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Having worked on a dating app startup with a 2m seed (it's since pivoted to a brewery run by active gang members), I can say the problem of dating is looked at

Having worked on a dating app startup with a 2m seed (it's since pivoted to a brewery run by active gang members), I can say the problem of dating is looked at horribly wrong. People assume dating is about finding the person "most compatible" with you. Compatibility is an illusion. Most people tend to date until they have an idea of "what they don't want". Once they know and they find someone who checks the boxes, they settle down. This article https://www.wired.com/2014/01/how-to-hack-okcupid/ https://www.wired.com/2014/01/how-to-hack-okcupid/ is not about a guy who created some algorithm for finding love. The algorithm was simple. He went on enough dates to know what he didn't want, and then found the person that matched that criteria.

toby 6y ago
>> (it's since pivoted to a brewery run by active gang members) Would this be an appropriate place to share that story? Because I'm intrigued
- poorman 6y ago
  The story has been written up by lots of news outlets. Googling "brewery run by active gang members" should start to paint the picture.
  - jhardy54 6y ago
    https://trucolors.co/ https://trucolors.co/
- pesfandiar 6y ago
  Looks like it's this one: https://trucolors.co/ https://trucolors.co/ Based on OP's description, it sounded like a company taken over by gangs, but it's really a for-profit social enterprise.
  - rburhum 6y ago
    This is the first time I have seen a hero page with gang signs. Not the best choice to be honest.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
YetAnotherMatt 6y ago
Do you have any data to back that up that you can share? I don't mean to call you out, it could very well be the case, people date in rather not-understandable ways to me. What you're saying does not match my experience though. Quite a few friends of mine have dated only very few people before getting married. Anecdotally, the marriages that seem to do the best are the marriages in which both partners did not have a dating history with a lot of partners "to find out what they don't want". That said, I'm aware of the negative selection bias there.
- polote 6y ago
  > Quite a few friends of mine have dated only very few people before getting married. This is not against what OP says, you could have some people who date less people and some who prefer to date a lot. At the end, both of them will probably settle down when they find one they like a lot
- watwut 6y ago
  Because long term marriage is a lot about your tendency to create long term emotional ties to people. It is also about your willingness to think about relationship itself and put work on it. It is also about selection, but much more about ability to weed out abusive people and selfish people and so on. Of course also compatibility, clean freak will never be happy with messy person. And those abilities form a lot in childhood, in family and with friends. They are also about your deep seeted values. A lot of short relationships suggest either lack of interest in long term relationship or inability to form it. The way hn talks about these issue always strikes me like a bunch of people who think people are machines and kind of don't undestand how people form relationships. Like qualifying a partner that don't fit some checkbox on original list someone was forced to make as "settling down". There is chemistry alias emotional and hormonal side to the whole thing, people.
  - jschwartzi 6y ago
    Those abilities are trainable, especially with therapy.
CerealFounder 6y ago
Wild plot twist
DennisP 6y ago
What's the difference between "compatible" and "doesn't have attributes I don't want?"
- moojd 6y ago
  The difference between a whitelist and blacklist. Here is a movie that satirizes the 'whitelist' approach: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lobster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lobster
borroka 6y ago
People who are in stable relationships are people who want to be in stable relationships. This is readily apparent when most find their spouse, significant other, love of their life or other half of the walnut in their small town, neighborhood, school, or place of work. People like me, who have been dating forever, fool themselves when they think the issue is compatibility, not having found the right person, or other pedestrian rationalizations. The simplest and more likely explanation of the dating-forever syndrome (or pleasure, because I had a great time dating) is that consciously or sub-, we don't want to be in a stable relationship.
- MaximumYComb 6y ago
  I've subconsciously burnt a number of opportunities to end up in a relationship with perfectly good women over the last few years. I work full time, I'm a single father and I'm studying. I get time to date between uni semesters but deep down I think I realise I don't have time for a stable relationship. At the same time I'm a human who has needs to develop connections with others, develop intimacy, etc. I don't see why dating-forever is seen as such a bad thing if you actually like dating.
  - borroka 6y ago
