4 ms·

65,000 listeners a month – $800 in revenue. 1.23 cents per listener per month. That works out to 14.7 cents per year. To earn a modest $50,000, you would need ~

65,000 listeners a month – $800 in revenue. 1.23 cents per listener per month. That works out to 14.7 cents per year. To earn a modest $50,000, you would need ~360,000 monthly listeners. This doesn't seem sustainable without outside sources of revenue.

sharkweek 6y ago
Correct, this is why bands tour and sell shirts and other merch, and for most, work second jobs. As an anecdote, friend of mine is in two or three bands at any given time and bartends most nights he’s not playing shows. Spotify makes it easier than ever for an artist to get their work out there, which is great, but it’s similar to the publishing world, where most authors who self publish do so into the void.
- racl101 6y ago
  As a humble band once said, I think their name was AC/DC: Gettin' old Gettin' gray Gettin' ripped off Underpaid Gettin' sold Second-hand That's how it goes Playin' in a band It's a long way to the top If you wanna rock 'n' roll
- jjice 6y ago
  The best way to support an artist you really like is to purchase merchandise, buy their music on Bandcamp, and see them live. For bands I really like, I buy the album on Bandcamp and then just listen to it on Spotify for convenience. Besides, who doesn't love a good tee with your favorite band's lyrics on it?
  - sharkweek 6y ago
    I love buying tour t-shirts. I have amassed a large collection I hope to pass onto my kids at some point. What I wouldn't give for some of the shirts I've seen my dad wearing in old photos of shows he went to. Grateful Dead, Rolling Stones, etc.
- xwdv 6y ago
  The truth about bands is that they are basically T-Shirt companies.
- dang 6y ago
  > friend of mine is in two or three bands at any given time and bartends most nights he’s not playing shows What and how has he been doing during lockdown?
  - sharkweek 6y ago
    He lives in NYC to make matters worse during those earlier months. He's alive and didn't catch it though, so there's that. Doesn't come from like a super wealthy family, but he'll be fine financially if things never return to normal. We're in our 30s so I do think he's looking for something more structured anyways, this might be a catalyst.
Scoundreller 6y ago
Hopefully any musician isn’t depending solely on Spotify. But then again, saying the same thing about Youtube doesn’t quite sound the same.
speedgoose 6y ago
50 000$ isn't modest in most parts of the world.
- HenryKissinger 6y ago
  I was thinking about that. Live in Southeast Asia or Costa Rica for half the year, pay a fraction in cost of living compared to the US, and invest the savings.
john-shaffer 6y ago
That's $800/month for a tiny artist that would otherwise be making about $0/month. > I don't tour, I don't sell merch and I'm not on a major label. I'm just a small indie artist making music in my evenings— and Spotify is making that possible. In other words, it's a hobby.
- dannytatom 6y ago
  good money for a hobby tho if you can luck into a playlist
3pt14159 6y ago
I listen to about 200 or 300 songs a day since I need music to get into the zone. It's listens not listeners.
- timerol 6y ago
  > I get about 177,000 plays / month. Spotify is 96% of those plays. > I earn around $800 / month from music streaming. Spotify is 93% of that income. > And every month about 65,000 people listen to my music on Spotify. The number quoted was for listeners, and is correctly 1.23 cents per listener per month. If you want to go by listens, then it's ($800 * 0.93) / (177,000 * 0.96) = 0.44 cents per listen.
  - 3pt14159 6y ago
    My mistake, thanks for the correction. I agree this is unsustainable if the average person only listens to three songs a day, which seems extremely, extremely low to me unless there is a distribution issue going on where certain songs are more likely to be listened to frequently or if the majority of listens are people searching for new music until they find one they can loop for a while.
schnable 6y ago
Not just that, many acts are splitting the royalties amongst band members, song writers, producers, etc.
tgb 6y ago
I pay for Google Play Music which is similar to Spotify. I wish I knew how much of my money was going to which artists I listen to, but I suspect the result is disappointing. $10 a month is far more than I would spend on music otherwise and if even half of it went to artists I listen to, then I'd be supporting them reasonably well IMO. It should add up decently. I kind of doubt that it does.
Reedx 6y ago
> This doesn't seem sustainable without outside sources of revenue. The reality for most creators, really. There's way more supply than demand and you have to contend with power laws. The top ~1% of books, movies, games, music, youtube videos, twitch streams, HN threads, etc, always dominate. Capturing ~80% of attention/money. The distribution falls off rapidly with a long tail, which is unsustainable for most.
schoolornot 6y ago
I'm surprised there hasn't been a class action lawsuit by the artists for the conflict-of-interest the labels have with Spotify. Sony, Universal and Warner Music all owned stakes in Spotify and it was against the interests of artists to offer Spotify content in exchange for razor thin royalties.
thisisbrians 6y ago
He's doing this part time. A full-time music producer could easily make more/better music, especially if she is not touring. For perspective, an electronic artist I admire, Zhu, was once producing an entire song every single week. There is, however, no substitute for 'talent.'
notJim 6y ago
As far as I know, even famous indie artists you listen to and whose concerts you go to often have to work day jobs. Most are working class. There's not a lot of money being a musician.

