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I wonder how much of this will translate to real world driving. Teslas have generally significantly underperformed in real world range compared to EPA. This rea
by kenhwang 6y ago
I wonder how much of this will translate to real world driving. Teslas have generally significantly underperformed in real world range compared to EPA. This reads very much like they're optimizing more towards a benchmark.
- person_of_color 6y agoThe real world version of overfitting!
- Spooky23 6y agoWell, duh. It’s a consistent test that you can benchmark. The same thing happens with ICE cars. I drove a Cadillac that would get like 27-28 mpg highway but 10 in the city, as they used gearing and cylinder management to optimize highway mpg.
- kjksf 6y agoIf it's possible, every car maker can "optimize towards benchmark". So is your theory that all car makers except Tesla are dumb and cannot optimize their range for EPA tests? That they are morally superior to Tesla and will sacrifice sales by not optimizing for EPA range but some purported "real world range"? And in what way exactly do you optimize for EPA test? I've seen this "explanation" for superior Tesla results many times but somehow no-one actually explains how do you make a battery or electric motor or drag coefficient of the car that is optimized for EPA test but doesn't generalize to regular driving.
- monadic2 6y agoI mean they could be honest and still outperform the rest of the market. If what you say is true, the EPA metric is meaningless and they should report observed efficiency for a certain traffic pattern. Why lie about it?
- justapassenger 6y ago> If it's possible, every car maker can "optimize towards benchmark". Like VW optimizing cars towards benchmark. Doesn't always ends great.
- 10-1-100 6y agoNot sure faking results counts as optimizing cars /shrug
- justapassenger 6y agoThey were not faked. Cars were optimized to behave in a certain way under exact test scenario. They were not producing any fake output data from the sensors, just "optimizing" engine behavior.
- 10-1-100 6y agoAh interesting - I stand corrected. Thanks for explaining!
- Zanni 6y agoThey didn't output fake data, true, but their "optimization" was to only activate emissions controls during testing. That's fraud. https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/10/08/446861855/volkswagen-u-s-ceo-faces-questions-on-capitol-hill https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/10/08/446861855...
- Brakenshire 6y agoOther manufacturers don’t optimise for the US market, so they’re not going to optimise for the test which is used only in the US.
- m463 6y agoIn my experience: - teslas have a big battery, range anxiety is not a problem - it is possible and even easy to drive inefficiently Other electric cars have small batteries, and small motors which combine to reward frugal driving.
- speedgoose 6y agoTesla has big batteries but many other cars have large batteries too. Like the Jaguar ipace, the Audi étron, the Mercedes EQC, or the hyundai kona... About the size of the motors, the Tesla one are actually not that big. Which is a good thing.
- m463 6y agoModel S is 550-830 hp, model 3 is 280-460 hp. Or are you talking dimensions?
- speedgoose 6y agoI'm talking about the size and not the max power output indeed.
- gameswithgo 6y agoProbably fine if you can manage to slow down and not hoon.