    Most of the norms of behavior and goals we find — at first – desirable are often nothing more than what novelist and people of imagination have repeatedly written or spoken about. But life is not a romance novel, there are rarely happy endings, and according to most people who got married, their spouse sounded more interesting a few years back. Why someone should be "the one"? How is it possible, if not by chance, that someone you find desirable in your 20s is still as desirable 30 years later? Then, when I hear that relationship need work to work, I want to run away as fast as Général du Pommeau. Next. As it is often the case, it boils down to personality, character traits, and culture; if you are someone who is intrinsically and culturally driven to long-term, if not forever, relationships, fine. But if you are not, live your life and respectfully forget about what novelist and imaginative people have written about. I traveled the world on my own, dated everywhere, and fulfilled my childhood dreams of desire and be desired. I had a few multi-year relationships, but don't make me think about them or you'd ruin my day. Had I listened to the spirit of the times or of the place, I would have ended up miserable, sad, and probably out of shape. Instead, when I am in bed and close to fall asleep, I often think about the exciting life I had, the amazing people I intimately knew, and the dreams I have for tomorrow. To each their own, always. And life has different phases and new desires will knock on my door, maybe a kid, maybe a long-term relationship, but always (I hope...) my choice.
foobiekr 6y ago
I think there's an unwarranted assumption in most dating theory that some kind of psycho-social compatibility, whether pro- or anti-, is a primary decider of anything. What if it's yet another illusion that the conscious mind is in control and, in fact, it's not really related? The attractiveness to women of differences in major histocompatibility complex genes is a documented thing, for example [1], More loosely we've all known people who were most attracted/committed to people who, intellectually by lists of criteria, etc., even they'd agree made no sense for them. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_odour_and_sexual_attraction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_odour_and_sexual_attracti...
tuesdayrain 6y ago
> Compatibility is an illusion. Most people tend to date until they have an idea of "what they don't want". Once they know and they find someone who checks the boxes, they settle down. I don't see how this suggests compatibility is an illusion. You just described another way of finding someone who is compatible. Personally I already had a mental checklist of everything I wanted out of a relationship, no dating around was necessary to know those things. Just basic introspection. I ended up marrying my second girlfriend and I would say the relationship is 100% perfect.
the_decider 6y ago
Seems like real-life more closely resembles Kepler’s “Marriage Problem” (later reformulated as the “Secratary Problem). https://www.npr.org/sections/krulwich/2014/05/15/312537965/how-to-marry-the-right-girl-a-mathematical-solution https://www.npr.org/sections/krulwich/2014/05/15/312537965/h... Its a solvable problem from optimal stopping theory. How many people should you date before you know enough to stop and settle (for the next person who’s better than than all the people you’ve dated thus far)? The answer’s x/e, where x can either be a maximum partner quantity, or thr number of years you give yourself to be on the open dating market.
sizzle 6y ago
"it's since pivoted to a brewery run by active gang members" Say what?? Sounds like there's an interesting story here...
DyslexicAtheist 6y ago
I think what makes relationships work/fail is the relationship people have with themselves above all else. At times I was lonely and miserable and wanted somebody in my life badly and in those times nobody ever was even remotely interested in me. The moment I did well and / or was also in a relationship it seemed like potential partners were all over me (it seemed almost unfair). Point I'm trying to make is people usually "date" for the wrong reasons. The moment they're in to find somebody to "complete themselves" they create a an unconscious demand on their partner which is the pre-programmed disaster that it will turn out to be. The moment I notice my date is "actively looking" I run. To me the whole concepts of "dating" is very sterile. It's not in my culture maybe to have a formal process where you sniff each other with prepared questions and then after 3 years you check "where this is going". What has worked well for me is not ever to look for partners actively and the trick was always "the less I look the more opportunities I find" (strange that). I think why most relationships don't last is because we literally suffocate everything that is good out of it. Usually it happens slowly so we don't notice (or tell ourselves things will get better - they usually don't). For most people it's just a way to build many small co-dependencies into a neurotic prison which they can be unhappy in but tell themselves "at least I feel secure". Some even think it's their mission to fix their partner (and all they do is set themselves up for pain). A timeless classic on the psychology of relationships: Scott Peck "The Road less Traveled" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Scott_Peck#The_Road_Less_Traveled https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Scott_Peck#The_Road_Less_Tr... (one of my top 10 fav books I ever read (and I read a lot). edit: my experience working for a dating startup called Friendscout24 (a total horror show) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18713837 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18713837

