6 ms·

Whatsapp brings the same features, if not more. iMessage craze is a purely American phenomenon, the rest of the world has moved on to other IMs

klodolph 6y ago
Every part of the world has its own messaging apps. Depending on where you live, it might be WhatsApp, Facebook Messenger, WeChat, LINE, or I’m sure others. In Europe I know for a fact that the popular app varies from country to country. So you could just as easily dismiss LINE as a “purely Japanese phenomenon” but the fact is each app is popular in a certain part of the world. Because network effects are more important than UX or features.
- harpratap 6y ago
  Sure it does, but cross platform IMs are not so socially discriminating. You can easily download LINE and move on with your life in Japan. But getting iMessage is an economic barrier for many, for which they end up being socially ostraostracized
  - paulcarroty 6y ago
    > But getting iMessage is an economic barrier for many economic barrier to buy ~$100 used iphone on ebay?
    - ripdog 6y ago
      Are you really going to buy, charge, supply with data and carry around a second phone, no matter how cheap, just so you can send blue messages? That attitude is, like many american ideas, really whack.
      - paulcarroty 6y ago
        If technology X/Y/Z brings me something useful, I prefer to spend some money to get in. Social environment matters too. You can live without iOS/Android, even with Android/macOS VM (heh, I've tried it once) - this is your choice.
AnonC 6y ago
No, WhatsApp does not bring the same features. WhatsApp is very different. You can react to messages in iMessage, which is just one among other features WhatsApp doesn’t have.
- harpratap 6y ago
  Yeah I mean there will little tiny things different on each app, but it's not a big deal breaker for many. Whatsapp is the biggest IM on the planet for a reason. People could easily ditch iMessage in favour of Whatsapp if they wanted to, but for some reason Americans don't do that.
  - the_snooze 6y ago
    The idea of moving to a different chat platform won’t even come up if your current system has the features you need and everyone you want to reach is on it. What would nudge a group to collectively move to WhatsApp if iMessage is the default and works well for them?
    - matheusmoreira 6y ago
      > What would nudge a group to collectively move to WhatsApp if iMessage is the default and works well for them? The fact their choice leads to needless exclusion of people who would otherwise be their friends.
  - briandear 6y ago
    I don’t use What’s App for the simple reason I like how my contacts are integrated across my Apple devices. From email, to “normal” phone calls, to Siri, calendar invites, and even directions “hey Siri, directions to Tom’s work” — it all works seamlessly. If I want to send someone a location from Maps, it’s seamless. If I am using something like Find My, I can easily send a message from there — or even create a Shortcut to send a geofenced message. And Memojis are just simply fun. When I am on the road, sending my kids a message with a talking robot really makes their day. I also have big trust problems with Facebook products. Apple makes iMessage to sell devices, what does Facebook do with What’s App? There have been reports in the past that installed Facebook, Inc., apps were sending analytics from devices on other apps people were using, pretty much like a Trojan horse. I don’t want any installed Facebook related apps on my devices because Facebook lost my trust long ago. While supposedly What’s App is “secure,” the entire history of Facebook has been littered with “oops, you caught us and we are really really sorry this time.”
judge2020 6y ago
I think the best reason is explained in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23412067 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23412067 - ie. how most social circles will exclude Android users. I imagine this is only be the case when only one or two people of the group are using Android though, so if even a few people in the friend group are in that situation you might see more WhatsApp/FB Messenger.
hnick 6y ago
My mid-30s colleague went back to Tinder in recent years and he mentioned he got questioned by his target market about not having a blue bubble. They were all Asian (but mostly Chinese) women in their late 20s who moved to Australia.
- copperx 6y ago
  With reference to a recent HN thread, I wonder if saying "I'm a developer/security expert/working on a classified government project and HAVE to use a special phone" would garner sympathy or admiration and stop the questions.
  - 0xffff2 6y ago
    This is funny because as someone who works on important but non-classified stuff for the government, I do carry around a government issued phone so that I can access my work email/IM anywhere. But, (a) it's another iPhone and (b) I'd get in an awful lot of trouble if I installed Tinder on it. Most people probably wouldn't realize that though.
msh 6y ago
Well the most annoying thing about whatsapp (other than its owned by Facebook) is that it can't automatically fallback to sms for contacts not using it. But not all of the world have moved to whatsapp. I am from Scandinavian and I only have a very limited number of contacts available on whatsapp, most are on iMessage.
- saagarjha 6y ago
  On iOS, that's not by any fault of WhatsApp.
  - msh 6y ago
    Well given that it also does not do it on android I dont see that mattering.
    - saagarjha 6y ago
      Not really an Android or WhatsApp user, so my perspective there is probably not all that relevant ;) I am curious if any apps there fall back to SMS? I think Hangouts might have a long time back?
      - msh 6y ago
        I think hangouts did and Facebook messenger for Android once did
      - eythian 6y ago
        Signal does.
erikbye 6y ago
> Message craze is a purely American phenomenon This is mistaken. I'm in the EU and do not know a single person using SMS, nor Whatsapp, they use iMessage, however, bigtime. Whatsapp used to be a thing, but that has been over for some time. Now, most are using Messenger, Snap, and Telegram. And iMessage is not a craze or a phenomenon, it is a simple convenience; it's on your phone already. For most people using it, it is not even a deliberate choice. The younger generation grew up with it, they do not even really know the difference between SMS and iMessage, except that if the bubble is green, the other user does not have an iPhone. The older generation remembers SMS, so they still tend to call it SMS, even though they are using iMessage. Android users are in the minority around here, well, at least between family, friends, and at work.
- williamdclt 6y ago
  Well, I'm in the EU (France/UK) and do not know a single person that doesn't use Whatsapp. I'm also not even completely sure what iMessage is, nobody ever mentioned it. All I mean is: anecdotal evidence and social bubbles
  - erikbye 6y ago
    > All I mean is: anecdotal evidence and social bubbles Sure. However, there is usage data available if one's interested. https://www.digitalinformationworld.com/2019/02/whatsapp-facts-stats.html https://www.digitalinformationworld.com/2019/02/whatsapp-fac...

