4 ms·

Their reasons for existing were the same as the ones you listed for Apple stores: Brand, hands on, direct sale. I'd also add that they serve as a place where bu

Their reasons for existing were the same as the ones you listed for Apple stores: Brand, hands on, direct sale. I'd also add that they serve as a place where buyers believe that they can get support on product, thus increasing their trust in the product. That's an incredibly valuable thing IMO.

sys_64738 6y ago
What products did Microsoft support there? I only have Microsoft OS and none of their devices so maybe I'm missing their value. FWIW, if I have Windows issues on a Dell laptop then I call Dell for vendor support.
- postingawayonhn 6y ago
  Mainly Surface and Xbox. Remember that Microsoft launched the Microsoft Store model under Ballmer when they were trying to go head on with Apple in the consumer space.
- busyant 6y ago
  I had a surface book2. I bought the accidental damage protection. A year after I bought it, I cracked the screen. Took me all of 60 min to get the problem fixed: 20 min to drive to the store. 20 min to get a replacement. 20 min to drive home. The store was remarkably convenient for me (for this and just for seeing the sb2 in action). Not sure if I would have purchased it without the store.
dangus 6y ago
I don't agree with this. The Microsoft Store was basically a bad version of Best Buy that happened to sell Microsoft's hardware products front and center. Why would a customer go to a Microsoft Store instead of a Best Buy? It has less selection, fewer locations, and likely worse prices, while selling essentially the same product categories. The Apple Store, in contrast, is arguably mostly possible because it's a massive cell phone store, and before that an iPod store. They didn't exist before the iPod era. By now, Macs probably only account for 5% of the economic activity that takes place in Apple Stores.
- scarface74 6y ago
  Because you could buy a Windows PC at the Microsoft store and not have to spend hours removing all of the third party crapware from the OEM and even more crapware from Best Buy. Either that, or you have to go directly to the vendors website and buy one of the business laptops.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
aczerepinski 6y ago
Don’t forget LinkedIn profile photo booths! (not kidding, I saw one when I walked past my local MS store)
- nitrogen 6y ago
  This seems like the kind of corporate nightmarish product that could only arise from those two. Even if the "value add" was a pro-level photo to boost job offers, why are we using photos for job offers in the first place?
  - lotsofpulp 6y ago
    Good looking people cause enjoyable chemical reactions to occur in people’s brains. If you take two identically qualified people, the person who appears/sounds more pleasing to the buyer will win the business. It’s part of nature, for better or for worse.
    - nitrogen 6y ago
      Orchestras introduced blind auditions to address this bias. Why don't we do that for other jobs? I say this as someone who would probably fall in one of the categories of people who would supposedly benefit from this bias.
      - jrockway 6y ago
        This is the intended effect of the tech interviews that HN hates so much. Interviewers talk to the candidate and write down feedback about how the interview went. Then a hiring committee reads the notes and makes a decision. The hiring committee never sees the candidate, so can't judge their appearance. When I was doing interviews at Google, we were also trying very hard to write feedback like "the candidate said XXX" instead of "she said XXX", so that that source of bias was not available to the hiring committee. (It's not perfect, of course, because the person writing the feedback can be biased by those things. But it's better than looking at resumes with photos attached.)
AgloeDreams 6y ago
Totally agree for Microsoft product owners. One of the hard things for MS I think is that the Apple store was successful because you couldn't get a Mac in the past anywhere else and it was a good experience that really set the tone of the Mac. Then the iPhone and iPod happened, that blew up the Store market for Apple. Microsoft doesn't have an iPhone, didn't have a successful consumer market beyond the Xbox and most can and will get a Microsoft product somewhere else. Worse even, it is a hard place to read for the customer. What do they sell? Obviously products running windows, but I don't think that really tied back to Microsoft's own products, surface, Xbox, etc. When the stores first were created the notable thing I realized about them was this: People, normal people, don't actually care about Microsoft. They use their massive body of work, they live the Microsoft life, but they don't actually see it as cool or interesting. Few normal people are like 'Woah, look at the Surface Neo!'. They have a major uptight brand problem, maybe the Mac v PC ads helped cause that, perhaps an engineering-led culture rather than a product or human-focused culture? I think the lesson MS learned here is that you can and could copy everything about an Apple store but that doesn't make you Apple and doesn't bring their unique context in which the stores work extremely well.
- lotsofpulp 6y ago
  > They have a major uptight brand problem, maybe the Mac v PC ads helped cause that, perhaps Maybe because the standard advice given when purchasing a Microsoft device was to spend hours reinstalling Windows to remove malware. I know technically it was HP or Dell or Sony’s device, but since there was no non malware option, obviously Microsoft chose to let those brands sully Microsoft’s brand for a few dollars in short term profit.
  - AgloeDreams 6y ago
    Ironically that got so bad that they sold 'Microsoft signature editions' without junk at the store.
- WWLink 6y ago
  "One of the hard things for MS I think is that the Apple store was successful because you couldn't get a Mac in the past anywhere else and it was a good experience that really set the tone of the Mac." CompUSA and Best Buy sold them, so did a lot of independent resellers. I guess it was kinda like buying a thinkpad back then. Indie computer shops used to really be a thing in large cities.