toby 6y ago

>> (it's since pivoted to a brewery run by active gang members) Would this be an appropriate place to share that story? Because I'm intrigued

poorman 6y ago
The story has been written up by lots of news outlets. Googling "brewery run by active gang members" should start to paint the picture.
- jhardy54 6y ago
  https://trucolors.co/ https://trucolors.co/
pesfandiar 6y ago
Looks like it's this one: https://trucolors.co/ https://trucolors.co/ Based on OP's description, it sounded like a company taken over by gangs, but it's really a for-profit social enterprise.
- rburhum 6y ago
  This is the first time I have seen a hero page with gang signs. Not the best choice to be honest.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

YetAnotherMatt 6y ago

Do you have any data to back that up that you can share? I don't mean to call you out, it could very well be the case, people date in rather not-understandable ways to me. What you're saying does not match my experience though. Quite a few friends of mine have dated only very few people before getting married. Anecdotally, the marriages that seem to do the best are the marriages in which both partners did not have a dating history with a lot of partners "to find out what they don't want". That said, I'm aware of the negative selection bias there.

polote 6y ago
> Quite a few friends of mine have dated only very few people before getting married. This is not against what OP says, you could have some people who date less people and some who prefer to date a lot. At the end, both of them will probably settle down when they find one they like a lot
watwut 6y ago
Because long term marriage is a lot about your tendency to create long term emotional ties to people. It is also about your willingness to think about relationship itself and put work on it. It is also about selection, but much more about ability to weed out abusive people and selfish people and so on. Of course also compatibility, clean freak will never be happy with messy person. And those abilities form a lot in childhood, in family and with friends. They are also about your deep seeted values. A lot of short relationships suggest either lack of interest in long term relationship or inability to form it. The way hn talks about these issue always strikes me like a bunch of people who think people are machines and kind of don't undestand how people form relationships. Like qualifying a partner that don't fit some checkbox on original list someone was forced to make as "settling down". There is chemistry alias emotional and hormonal side to the whole thing, people.
- jschwartzi 6y ago
  Those abilities are trainable, especially with therapy.

CerealFounder 6y ago

Wild plot twist

DennisP 6y ago

What's the difference between "compatible" and "doesn't have attributes I don't want?"

moojd 6y ago
The difference between a whitelist and blacklist. Here is a movie that satirizes the 'whitelist' approach: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lobster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lobster

borroka 6y ago

People who are in stable relationships are people who want to be in stable relationships. This is readily apparent when most find their spouse, significant other, love of their life or other half of the walnut in their small town, neighborhood, school, or place of work. People like me, who have been dating forever, fool themselves when they think the issue is compatibility, not having found the right person, or other pedestrian rationalizations. The simplest and more likely explanation of the dating-forever syndrome (or pleasure, because I had a great time dating) is that consciously or sub-, we don't want to be in a stable relationship.