klodolph 6y ago

Every part of the world has its own messaging apps. Depending on where you live, it might be WhatsApp, Facebook Messenger, WeChat, LINE, or I’m sure others. In Europe I know for a fact that the popular app varies from country to country. So you could just as easily dismiss LINE as a “purely Japanese phenomenon” but the fact is each app is popular in a certain part of the world. Because network effects are more important than UX or features.

harpratap 6y ago
Sure it does, but cross platform IMs are not so socially discriminating. You can easily download LINE and move on with your life in Japan. But getting iMessage is an economic barrier for many, for which they end up being socially ostraostracized
- paulcarroty 6y ago
  > But getting iMessage is an economic barrier for many economic barrier to buy ~$100 used iphone on ebay?
  - ripdog 6y ago
    Are you really going to buy, charge, supply with data and carry around a second phone, no matter how cheap, just so you can send blue messages? That attitude is, like many american ideas, really whack.
    - paulcarroty 6y ago
      If technology X/Y/Z brings me something useful, I prefer to spend some money to get in. Social environment matters too. You can live without iOS/Android, even with Android/macOS VM (heh, I've tried it once) - this is your choice.

AnonC 6y ago

No, WhatsApp does not bring the same features. WhatsApp is very different. You can react to messages in iMessage, which is just one among other features WhatsApp doesn’t have.