sharkweek 6y ago

Correct, this is why bands tour and sell shirts and other merch, and for most, work second jobs. As an anecdote, friend of mine is in two or three bands at any given time and bartends most nights he’s not playing shows. Spotify makes it easier than ever for an artist to get their work out there, which is great, but it’s similar to the publishing world, where most authors who self publish do so into the void.

racl101 6y ago
As a humble band once said, I think their name was AC/DC: Gettin' old Gettin' gray Gettin' ripped off Underpaid Gettin' sold Second-hand That's how it goes Playin' in a band It's a long way to the top If you wanna rock 'n' roll
jjice 6y ago
The best way to support an artist you really like is to purchase merchandise, buy their music on Bandcamp, and see them live. For bands I really like, I buy the album on Bandcamp and then just listen to it on Spotify for convenience. Besides, who doesn't love a good tee with your favorite band's lyrics on it?
- sharkweek 6y ago
  I love buying tour t-shirts. I have amassed a large collection I hope to pass onto my kids at some point. What I wouldn't give for some of the shirts I've seen my dad wearing in old photos of shows he went to. Grateful Dead, Rolling Stones, etc.
xwdv 6y ago
The truth about bands is that they are basically T-Shirt companies.
dang 6y ago
> friend of mine is in two or three bands at any given time and bartends most nights he’s not playing shows What and how has he been doing during lockdown?
- sharkweek 6y ago
  He lives in NYC to make matters worse during those earlier months. He's alive and didn't catch it though, so there's that. Doesn't come from like a super wealthy family, but he'll be fine financially if things never return to normal. We're in our 30s so I do think he's looking for something more structured anyways, this might be a catalyst.

Scoundreller 6y ago

Hopefully any musician isn’t depending solely on Spotify. But then again, saying the same thing about Youtube doesn’t quite sound the same.

speedgoose 6y ago

50 000$ isn't modest in most parts of the world.

HenryKissinger 6y ago
I was thinking about that. Live in Southeast Asia or Costa Rica for half the year, pay a fraction in cost of living compared to the US, and invest the savings.

john-shaffer 6y ago

That's $800/month for a tiny artist that would otherwise be making about $0/month. > I don't tour, I don't sell merch and I'm not on a major label. I'm just a small indie artist making music in my evenings— and Spotify is making that possible. In other words, it's a hobby.

dannytatom 6y ago
good money for a hobby tho if you can luck into a playlist

3pt14159 6y ago

I listen to about 200 or 300 songs a day since I need music to get into the zone. It's listens not listeners.

timerol 6y ago
> I get about 177,000 plays / month. Spotify is 96% of those plays. > I earn around $800 / month from music streaming. Spotify is 93% of that income. > And every month about 65,000 people listen to my music on Spotify. The number quoted was for listeners, and is correctly 1.23 cents per listener per month. If you want to go by listens, then it's ($800 * 0.93) / (177,000 * 0.96) = 0.44 cents per listen.
- 3pt14159 6y ago
  My mistake, thanks for the correction. I agree this is unsustainable if the average person only listens to three songs a day, which seems extremely, extremely low to me unless there is a distribution issue going on where certain songs are more likely to be listened to frequently or if the majority of listens are people searching for new music until they find one they can loop for a while.

schnable 6y ago

Not just that, many acts are splitting the royalties amongst band members, song writers, producers, etc.

tgb 6y ago

I pay for Google Play Music which is similar to Spotify. I wish I knew how much of my money was going to which artists I listen to, but I suspect the result is disappointing. $10 a month is far more than I would spend on music otherwise and if even half of it went to artists I listen to, then I'd be supporting them reasonably well IMO. It should add up decently. I kind of doubt that it does.

Reedx 6y ago

> This doesn't seem sustainable without outside sources of revenue. The reality for most creators, really. There's way more supply than demand and you have to contend with power laws. The top ~1% of books, movies, games, music, youtube videos, twitch streams, HN threads, etc, always dominate. Capturing ~80% of attention/money. The distribution falls off rapidly with a long tail, which is unsustainable for most.

schoolornot 6y ago

I'm surprised there hasn't been a class action lawsuit by the artists for the conflict-of-interest the labels have with Spotify. Sony, Universal and Warner Music all owned stakes in Spotify and it was against the interests of artists to offer Spotify content in exchange for razor thin royalties.

thisisbrians 6y ago

He's doing this part time. A full-time music producer could easily make more/better music, especially if she is not touring. For perspective, an electronic artist I admire, Zhu, was once producing an entire song every single week. There is, however, no substitute for 'talent.'

notJim 6y ago

As far as I know, even famous indie artists you listen to and whose concerts you go to often have to work day jobs. Most are working class. There's not a lot of money being a musician.