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You don't even need to leave your porch to get shot. Police and National Guard are patrolling neighborhoods and shooting civilians with paint canisters on their

You don't even need to leave your porch to get shot. Police and National Guard are patrolling neighborhoods and shooting civilians with paint canisters on their own property in Minneapolis. In one case they yelled "Light 'em up!" before starting to shoot [1] with ammunition that could blind people. It's legal to be outside your house during the curfew in Minneapolis [2]. > Can I be outside my house (on my property) after 8 p.m. and before 6 a.m.? > Yes. [1] https://twitter.com/tkerssen/status/1266921821653385225 https://twitter.com/tkerssen/status/1266921821653385225 [2] https://dps.mn.gov/macc/Pages/faq.aspx https://dps.mn.gov/macc/Pages/faq.aspx

jagged-chisel 6y ago
> shooting civilians with paint canisters on their own property Even if it weren't legal to be outside on your own property from 8p-6a, this isn't proper enforcement of the law.
- phalangion 6y ago
  That's because the National Guard isn't law enforcement.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - pmorici 6y ago
    That video wasn't of the national guard it was clearly police of some kind based on the uniforms. Also typically the national guard units they activate for stuff like this are often the MP units so they would be trained on law enforcement specific things. Either way it doesn't excuse or justify that blatant misconduct in the video.
    - griffinkelly 6y ago
      I'm a member of the national guard and I, along with many of my friends, did not sign up to be police officers. That said, in Minnesota they called up every unit it seems. I'd understand civilians to easily confuse police with the military particularly after seeing a Humvee drive by, but if you take a closer look its easy to distinguish. Also note, we take orders directly from the governor of the state, not the police, nor the president of the US unless activated.
      - griffinkelly 6y ago
        The other thing to think about is, if they activated the entire MN guard, many of these folks are not military police or have received any kind of light MP training. Typically the guard is there to just provide assistance. If they end up doing heavy-duty police work or real riot control, this is how we end up with a kent state type situation--most guardsmen have civilian jobs, so imagine one day your working your IT job, the next day your expected to be a police officer.
  - collyw 6y ago
    What is the National Guard? Voluntary policing of some sort?
    - griffinkelly 6y ago
      The National Guard is effectively the militia of each state. They report to each governor first, and if activated, report to the US military. A traditional guardsman has a civilian job, 9-5 M-F, then one weekend a month 'drills' as a part of the unit. You can get activated, at which point your civilian job has to let you go serve. Most common activations are for statewide disasters--tornados, floods, hurricanes--but most recently medical units were deployed for covid relief. National callups would be to help the us military in Iraq etc., but at all times the guard serves the state first.
- dkdk8283 6y ago
  > Even if it weren't legal to be outside on your own property from 8p-6a It should always be legal to be outside on your own property. Anything less is unacceptable.
cariaso 6y ago
worth noting that MN National Guard seems to have replied to this specific video and say that it' is not them. https://twitter.com/MNNationalGuard/status/1267005185492226048 https://twitter.com/MNNationalGuard/status/12670051854922260... This doesn't quite disagree with your statement, but I'd like to ensure the correct officers are identified and disciplined.
- mschuster91 6y ago
  > This doesn't quite disagree with your statement, but I'd like to ensure the correct officers are identified and disciplined. As if anything would happen to these disgraces on legs. That's the entire point why people are protesting.
crispyambulance 6y ago
It's a chaotic situation. They (the police/nat-guard) likely wanted people inside their homes to prevent further chaos and confrontations. It all becomes more volatile if everyone's on their porch, outraged, as the police "parade" comes through. I know folks on HN like strict interpretations and reasoning of what's legal or illegal, but all of that gets very blurred during a riot when the situation at any given time is on the verge of getting out of control. It just isn't time for a high-school forensics debate when people are in riot gear. If a group of highly armed police or military are marching through your street and demanding you go inside--- it's probably better to GO INSIDE at least until they're gone.
- xphilter 6y ago
  But again, that’s not the law (the executive order here). They can’t go enforce things not the law. It’s not like there are armed folks running around that street making exigent circumstances. Why do you feel the need to defend something obviously indefensible? Edit: just to be clear, given all the huff and puff by police of needing riot gear, armored trucks, giant guns, I haven’t seen any report in Minneapolis of any armed protestors or any cops coming under fire. But that doesn’t stop the cops from shooting (less than lethal) rounds.
  - microcolonel 6y ago
    Dude, last night a federal officer was executed from a van. It wasn't in Minneapolis, but there's no reason to believe it couldn't be there. They gave an order: go inside while we're passing. It is a reasonable order for the few seconds or minutes it takes for the crowd to pass the neighbourhood. Remarkably, reasonable police orders apply to you, even if you are middle class and young.
    - xphilter 6y ago
      Where? Do you have a link? Let’s assume that’s true, that a crime was committed across the country. Does that give this group of law enforcement to shoot ltl rounds at unarmed people on private property and in compliance with the law? I don’t understand your reasoning.
Minor49er 6y ago
There's a clear curfew order to stay inside. The police come by and see five young adults sitting on a porch. The police order them inside. The group responds by sitting there and continuing to film. So the police fire a single non-lethal shot to get them to go inside. I dont have any sympathy for this group or their pair of greened jeans that they lost in this altercation.
- bearcobra 6y ago
  > There's a clear curfew order to stay inside The curfew order clearly says that people do NOT need to stay inside. https://dps.mn.gov/macc/Pages/faq.aspx https://dps.mn.gov/macc/Pages/faq.aspx
  - justinclift 6y ago
    Specifically: Can I be outside my house (on my property) after 8 p.m. and before 6 a.m.? Yes.
    - Minor49er 6y ago
      Did all of the five young adults on the porch live there? You don't know. And neither did the cops. The cops took the safest route and ordered them inside. The group responded by not complying.
      - mvid 6y ago
        Noncompliance of a minor or fabricated rule results in extreme physical violence by police. Where have I heard that before?
- ramadan_steve 6y ago
  Go fuck your self
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
germinalphrase 6y ago
I’m a local. Here’s some additional context: “Follow up on video of people getting rubber bullets shot at them in their doorway from a source that was there. This was personally texted to me. Source is a teacher that works at my elementary school. Here’s what was posted. ‘That is my blue house across the street. Apparently this video has gone viral. What they didn’t show was the 20- 30 minutes of the rioters that surrounded the houses, were all over our neighborhood, the street, rioters running through my yard and screaming on the other side of my garden level bedroom window, and hiding in my alley. The neighbors are saying they were ‘just having a beer outside,’ as if this came out of nowhere and while it seems extreme from the national guard/police, the rioters were flooded in our neighborhood and they were trying to get them out. That was terrifying, and to be honest after being at the Minneapolis community clean up today and seeing all the burned down buildings, I am glad nothing was burned down or broken into. And they got them out. Idk who is out there at night! And yes black lives matter!!!! But these riots are scary AF. And they haven’t returned and are gone now and we are totally safe, and all had been quiet for hours. And apparently my upstairs neighbor had no idea the rioters were here at all ... #minneapolisriots #blacklivesmatter #georgefloyd #helpusall #feltprotected” Edit: apparently, additional information is... controversial? I don’t agree with the police conduct, but there is additional context here.
- mbrameld 6y ago
  Nobody managed to get a video of the rioters? Doesn't that seem odd to you? Additional context is welcome as long as it's either verifiable or doesn't serve an obvious agenda. Here's some additional context that's just as valid as yours: the "rioters" were actually defending the neighborhood from the police who had been there before your context began. The police were beating random people and shooting pets. The person that told me this lives in one of the houses in the video and she's a retired nurse who volunteers to care for hospice patients.
  - briefcomment 6y ago
    Both your claim and the parent's claim are equally shocking, and the evidence for both is hearsay from someone who lives on the street. How do we know who is being sincere, who is pushing an agenda, who is mistaken, who is experiencing cognitive dissonance, etc.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