harpratap 6y ago
Yeah I mean there will little tiny things different on each app, but it's not a big deal breaker for many. Whatsapp is the biggest IM on the planet for a reason. People could easily ditch iMessage in favour of Whatsapp if they wanted to, but for some reason Americans don't do that.
- the_snooze 6y ago
  The idea of moving to a different chat platform won’t even come up if your current system has the features you need and everyone you want to reach is on it. What would nudge a group to collectively move to WhatsApp if iMessage is the default and works well for them?
  - matheusmoreira 6y ago
    > What would nudge a group to collectively move to WhatsApp if iMessage is the default and works well for them? The fact their choice leads to needless exclusion of people who would otherwise be their friends.
- briandear 6y ago
  I don’t use What’s App for the simple reason I like how my contacts are integrated across my Apple devices. From email, to “normal” phone calls, to Siri, calendar invites, and even directions “hey Siri, directions to Tom’s work” — it all works seamlessly. If I want to send someone a location from Maps, it’s seamless. If I am using something like Find My, I can easily send a message from there — or even create a Shortcut to send a geofenced message. And Memojis are just simply fun. When I am on the road, sending my kids a message with a talking robot really makes their day. I also have big trust problems with Facebook products. Apple makes iMessage to sell devices, what does Facebook do with What’s App? There have been reports in the past that installed Facebook, Inc., apps were sending analytics from devices on other apps people were using, pretty much like a Trojan horse. I don’t want any installed Facebook related apps on my devices because Facebook lost my trust long ago. While supposedly What’s App is “secure,” the entire history of Facebook has been littered with “oops, you caught us and we are really really sorry this time.”

judge2020 6y ago

I think the best reason is explained in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23412067 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23412067 - ie. how most social circles will exclude Android users. I imagine this is only be the case when only one or two people of the group are using Android though, so if even a few people in the friend group are in that situation you might see more WhatsApp/FB Messenger.

hnick 6y ago

My mid-30s colleague went back to Tinder in recent years and he mentioned he got questioned by his target market about not having a blue bubble. They were all Asian (but mostly Chinese) women in their late 20s who moved to Australia.

copperx 6y ago
With reference to a recent HN thread, I wonder if saying "I'm a developer/security expert/working on a classified government project and HAVE to use a special phone" would garner sympathy or admiration and stop the questions.
- 0xffff2 6y ago
  This is funny because as someone who works on important but non-classified stuff for the government, I do carry around a government issued phone so that I can access my work email/IM anywhere. But, (a) it's another iPhone and (b) I'd get in an awful lot of trouble if I installed Tinder on it. Most people probably wouldn't realize that though.

msh 6y ago

Well the most annoying thing about whatsapp (other than its owned by Facebook) is that it can't automatically fallback to sms for contacts not using it. But not all of the world have moved to whatsapp. I am from Scandinavian and I only have a very limited number of contacts available on whatsapp, most are on iMessage.

saagarjha 6y ago
On iOS, that's not by any fault of WhatsApp.
- msh 6y ago
  Well given that it also does not do it on android I dont see that mattering.
  - saagarjha 6y ago
    Not really an Android or WhatsApp user, so my perspective there is probably not all that relevant ;) I am curious if any apps there fall back to SMS? I think Hangouts might have a long time back?
    - msh 6y ago
      I think hangouts did and Facebook messenger for Android once did
    - eythian 6y ago
      Signal does.

erikbye 6y ago

> Message craze is a purely American phenomenon This is mistaken. I'm in the EU and do not know a single person using SMS, nor Whatsapp, they use iMessage, however, bigtime. Whatsapp used to be a thing, but that has been over for some time. Now, most are using Messenger, Snap, and Telegram. And iMessage is not a craze or a phenomenon, it is a simple convenience; it's on your phone already. For most people using it, it is not even a deliberate choice. The younger generation grew up with it, they do not even really know the difference between SMS and iMessage, except that if the bubble is green, the other user does not have an iPhone. The older generation remembers SMS, so they still tend to call it SMS, even though they are using iMessage. Android users are in the minority around here, well, at least between family, friends, and at work.

williamdclt 6y ago
Well, I'm in the EU (France/UK) and do not know a single person that doesn't use Whatsapp. I'm also not even completely sure what iMessage is, nobody ever mentioned it. All I mean is: anecdotal evidence and social bubbles
- erikbye 6y ago
  > All I mean is: anecdotal evidence and social bubbles Sure. However, there is usage data available if one's interested. https://www.digitalinformationworld.com/2019/02/whatsapp-facts-stats.html https://www.digitalinformationworld.com/2019/02/whatsapp-fac...