressure, but your mom and dad aren't society. Maybe these impressions actually do stem from porn although I don't really believe that either. Lifestyle choice seem to be primarily influenced by class and education. Maybe porn consumption is too, but I doubt it.
- GoblinSlayer 6y ago
  Polygamous men are just alpha males, obviously not all men are alpha, they just have broader visibility.
- raducu 6y ago
  "I think the evolutionary explanation we often hear are mostly horseshit to be honest and wouldn't even make sense since humans need decades to mature." There is overwhelming evidence for those explanations, both scientifically, anecdotally and empirically -- just take an average looking 25 year old male and make him ask 100 random women on the street if they would like to have sex with him and I guarantee, there will be 0 willing women. Then take an average looking 25 year old woman and make her ask 100 men if they want to have sex with her, and I also guarantee, 80+ men will be willing to do so right then and there(not in public, obviously). In any culture, in any country.
globular-toast 6y ago
Nothing you've said contradicts what I said. Male polygamy and female hypergamy go hand in hand. These two strategies evolved together. You can't have one without the other. Many of the 30% of sexless men have voluntarily withdrawn from the game for various reasons. Being able to satisfy their urges at home is a big one. This withdrawal just allows polygamy/hypergamy to enter society again. This is, after all, the natural order of things. Marriage and monogamy were just human inventions.
- J-dawg 6y ago
  I think you've got cause and effect backwards. Men are withdrawing because they are not being selected by women. Freed from social pressures that used to act as a brake on hypergamy, women are following their natural instinct to pursue the top 10-20% of men. Unfortunately, taken to its natural conclusion this leaves a huge chunk of people unhappy. Lower status men are sexless and unloved, and most women are unsatisfied because there aren't enough high status men to go around. Excessive porn use is a symptom of this, not the cause.
andrepd 6y ago
>Given that ~30% of young men are sexless Wouldn't this be an argument in GP's favour?
- hombre_fatal 6y ago
  Only if you thought the problem were that the standards of young men are too high. I'd wager the problems are more related to self-confidence, the ease in which you can avoid social interactions, and the root issue that you don't get laid as a man until you learn how to approach and talk to women. Some men never even learn how. The simple economics of sex (men having to pursue women, women being the selectors, just like in the rest of the animal kingdom) explains most of it.
  - raducu 6y ago
    90% of the men who lack confidence, lack confidence for a good reason. Surely if it was just about confidence in itself, evolution and sexual selection would have made all men super confident by now. The truth is men are mostly obsolete and worthless by the standard values that have been in place since the discovery of agriculture -- phisical labor is a lot less valuable thanks to mecanization and automation, the police, professional army, social wellfare have taken away a big chunk of what made men valuable before.

by raducu 6y ago

raxxorrax 6y ago

Both suggestions from both of you don't fit with my observations at all. People that do actually found families are overwhelmingly faithful in monogamous relationships, complete penguin style with house, dog and kids. Yes, yes, of course every second couple has a secret BDSM-basement and countless affairs... or maybe not. I think the evolutionary explanation we often hear are mostly horseshit to be honest and wouldn't even make sense since humans need decades to mature. The only trend I see is that people not married by 30 mostly aren't going to do it later and in many cases the men and women don't even want a relationship anymore. The sudden decision of settling down after having countless relationships is certainly a lifestyle lie to yourself and others. Just accept that marriage might not be for you, which is completely fine. Contrary to popular belief there is no pope forcing you to marry anyone. Some say there is societal pressure, but your mom and dad aren't society. Maybe these impressions actually do stem from porn although I don't really believe that either. Lifestyle choice seem to be primarily influenced by class and education. Maybe porn consumption is too, but I doubt it.

GoblinSlayer 6y ago
Polygamous men are just alpha males, obviously not all men are alpha, they just have broader visibility.
raducu 6y ago
"I think the evolutionary explanation we often hear are mostly horseshit to be honest and wouldn't even make sense since humans need decades to mature." There is overwhelming evidence for those explanations, both scientifically, anecdotally and empirically -- just take an average looking 25 year old male and make him ask 100 random women on the street if they would like to have sex with him and I guarantee, there will be 0 willing women. Then take an average looking 25 year old woman and make her ask 100 men if they want to have sex with her, and I also guarantee, 80+ men will be willing to do so right then and there(not in public, obviously). In any culture, in any country.

globular-toast 6y ago

Nothing you've said contradicts what I said. Male polygamy and female hypergamy go hand in hand. These two strategies evolved together. You can't have one without the other. Many of the 30% of sexless men have voluntarily withdrawn from the game for various reasons. Being able to satisfy their urges at home is a big one. This withdrawal just allows polygamy/hypergamy to enter society again. This is, after all, the natural order of things. Marriage and monogamy were just human inventions.

J-dawg 6y ago
I think you've got cause and effect backwards. Men are withdrawing because they are not being selected by women. Freed from social pressures that used to act as a brake on hypergamy, women are following their natural instinct to pursue the top 10-20% of men. Unfortunately, taken to its natural conclusion this leaves a huge chunk of people unhappy. Lower status men are sexless and unloved, and most women are unsatisfied because there aren't enough high status men to go around. Excessive porn use is a symptom of this, not the cause.

andrepd 6y ago

>Given that ~30% of young men are sexless Wouldn't this be an argument in GP's favour?

hombre_fatal 6y ago
Only if you thought the problem were that the standards of young men are too high. I'd wager the problems are more related to self-confidence, the ease in which you can avoid social interactions, and the root issue that you don't get laid as a man until you learn how to approach and talk to women. Some men never even learn how. The simple economics of sex (men having to pursue women, women being the selectors, just like in the rest of the animal kingdom) explains most of it.
- raducu 6y ago
  90% of the men who lack confidence, lack confidence for a good reason. Surely if it was just about confidence in itself, evolution and sexual selection would have made all men super confident by now. The truth is men are mostly obsolete and worthless by the standard values that have been in place since the discovery of agriculture -- phisical labor is a lot less valuable thanks to mecanization and automation, the police, professional army, social wellfare have taken away a big chunk of what made men valuable before.