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This is what is preventing my move from suburban Washington State to rural Montana or even Idaho. Getting ANY information from wired ISPs is like pulling teeth

This is what is preventing my move from suburban Washington State to rural Montana or even Idaho. Getting ANY information from wired ISPs is like pulling teeth. Each address has to be called in, and no ISP can say something helpful like "we don't service that, but try ISP X", they all say "that's not on our service area... today". I have high hopes for Starlink, personally, but my first choice would absolutely be gigabit fiber to the homestead.

alteria 6y ago
Funnily enough, I was doing research one day and came across a local ISP co-op in one of the Dakotas that was selling rural, symmetric 1/1 for $70 per month. Much better service at a lower cost than in SF (been trying to get ATT to finish their fiber install for the past 2 months). Unfortunately I don't remember the name, but you could probably find it on one of the FCC maps.
- andrewnicolalde 6y ago
  I’m guessing they didn’t mean 1 gigabit :(
  - alteria 6y ago
    They did, which was the shocking part! If you believe their claims about profit distributions (which you probably shouldn't), the total cost might even average less than $70/mo.
- proverbialbunny 6y ago
  Sonic in SF is a better deal, no?
  - CliffStoll 6y ago
    You betcha! I live in the East bay and Sonic gigabit fiber to the house delivers 1Gb/s up and down. No data caps. $62 per month includes taxes, fees, and a VOIP phone line. Dynamic IP address, but you can't have everything.
    - NickNameNick 6y ago
      At least it's a public IP and not CGNAT.
pottertheotter 6y ago
There are a few cities in Idaho that have municipal broadband. Might not be locations you're looking at, but worth noting. I believe Ammon and Idaho Falls are two of them.
driverdan 6y ago
You can use the FTC Broadband Map[1] to find areas that already have fiber. It's not that precise, especially in rural areas, but can be a good starting point to know if there's at least one fiber install in the general area. 1: https://broadbandmap.fcc.gov/ https://broadbandmap.fcc.gov/
- cure 6y ago
  > It's not that precise I think you're being too kind. That map is a disgrace. The 'latest public release' is from June 2019, a whole year out of date. One self-reported hookup in a census block is enough to mark the entire block as 'having service', which is a ridiculous metric, particularly in rural areas as you said. This map was designed by the incumbents as something to point at when they are criticized for the sub-par and overpriced services they provide. And the FCC went along with it, which is just regulatory capture. A real broadband map would a) not rely on self-reporting or have really serious fines if companies deliberately provide incorrect information b) give an indication of what is actually installed (1 house out of the 100 in this census block has fiber from Verizon? Great, 1% actually installed). c) give an indication of what is actually available. 95 buildings out of 100 can't get the Verizon fiber service? That's 95% of the census block that does not have service. The telcos have this information (they all have a way to look up a physical address on their website to see if you can get service), they are just not sharing it. The FCC broadband map is about as bad as the cell phone carrier's coverage maps, which are also a complete joke. For those, though, there are crowdsourced and way more accurate alternatives (e.g. opensignal.com, cellmapper.net).
  - zbrozek 6y ago
    Yeah the FCC thinks I have 19 options for broadband. I most assuredly do not.
jschwartzi 6y ago
Whatever you do, avoid Ziply. It sounds like a great deal but when they bought out Frontier in our area they cancelled our auto-pay and then wouldn't refund the late fee. I think we spent more than 16 hours total on the phone with them. They still haven't mailed out the return label for their MoCa bridge. The first time we tried calling them the CSR would "put us on hold to be transferred" and then hang up on us. This happened about 3 times over the course of 2 hours. Nothing any of their CSRs say can be trusted. It is absolutely the worst company I have ever had the displeasure of doing business with, and I'm so happy I had the option of switching to Comcast.
- slivanes 6y ago
  Just be aware that Ziply inherited the Frontier customer support team and the supposedly poor software as well. My last call with Ziply 2 weeks ago to upgrade my 50/50 to 100/100 was a great experience. I'm not saying every call is going to be great, just that it can be.
- virtuallynathan 6y ago
  I know the network folks at Ziply, and they are investing a lot of time, effort, and money into improving things as quickly as possible. It’s some of the same folks from CondoInternet / WaveG.