jagged-chisel 6y ago

> shooting civilians with paint canisters on their own property Even if it weren't legal to be outside on your own property from 8p-6a, this isn't proper enforcement of the law.

phalangion 6y ago
That's because the National Guard isn't law enforcement.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- pmorici 6y ago
  That video wasn't of the national guard it was clearly police of some kind based on the uniforms. Also typically the national guard units they activate for stuff like this are often the MP units so they would be trained on law enforcement specific things. Either way it doesn't excuse or justify that blatant misconduct in the video.
  - griffinkelly 6y ago
    I'm a member of the national guard and I, along with many of my friends, did not sign up to be police officers. That said, in Minnesota they called up every unit it seems. I'd understand civilians to easily confuse police with the military particularly after seeing a Humvee drive by, but if you take a closer look its easy to distinguish. Also note, we take orders directly from the governor of the state, not the police, nor the president of the US unless activated.
    - griffinkelly 6y ago
      The other thing to think about is, if they activated the entire MN guard, many of these folks are not military police or have received any kind of light MP training. Typically the guard is there to just provide assistance. If they end up doing heavy-duty police work or real riot control, this is how we end up with a kent state type situation--most guardsmen have civilian jobs, so imagine one day your working your IT job, the next day your expected to be a police officer.
- collyw 6y ago
  What is the National Guard? Voluntary policing of some sort?
  - griffinkelly 6y ago
    The National Guard is effectively the militia of each state. They report to each governor first, and if activated, report to the US military. A traditional guardsman has a civilian job, 9-5 M-F, then one weekend a month 'drills' as a part of the unit. You can get activated, at which point your civilian job has to let you go serve. Most common activations are for statewide disasters--tornados, floods, hurricanes--but most recently medical units were deployed for covid relief. National callups would be to help the us military in Iraq etc., but at all times the guard serves the state first.
dkdk8283 6y ago
> Even if it weren't legal to be outside on your own property from 8p-6a It should always be legal to be outside on your own property. Anything less is unacceptable.

