4 ms·

What's the horrible meaning of the phrase 'joy division'? Do people just not like that band anymore?

by _hark 6y ago

nl 6y ago
Unfortunately, when the name “joyplot” took off, nobody in the datascience community was aware of the origin of the name “Joy Division”. As described in the book House of Dolls, joy divisions were groups of Jewish women in Nazi concentration camps kept for the sexual pleasure of soldiers. The band Joy Division took their name directly from this book and even quoted from the book in one of their early songs. https://serialmentor.com/blog/2017/9/15/goodbye-joyplots https://serialmentor.com/blog/2017/9/15/goodbye-joyplots I wasn't aware of this either. Given the theme of Joy Division (the band)'s songs I think it's very fair to say they meant it ironically, but I do think it's fair not to name a beautiful plot type after something so horrible.
- kranner 6y ago
  > fair not to name a beautiful plot type after something so horrible. Wasn't it an association that surfaced subsequent to being named after the band? In that sense it would not be "named after" Nazi joy divisions, I think? (as that would imply being aware of the association while choosing the name)
  - mejutoco 6y ago
    In the film 24 hour party people it seems like the band (joy division) is aware of the meaning of the name and uses it for shock value/polemic/postmodernism attitude. IIRC some people shout at them while going on/off-stage regarding this.
    - 082349872349872 6y ago
      The band "Oy Division" is also no doubt aware of the meaning of their name. (they turned up via surfing from "Zog nit keyn mol") Recommended only if dialectical polyglot klezmer cabaret is your cup of tea.
  - nl 6y ago
    > In that sense it would not be "named after" Nazi joy divisions, I think? (as that would imply being aware of the association while choosing the name) Sure, I don't think anyone involved with naming the package was aware of it. But I think they made the correct choice to rename once they became aware of it. Perhaps "have the name of a beautiful plot type associated with something so horrible" may have been better phrasing.
- _hark 6y ago
  Wow I had no idea. Thanks for the info and link. The seismic community has been producing plots like these for decades, but they're just referred to as "wiggle plots", not a great name. Ridgeline seems like the best option going forward!

What's the horrible meaning of the phrase 'joy division'? Do people just not like that band anymore?

by _hark 6y ago

What's the horrible meaning of the phrase 'joy division'? Do people just not like that band anymore?

nl 6y ago

Unfortunately, when the name “joyplot” took off, nobody in the datascience community was aware of the origin of the name “Joy Division”. As described in the book House of Dolls, joy divisions were groups of Jewish women in Nazi concentration camps kept for the sexual pleasure of soldiers. The band Joy Division took their name directly from this book and even quoted from the book in one of their early songs. https://serialmentor.com/blog/2017/9/15/goodbye-joyplots https://serialmentor.com/blog/2017/9/15/goodbye-joyplots I wasn't aware of this either. Given the theme of Joy Division (the band)'s songs I think it's very fair to say they meant it ironically, but I do think it's fair not to name a beautiful plot type after something so horrible.

kranner 6y ago
> fair not to name a beautiful plot type after something so horrible. Wasn't it an association that surfaced subsequent to being named after the band? In that sense it would not be "named after" Nazi joy divisions, I think? (as that would imply being aware of the association while choosing the name)
- mejutoco 6y ago
  In the film 24 hour party people it seems like the band (joy division) is aware of the meaning of the name and uses it for shock value/polemic/postmodernism attitude. IIRC some people shout at them while going on/off-stage regarding this.
  - 082349872349872 6y ago
    The band "Oy Division" is also no doubt aware of the meaning of their name. (they turned up via surfing from "Zog nit keyn mol") Recommended only if dialectical polyglot klezmer cabaret is your cup of tea.
- nl 6y ago
  > In that sense it would not be "named after" Nazi joy divisions, I think? (as that would imply being aware of the association while choosing the name) Sure, I don't think anyone involved with naming the package was aware of it. But I think they made the correct choice to rename once they became aware of it. Perhaps "have the name of a beautiful plot type associated with something so horrible" may have been better phrasing.
_hark 6y ago
Wow I had no idea. Thanks for the info and link. The seismic community has been producing plots like these for decades, but they're just referred to as "wiggle plots", not a great name. Ridgeline seems like the best option going forward!