alteria 6y ago

Funnily enough, I was doing research one day and came across a local ISP co-op in one of the Dakotas that was selling rural, symmetric 1/1 for $70 per month. Much better service at a lower cost than in SF (been trying to get ATT to finish their fiber install for the past 2 months). Unfortunately I don't remember the name, but you could probably find it on one of the FCC maps.

andrewnicolalde 6y ago
I’m guessing they didn’t mean 1 gigabit :(
- alteria 6y ago
  They did, which was the shocking part! If you believe their claims about profit distributions (which you probably shouldn't), the total cost might even average less than $70/mo.
proverbialbunny 6y ago
Sonic in SF is a better deal, no?
- CliffStoll 6y ago
  You betcha! I live in the East bay and Sonic gigabit fiber to the house delivers 1Gb/s up and down. No data caps. $62 per month includes taxes, fees, and a VOIP phone line. Dynamic IP address, but you can't have everything.
  - NickNameNick 6y ago
    At least it's a public IP and not CGNAT.

pottertheotter 6y ago

There are a few cities in Idaho that have municipal broadband. Might not be locations you're looking at, but worth noting. I believe Ammon and Idaho Falls are two of them.

driverdan 6y ago

You can use the FTC Broadband Map[1] to find areas that already have fiber. It's not that precise, especially in rural areas, but can be a good starting point to know if there's at least one fiber install in the general area. 1: https://broadbandmap.fcc.gov/ https://broadbandmap.fcc.gov/

cure 6y ago
> It's not that precise I think you're being too kind. That map is a disgrace. The 'latest public release' is from June 2019, a whole year out of date. One self-reported hookup in a census block is enough to mark the entire block as 'having service', which is a ridiculous metric, particularly in rural areas as you said. This map was designed by the incumbents as something to point at when they are criticized for the sub-par and overpriced services they provide. And the FCC went along with it, which is just regulatory capture. A real broadband map would a) not rely on self-reporting or have really serious fines if companies deliberately provide incorrect information b) give an indication of what is actually installed (1 house out of the 100 in this census block has fiber from Verizon? Great, 1% actually installed). c) give an indication of what is actually available. 95 buildings out of 100 can't get the Verizon fiber service? That's 95% of the census block that does not have service. The telcos have this information (they all have a way to look up a physical address on their website to see if you can get service), they are just not sharing it. The FCC broadband map is about as bad as the cell phone carrier's coverage maps, which are also a complete joke. For those, though, there are crowdsourced and way more accurate alternatives (e.g. opensignal.com, cellmapper.net).
- zbrozek 6y ago
  Yeah the FCC thinks I have 19 options for broadband. I most assuredly do not.

jschwartzi 6y ago

Whatever you do, avoid Ziply. It sounds like a great deal but when they bought out Frontier in our area they cancelled our auto-pay and then wouldn't refund the late fee. I think we spent more than 16 hours total on the phone with them. They still haven't mailed out the return label for their MoCa bridge. The first time we tried calling them the CSR would "put us on hold to be transferred" and then hang up on us. This happened about 3 times over the course of 2 hours. Nothing any of their CSRs say can be trusted. It is absolutely the worst company I have ever had the displeasure of doing business with, and I'm so happy I had the option of switching to Comcast.

slivanes 6y ago
Just be aware that Ziply inherited the Frontier customer support team and the supposedly poor software as well. My last call with Ziply 2 weeks ago to upgrade my 50/50 to 100/100 was a great experience. I'm not saying every call is going to be great, just that it can be.
virtuallynathan 6y ago
I know the network folks at Ziply, and they are investing a lot of time, effort, and money into improving things as quickly as possible. It’s some of the same folks from CondoInternet / WaveG.