cariaso 6y ago

worth noting that MN National Guard seems to have replied to this specific video and say that it' is not them. https://twitter.com/MNNationalGuard/status/1267005185492226048 https://twitter.com/MNNationalGuard/status/12670051854922260... This doesn't quite disagree with your statement, but I'd like to ensure the correct officers are identified and disciplined.

mschuster91 6y ago
> This doesn't quite disagree with your statement, but I'd like to ensure the correct officers are identified and disciplined. As if anything would happen to these disgraces on legs. That's the entire point why people are protesting.

crispyambulance 6y ago

It's a chaotic situation. They (the police/nat-guard) likely wanted people inside their homes to prevent further chaos and confrontations. It all becomes more volatile if everyone's on their porch, outraged, as the police "parade" comes through. I know folks on HN like strict interpretations and reasoning of what's legal or illegal, but all of that gets very blurred during a riot when the situation at any given time is on the verge of getting out of control. It just isn't time for a high-school forensics debate when people are in riot gear. If a group of highly armed police or military are marching through your street and demanding you go inside--- it's probably better to GO INSIDE at least until they're gone.

xphilter 6y ago
But again, that’s not the law (the executive order here). They can’t go enforce things not the law. It’s not like there are armed folks running around that street making exigent circumstances. Why do you feel the need to defend something obviously indefensible? Edit: just to be clear, given all the huff and puff by police of needing riot gear, armored trucks, giant guns, I haven’t seen any report in Minneapolis of any armed protestors or any cops coming under fire. But that doesn’t stop the cops from shooting (less than lethal) rounds.
- microcolonel 6y ago
  Dude, last night a federal officer was executed from a van. It wasn't in Minneapolis, but there's no reason to believe it couldn't be there. They gave an order: go inside while we're passing. It is a reasonable order for the few seconds or minutes it takes for the crowd to pass the neighbourhood. Remarkably, reasonable police orders apply to you, even if you are middle class and young.
  - xphilter 6y ago
    Where? Do you have a link? Let’s assume that’s true, that a crime was committed across the country. Does that give this group of law enforcement to shoot ltl rounds at unarmed people on private property and in compliance with the law? I don’t understand your reasoning.

Minor49er 6y ago

There's a clear curfew order to stay inside. The police come by and see five young adults sitting on a porch. The police order them inside. The group responds by sitting there and continuing to film. So the police fire a single non-lethal shot to get them to go inside. I dont have any sympathy for this group or their pair of greened jeans that they lost in this altercation.

bearcobra 6y ago
> There's a clear curfew order to stay inside The curfew order clearly says that people do NOT need to stay inside. https://dps.mn.gov/macc/Pages/faq.aspx https://dps.mn.gov/macc/Pages/faq.aspx
- justinclift 6y ago
  Specifically: Can I be outside my house (on my property) after 8 p.m. and before 6 a.m.? Yes.
  - Minor49er 6y ago
    Did all of the five young adults on the porch live there? You don't know. And neither did the cops. The cops took the safest route and ordered them inside. The group responded by not complying.
    - mvid 6y ago
      Noncompliance of a minor or fabricated rule results in extreme physical violence by police. Where have I heard that before?
ramadan_steve 6y ago
Go fuck your self
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]

germinalphrase 6y ago

I’m a local. Here’s some additional context: “Follow up on video of people getting rubber bullets shot at them in their doorway from a source that was there. This was personally texted to me. Source is a teacher that works at my elementary school. Here’s what was posted. ‘That is my blue house across the street. Apparently this video has gone viral. What they didn’t show was the 20- 30 minutes of the rioters that surrounded the houses, were all over our neighborhood, the street, rioters running through my yard and screaming on the other side of my garden level bedroom window, and hiding in my alley. The neighbors are saying they were ‘just having a beer outside,’ as if this came out of nowhere and while it seems extreme from the national guard/police, the rioters were flooded in our neighborhood and they were trying to get them out. That was terrifying, and to be honest after being at the Minneapolis community clean up today and seeing all the burned down buildings, I am glad nothing was burned down or broken into. And they got them out. Idk who is out there at night! And yes black lives matter!!!! But these riots are scary AF. And they haven’t returned and are gone now and we are totally safe, and all had been quiet for hours. And apparently my upstairs neighbor had no idea the rioters were here at all ... #minneapolisriots #blacklivesmatter #georgefloyd #helpusall #feltprotected” Edit: apparently, additional information is... controversial? I don’t agree with the police conduct, but there is additional context here.

mbrameld 6y ago
Nobody managed to get a video of the rioters? Doesn't that seem odd to you? Additional context is welcome as long as it's either verifiable or doesn't serve an obvious agenda. Here's some additional context that's just as valid as yours: the "rioters" were actually defending the neighborhood from the police who had been there before your context began. The police were beating random people and shooting pets. The person that told me this lives in one of the houses in the video and she's a retired nurse who volunteers to care for hospice patients.
- briefcomment 6y ago
  Both your claim and the parent's claim are equally shocking, and the evidence for both is hearsay from someone who lives on the street. How do we know who is being sincere, who is pushing an agenda, who is mistaken, who is experiencing cognitive dissonance, etc.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]