4 ms·

There's an updated video from the same channel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO5rXxJRmf4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO5rXxJRmf4 I'd start at 4:50.

ciarannolan 6y ago
Is any cockpit audio removed from this? It's pretty damn silent for two guys who are about to smash an airplane into a residential area.
- ceejayoz 6y ago
  Sounds like it's just the ATC. Cockpit recordings aren't typically released except in transcript form, I believe.
- taborj 6y ago
  You're only hearing the transmissions they made (likely recorded via the ATC side). Any in-cockpit conversations/panic would not have been recorded, or at least not released.
  - briandear 6y ago
    > Any in-cockpit conversations/panic would not have been recorded They are recorded.
    - taborj 6y ago
      or at least not released.
gus_massa 6y ago
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO5rXxJRmf4&t=4m50s http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO5rXxJRmf4&t=4m50s (If you don't remember how to add the time, you can use https://youtubetime.com/ https://youtubetime.com/ )
- ciarannolan 6y ago
  You can also right-click any Youtube video and choose "Copy video URL at current time".
  - macintux 6y ago
    Not available in all YT clients, though.
pbhjpbhj 6y ago
Why doesn't ATC demand they come in to line, the copilot didn't appear to explain the very high approach (7000ft when they should be 3000ft) ... is there a benefit to it?? First thing I learnt on a flight sim: slow down or you can't extend gear. Is the co-pilot allowed to smash the pilot in the face and take over when they realise they're ignoring basic instructions?
- HeyLaughingBoy 6y ago
  Well, it's his life on the line, so sure he's allowed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crew_resource_management https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crew_resource_management
- tialaramex 6y ago
  They're both pilots, or, if you want to put it that way, both co-pilots. The ranks are typically "Captain" and "First officer" and what ought to matter in a well-trained team is Pilot Flying versus Pilot Monitoring (sometimes other phrasing is used but that name scheme is pretty clear what's happening). It takes explicit training to overcome a human tendency to defer, and that means training for all crew and especially cockpit crew. This is called Crew Resource Management and it involves learning interpersonal skills that enable the team to prevent individual human errors from having grave consequences. CRM is most often important in the cockpit, in this example to get the pilot flying the plane to agree that this approach is bad and they need to try a fresh approach. But CRM extends beyond the cockpit because in some incidents it's vital to remember that the rest of the crew are experts too, just not in flying a plane.
  - numpad0 6y ago
    It took me too long to get this so I’ll leave it here: Colloquially we call all aviator people as “pilots” but technically the person on the left seat is Captain and to the right is First Officer/Pilot/Co-Pilot. Like on marine vessels, the original idea is that the captain has the full authority to his ship and his first officer steers it under his order. That extra hierarchy lead to several accidents so newer concepts such as PM/PF or CRM rules were conceived, but as far as terminologies go that’s what captain/officer stands for.

ciarannolan 6y ago

Is any cockpit audio removed from this? It's pretty damn silent for two guys who are about to smash an airplane into a residential area.

ceejayoz 6y ago
Sounds like it's just the ATC. Cockpit recordings aren't typically released except in transcript form, I believe.
taborj 6y ago
You're only hearing the transmissions they made (likely recorded via the ATC side). Any in-cockpit conversations/panic would not have been recorded, or at least not released.
- briandear 6y ago
  > Any in-cockpit conversations/panic would not have been recorded They are recorded.
  - taborj 6y ago
    or at least not released.

gus_massa 6y ago

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO5rXxJRmf4&t=4m50s http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO5rXxJRmf4&t=4m50s (If you don't remember how to add the time, you can use https://youtubetime.com/ https://youtubetime.com/ )

ciarannolan 6y ago
You can also right-click any Youtube video and choose "Copy video URL at current time".
- macintux 6y ago
  Not available in all YT clients, though.

pbhjpbhj 6y ago

Why doesn't ATC demand they come in to line, the copilot didn't appear to explain the very high approach (7000ft when they should be 3000ft) ... is there a benefit to it?? First thing I learnt on a flight sim: slow down or you can't extend gear. Is the co-pilot allowed to smash the pilot in the face and take over when they realise they're ignoring basic instructions?

HeyLaughingBoy 6y ago
Well, it's his life on the line, so sure he's allowed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crew_resource_management https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crew_resource_management
tialaramex 6y ago
They're both pilots, or, if you want to put it that way, both co-pilots. The ranks are typically "Captain" and "First officer" and what ought to matter in a well-trained team is Pilot Flying versus Pilot Monitoring (sometimes other phrasing is used but that name scheme is pretty clear what's happening). It takes explicit training to overcome a human tendency to defer, and that means training for all crew and especially cockpit crew. This is called Crew Resource Management and it involves learning interpersonal skills that enable the team to prevent individual human errors from having grave consequences. CRM is most often important in the cockpit, in this example to get the pilot flying the plane to agree that this approach is bad and they need to try a fresh approach. But CRM extends beyond the cockpit because in some incidents it's vital to remember that the rest of the crew are experts too, just not in flying a plane.
- numpad0 6y ago
  It took me too long to get this so I’ll leave it here: Colloquially we call all aviator people as “pilots” but technically the person on the left seat is Captain and to the right is First Officer/Pilot/Co-Pilot. Like on marine vessels, the original idea is that the captain has the full authority to his ship and his first officer steers it under his order. That extra hierarchy lead to several accidents so newer concepts such as PM/PF or CRM rules were conceived, but as far as terminologies go that’s what captain/officer stands for.