4 ms·

Regarding HCQ, it’s only useful in combination with zinc, and only useful before hospitalization. The studies often cited seem to studiously ignore this. Given

Regarding HCQ, it’s only useful in combination with zinc, and only useful before hospitalization. The studies often cited seem to studiously ignore this. Given those caveats, there have been many successes.

matwood 6y ago
Successful valid studies? This summarizes the issues with all the earlier studies, even ones with zinc [1]. The problem with all the success anecdotes is correlation does not mean causation. The odds are low that I'm going to walk outside and die. If I walk outside while picking my nose and don't die, it doesn't mean picking my nose is stopping my death. The large majority of people recover from COVID doing nothing at all. Finding efficacy of any drug requires controlled studies. [1] https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/miracle-cure-testimonials-aside-azithromycin-and-hydroxychloroquine-probably-do-not-work-against-covid-19/ https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/miracle-cure-testimonials-a...
- wrycoder 6y ago
  Well, looking at that article, it appears the author is out to debunk HCQ. The language is hyperbolic - when I see something like that, I don't give it much credence. For an alternate take from the blogosphere, https://scienceblog.com/516960/suppression-of-chloroquine-is-scandalous/ https://scienceblog.com/516960/suppression-of-chloroquine-is... I've been following HCQ/Zinc long before it got politicized. It's well known that covid is a disaster in nursing homes, often resulting in 30% deaths. Here's some anecdotal evidence of early treatment with HCQ in that setting: https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/texas-elderly-hydroxychloroquine-coronavirus-treatment-texas-city/287-7383185c-940c-4cb2-82ea-c4a5ffad3ffb https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/texas-e... Here's a journal article claiming positive results. It's had over 300 citations, so there's probably some interesting reading there: https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/bst/14/1/14_2020.01047/_article https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/bst/14/1/14_2020.01047/... Causation generally requires some theory to support it: https://www.jewishpress.com/news/us-news/ny/scientists-study-coronavirus-attack-on-hemoglobin-test-new-treatments-with-old-standbys/2020/04/10/ https://www.jewishpress.com/news/us-news/ny/scientists-study... I'm 78, so I'm paying attention. Here's the best guidance I've seen so far. (They have backed off on HCQ because of all the political flap.) https://www.evms.edu/covid-19/covid_care_for_clinicians/#covidcare https://www.evms.edu/covid-19/covid_care_for_clinicians/#cov...

matwood 6y ago

Successful valid studies? This summarizes the issues with all the earlier studies, even ones with zinc [1]. The problem with all the success anecdotes is correlation does not mean causation. The odds are low that I'm going to walk outside and die. If I walk outside while picking my nose and don't die, it doesn't mean picking my nose is stopping my death. The large majority of people recover from COVID doing nothing at all. Finding efficacy of any drug requires controlled studies. [1] https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/miracle-cure-testimonials-aside-azithromycin-and-hydroxychloroquine-probably-do-not-work-against-covid-19/ https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/miracle-cure-testimonials-a...

wrycoder 6y ago
Well, looking at that article, it appears the author is out to debunk HCQ. The language is hyperbolic - when I see something like that, I don't give it much credence. For an alternate take from the blogosphere, https://scienceblog.com/516960/suppression-of-chloroquine-is-scandalous/ https://scienceblog.com/516960/suppression-of-chloroquine-is... I've been following HCQ/Zinc long before it got politicized. It's well known that covid is a disaster in nursing homes, often resulting in 30% deaths. Here's some anecdotal evidence of early treatment with HCQ in that setting: https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/texas-elderly-hydroxychloroquine-coronavirus-treatment-texas-city/287-7383185c-940c-4cb2-82ea-c4a5ffad3ffb https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/texas-e... Here's a journal article claiming positive results. It's had over 300 citations, so there's probably some interesting reading there: https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/bst/14/1/14_2020.01047/_article https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/bst/14/1/14_2020.01047/... Causation generally requires some theory to support it: https://www.jewishpress.com/news/us-news/ny/scientists-study-coronavirus-attack-on-hemoglobin-test-new-treatments-with-old-standbys/2020/04/10/ https://www.jewishpress.com/news/us-news/ny/scientists-study... I'm 78, so I'm paying attention. Here's the best guidance I've seen so far. (They have backed off on HCQ because of all the political flap.) https://www.evms.edu/covid-19/covid_care_for_clinicians/#covidcare https://www.evms.edu/covid-19/covid_care_for_clinicians/#cov...