MaximumYComb 6y ago
I've subconsciously burnt a number of opportunities to end up in a relationship with perfectly good women over the last few years. I work full time, I'm a single father and I'm studying. I get time to date between uni semesters but deep down I think I realise I don't have time for a stable relationship. At the same time I'm a human who has needs to develop connections with others, develop intimacy, etc. I don't see why dating-forever is seen as such a bad thing if you actually like dating.
- borroka 6y ago
  Most of the norms of behavior and goals we find — at first – desirable are often nothing more than what novelist and people of imagination have repeatedly written or spoken about. But life is not a romance novel, there are rarely happy endings, and according to most people who got married, their spouse sounded more interesting a few years back. Why someone should be "the one"? How is it possible, if not by chance, that someone you find desirable in your 20s is still as desirable 30 years later? Then, when I hear that relationship need work to work, I want to run away as fast as Général du Pommeau. Next. As it is often the case, it boils down to personality, character traits, and culture; if you are someone who is intrinsically and culturally driven to long-term, if not forever, relationships, fine. But if you are not, live your life and respectfully forget about what novelist and imaginative people have written about. I traveled the world on my own, dated everywhere, and fulfilled my childhood dreams of desire and be desired. I had a few multi-year relationships, but don't make me think about them or you'd ruin my day. Had I listened to the spirit of the times or of the place, I would have ended up miserable, sad, and probably out of shape. Instead, when I am in bed and close to fall asleep, I often think about the exciting life I had, the amazing people I intimately knew, and the dreams I have for tomorrow. To each their own, always. And life has different phases and new desires will knock on my door, maybe a kid, maybe a long-term relationship, but always (I hope...) my choice.

foobiekr 6y ago

I think there's an unwarranted assumption in most dating theory that some kind of psycho-social compatibility, whether pro- or anti-, is a primary decider of anything. What if it's yet another illusion that the conscious mind is in control and, in fact, it's not really related? The attractiveness to women of differences in major histocompatibility complex genes is a documented thing, for example [1], More loosely we've all known people who were most attracted/committed to people who, intellectually by lists of criteria, etc., even they'd agree made no sense for them. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_odour_and_sexual_attraction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_odour_and_sexual_attracti...

tuesdayrain 6y ago

> Compatibility is an illusion. Most people tend to date until they have an idea of "what they don't want". Once they know and they find someone who checks the boxes, they settle down. I don't see how this suggests compatibility is an illusion. You just described another way of finding someone who is compatible. Personally I already had a mental checklist of everything I wanted out of a relationship, no dating around was necessary to know those things. Just basic introspection. I ended up marrying my second girlfriend and I would say the relationship is 100% perfect.

the_decider 6y ago

Seems like real-life more closely resembles Kepler’s “Marriage Problem” (later reformulated as the “Secratary Problem). https://www.npr.org/sections/krulwich/2014/05/15/312537965/how-to-marry-the-right-girl-a-mathematical-solution https://www.npr.org/sections/krulwich/2014/05/15/312537965/h... Its a solvable problem from optimal stopping theory. How many people should you date before you know enough to stop and settle (for the next person who’s better than than all the people you’ve dated thus far)? The answer’s x/e, where x can either be a maximum partner quantity, or thr number of years you give yourself to be on the open dating market.

sizzle 6y ago

"it's since pivoted to a brewery run by active gang members" Say what?? Sounds like there's an interesting story here...

DyslexicAtheist 6y ago

I think what makes relationships work/fail is the relationship people have with themselves above all else. At times I was lonely and miserable and wanted somebody in my life badly and in those times nobody ever was even remotely interested in me. The moment I did well and / or was also in a relationship it seemed like potential partners were all over me (it seemed almost unfair). Point I'm trying to make is people usually "date" for the wrong reasons. The moment they're in to find somebody to "complete themselves" they create a an unconscious demand on their partner which is the pre-programmed disaster that it will turn out to be. The moment I notice my date is "actively looking" I run. To me the whole concepts of "dating" is very sterile. It's not in my culture maybe to have a formal process where you sniff each other with prepared questions and then after 3 years you check "where this is going". What has worked well for me is not ever to look for partners actively and the trick was always "the less I look the more opportunities I find" (strange that). I think why most relationships don't last is because we literally suffocate everything that is good out of it. Usually it happens slowly so we don't notice (or tell ourselves things will get better - they usually don't). For most people it's just a way to build many small co-dependencies into a neurotic prison which they can be unhappy in but tell themselves "at least I feel secure". Some even think it's their mission to fix their partner (and all they do is set themselves up for pain). A timeless classic on the psychology of relationships: Scott Peck "The Road less Traveled" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Scott_Peck#The_Road_Less_Traveled https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Scott_Peck#The_Road_Less_Tr... (one of my top 10 fav books I ever read (and I read a lot). edit: my experience working for a dating startup called Friendscout24 (a total horror show) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18713837 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18713837