5 ms·

This article says white people are underrepresented in earning science and engineering bachelor degrees. Lol.

spicyramen 6y ago
True. I didn't get that
deogeo 6y ago
Not just STEM - in Harvard too: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21130080 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21130080
FriendlyNormie 6y ago
“Lol”? That’s your counterargument?
pessimizer 6y ago
When I did my computer engineering undergrad, there were just a handful of US-born white people (or black people) in any of my classes. They were mostly filled with the children of working-class immigrants and foreign students. edit: we joked that the progression of generations went: immigrant maid/janitor -> engineer/nurse/lab tech -> doctor/lawyer -> artist/unemployed philosopher
rootusrootus 6y ago
The stats on black/white/Asian college achievement makes for an uncomfortable discussion. It's okay to suggest that systemic racism is why black people don't participate in college as much as you'd expect based on their prevalence in society, but it's also okay to say that the reason Asians are over-represented is because culturally they've made it a huge priority to attain as much education as possible. Maybe we should focus less on trying to identify and somehow solve systemic racism and more about making it culturally acceptable and desirable for black people to enter the STEM fields. Highlight the superstars in STEM who are kicking ass (e.g. Neil deGrasse Tyson) and encouraging people to identify with him and motivate them to work even harder.
- deogeo 6y ago
  Would it also be okay to suggest Asians are over-represented because of unearned Asian privilege? What about suggesting whites are (hypothetically) over-represented because they've made attaining education a priority? Forgive me for noticing, but "one-sided" doesn't even begin to describe this debate.
  - rootusrootus 6y ago
    > Would it also be okay to suggest Asians are over-represented because of unearned Asian privilege? Reverse racism, as it were? > What about suggesting whites are (hypothetically) over-represented because they've made attaining education a priority? Well, first they'd need to be over-represented ;). > Forgive me for noticing, but "one-sided" doesn't even begin to describe this debate. On the contrary, there seems to be a bazillion sides to this whole discussion.
    - deogeo 6y ago
      > Well, first they'd need to be over-represented ;) Not at all - behold, an entire article complaining about too many whites on Harvard [1], despite being the most under-represented group [2]. [1] https://slate.com/business/2019/09/harvard-admissions-affirmative-action-white-students-legacy-athletes-donors.html https://slate.com/business/2019/09/harvard-admissions-affirm... [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21130080 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21130080
  - Ghjklov 6y ago
    >Would it also be okay to suggest Asians are over-represented because of unearned Asian privilege? That would be an incredibly stupid and unequivocally false thing to suggest because the odds are actually stacked against Asians, and they must work harder than most other people to achieve the same thing. Asians have earned everything they've attained in this country. They deserve whatever success they've gotten, and for that, they receive undeserved discrimination and disrespect.
    - 6y ago

True. I didn't get that

Not just STEM - in Harvard too: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21130080 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21130080

FriendlyNormie 6y ago

“Lol”? That’s your counterargument?

pessimizer 6y ago

When I did my computer engineering undergrad, there were just a handful of US-born white people (or black people) in any of my classes. They were mostly filled with the children of working-class immigrants and foreign students. edit: we joked that the progression of generations went: immigrant maid/janitor -> engineer/nurse/lab tech -> doctor/lawyer -> artist/unemployed philosopher

rootusrootus 6y ago

The stats on black/white/Asian college achievement makes for an uncomfortable discussion. It's okay to suggest that systemic racism is why black people don't participate in college as much as you'd expect based on their prevalence in society, but it's also okay to say that the reason Asians are over-represented is because culturally they've made it a huge priority to attain as much education as possible. Maybe we should focus less on trying to identify and somehow solve systemic racism and more about making it culturally acceptable and desirable for black people to enter the STEM fields. Highlight the superstars in STEM who are kicking ass (e.g. Neil deGrasse Tyson) and encouraging people to identify with him and motivate them to work even harder.

deogeo 6y ago
Would it also be okay to suggest Asians are over-represented because of unearned Asian privilege? What about suggesting whites are (hypothetically) over-represented because they've made attaining education a priority? Forgive me for noticing, but "one-sided" doesn't even begin to describe this debate.
- rootusrootus 6y ago
  > Would it also be okay to suggest Asians are over-represented because of unearned Asian privilege? Reverse racism, as it were? > What about suggesting whites are (hypothetically) over-represented because they've made attaining education a priority? Well, first they'd need to be over-represented ;). > Forgive me for noticing, but "one-sided" doesn't even begin to describe this debate. On the contrary, there seems to be a bazillion sides to this whole discussion.
  - deogeo 6y ago
    > Well, first they'd need to be over-represented ;) Not at all - behold, an entire article complaining about too many whites on Harvard [1], despite being the most under-represented group [2]. [1] https://slate.com/business/2019/09/harvard-admissions-affirmative-action-white-students-legacy-athletes-donors.html https://slate.com/business/2019/09/harvard-admissions-affirm... [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21130080 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21130080
- Ghjklov 6y ago
  >Would it also be okay to suggest Asians are over-represented because of unearned Asian privilege? That would be an incredibly stupid and unequivocally false thing to suggest because the odds are actually stacked against Asians, and they must work harder than most other people to achieve the same thing. Asians have earned everything they've attained in this country. They deserve whatever success they've gotten, and for that, they receive undeserved discrimination and disrespect.
  - 6y ago