sys_64738 6y ago

What products did Microsoft support there? I only have Microsoft OS and none of their devices so maybe I'm missing their value. FWIW, if I have Windows issues on a Dell laptop then I call Dell for vendor support.

postingawayonhn 6y ago
Mainly Surface and Xbox. Remember that Microsoft launched the Microsoft Store model under Ballmer when they were trying to go head on with Apple in the consumer space.
busyant 6y ago
I had a surface book2. I bought the accidental damage protection. A year after I bought it, I cracked the screen. Took me all of 60 min to get the problem fixed: 20 min to drive to the store. 20 min to get a replacement. 20 min to drive home. The store was remarkably convenient for me (for this and just for seeing the sb2 in action). Not sure if I would have purchased it without the store.

dangus 6y ago

I don't agree with this. The Microsoft Store was basically a bad version of Best Buy that happened to sell Microsoft's hardware products front and center. Why would a customer go to a Microsoft Store instead of a Best Buy? It has less selection, fewer locations, and likely worse prices, while selling essentially the same product categories. The Apple Store, in contrast, is arguably mostly possible because it's a massive cell phone store, and before that an iPod store. They didn't exist before the iPod era. By now, Macs probably only account for 5% of the economic activity that takes place in Apple Stores.

scarface74 6y ago
Because you could buy a Windows PC at the Microsoft store and not have to spend hours removing all of the third party crapware from the OEM and even more crapware from Best Buy. Either that, or you have to go directly to the vendors website and buy one of the business laptops.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]

aczerepinski 6y ago

Don’t forget LinkedIn profile photo booths! (not kidding, I saw one when I walked past my local MS store)

nitrogen 6y ago
This seems like the kind of corporate nightmarish product that could only arise from those two. Even if the "value add" was a pro-level photo to boost job offers, why are we using photos for job offers in the first place?
- lotsofpulp 6y ago
  Good looking people cause enjoyable chemical reactions to occur in people’s brains. If you take two identically qualified people, the person who appears/sounds more pleasing to the buyer will win the business. It’s part of nature, for better or for worse.
  - nitrogen 6y ago
    Orchestras introduced blind auditions to address this bias. Why don't we do that for other jobs? I say this as someone who would probably fall in one of the categories of people who would supposedly benefit from this bias.
    - jrockway 6y ago
      This is the intended effect of the tech interviews that HN hates so much. Interviewers talk to the candidate and write down feedback about how the interview went. Then a hiring committee reads the notes and makes a decision. The hiring committee never sees the candidate, so can't judge their appearance. When I was doing interviews at Google, we were also trying very hard to write feedback like "the candidate said XXX" instead of "she said XXX", so that that source of bias was not available to the hiring committee. (It's not perfect, of course, because the person writing the feedback can be biased by those things. But it's better than looking at resumes with photos attached.)

AgloeDreams 6y ago

Totally agree for Microsoft product owners. One of the hard things for MS I think is that the Apple store was successful because you couldn't get a Mac in the past anywhere else and it was a good experience that really set the tone of the Mac. Then the iPhone and iPod happened, that blew up the Store market for Apple. Microsoft doesn't have an iPhone, didn't have a successful consumer market beyond the Xbox and most can and will get a Microsoft product somewhere else. Worse even, it is a hard place to read for the customer. What do they sell? Obviously products running windows, but I don't think that really tied back to Microsoft's own products, surface, Xbox, etc. When the stores first were created the notable thing I realized about them was this: People, normal people, don't actually care about Microsoft. They use their massive body of work, they live the Microsoft life, but they don't actually see it as cool or interesting. Few normal people are like 'Woah, look at the Surface Neo!'. They have a major uptight brand problem, maybe the Mac v PC ads helped cause that, perhaps an engineering-led culture rather than a product or human-focused culture? I think the lesson MS learned here is that you can and could copy everything about an Apple store but that doesn't make you Apple and doesn't bring their unique context in which the stores work extremely well.

lotsofpulp 6y ago
> They have a major uptight brand problem, maybe the Mac v PC ads helped cause that, perhaps Maybe because the standard advice given when purchasing a Microsoft device was to spend hours reinstalling Windows to remove malware. I know technically it was HP or Dell or Sony’s device, but since there was no non malware option, obviously Microsoft chose to let those brands sully Microsoft’s brand for a few dollars in short term profit.
- AgloeDreams 6y ago
  Ironically that got so bad that they sold 'Microsoft signature editions' without junk at the store.
WWLink 6y ago
"One of the hard things for MS I think is that the Apple store was successful because you couldn't get a Mac in the past anywhere else and it was a good experience that really set the tone of the Mac." CompUSA and Best Buy sold them, so did a lot of independent resellers. I guess it was kinda like buying a thinkpad back then. Indie computer shops used to really be a thing in large cities.