6 ms·

There's lots of countries you maybe should vent your anger on before Britain, one of the most multicultural countries in the world. Maybe India with its racist

• lern_too_spel 6y ago
  Unlike BN(O)/BOC, India's caste system isn't supported by law.
  • chii 6y ago
    being supported by cultural norms is worse than being supported by law. Laws can be overturned by a stroke of the pen. Cultural norms still persist after the law is overturned. Case in point: black racism and prejudice in the USA.
    • lern_too_spel 6y ago
      Are you suggesting that the current situation for blacks is worse than when there were Jim Crow laws? When racist laws are in place, there are also cultural norms that exist with them.
      • PakG1 6y ago
        It's better, but problems obviously still exist.
        • lern_too_spel 6y ago
          I didn't disagree with that. The point is that when there are racist laws, the situation is strictly worse than when there are only racist cultural norms because the former does not exist without the latter.
    • techie128 6y ago
      Cultural norms typically dictate laws and not the other way round. Case in point: The US constitution granted Women right to vote on August 26, 1920 when the Nineteenth Amendment was adopted. And no, it did not happen with a "stroke of a pen". The movement began in 1771 and their rights finally enshrined in the US Constitution in 1920 (~150 years).
  • barking 6y ago
    True but it definitely doesn't do much to stamp it out. In Britain, if you want to see racism, try being a white boy dating a non-white girl. If she's black, black males in general won't like it and if she's Indian, her family will almost definitely not like it.
    • zo1 6y ago
      Interesting choice of words... White Boy, Non-White girl, black male? This is the same sort of non-sense that the Feminists were warning the world about decades ago: How stereotypes and other bad properties are built-in to the culture and language, and we should address them. We seem to have all too easily forgotten that and simply replaced them with new forms of sexism and racism.
      • barking 6y ago
        What words should I have used?
    • lern_too_spel 6y ago
      > In Britain, if you want to see racism, try being a white boy dating a non-white girl Try being a non-white boy dating a white girl. Do you think racism doesn't rear its head in that case? In any case, this is pretty blatant whataboutism. The article is about the UK, not about other countries, and racism in other countries does not make racism in the UK less bad.
      • barking 6y ago
        Sure it does but families from certain non native communities in the UK will go to extreme extents to break up such relationships.
        • lern_too_spel 6y ago
          Families from certain native communities in the UK will do that, too. They just call it "nativism" instead of "racism."
• hyko 6y ago
  That’s why it’s all the more galling; the UK is trying to build a brand around multiculturalism while issuing BS passports for those deemed not British enough. The UK establishment embraced multiculturalism when it was flat on its back economically; it has subsequently sold out many people who were loyal to it for shameful political expediency, e.g. the Ghurka and Windrush scandals: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gurkha_Justice_Campaign https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gurkha_Justice_Campaign https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windrush_scandal https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windrush_scandal It’s an obvious chance to parlay some good from the UK’s colonial legacy, why would anyone oppose it?
  • barking 6y ago
    What are your country's policies around the issuing of passports? As for immigrants building the country up, for what it's worth, Britain is probably lower in the world rankings in terms of wealth per capita than it was before large scale immigration from the former colonies began. Immigration gives you more people, that's all we can say for certain about its effects.
    • toyg 6y ago
      > Britain is probably lower in the world rankings in terms of wealth per capita than it was before large scale immigration Citation needed. I seriously doubt your balance of probabilities. Britain pre-Windrush was on its knees. Britain pre-EEC was "the sick man of Europe". Please bring up some actual numbers to back your reactionary talking points, at the very least.
      • barking 6y ago
        1960 Britain had the 4th largest economy in the world. 2015 it has the 5th largest economy in the world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_largest_historical_GDP https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_largest_h... The United Kingdom represented 6.42% of the world's economy in 1960 (highest point), falling to 3.42% in 2012 (lowest point). It accounted for 5.2% of the world's economy in 1820, 9.1% in 1870, and 8.3% in 1913. England, Scotland and Wales generated 1.8% of the world's GDP in 1600
• thre42314324 6y ago
  > Maybe India with its racist caste system. Bullshit. Europe's obsession with eugenics (not satisfied killing millions of Indians BTW), is the direct causation of the institutionalization of 'caste' in the colonial & post-colonial Indian Govt. The heady mix of politics, Christian missionary zeal behind the propaganda is quite insane, and is well documented by Nicholas Dirks' (U. Berkeley) work, and so also by S Balagangadhara (U. Ghent). The dim-witted laws passed in Britain, not satisfied with raping India for centuries, is a testament to the evil nature of that country, Dr. Prakash Shah has a great takedown of this moronic law, which is quite obviously based in Chrisitan zealotry, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BoIM7-E4qE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BoIM7-E4qE
  • barking 6y ago
    India's caste system is a consequence of the Hindu religion and its belief in reincarnation.
    • jacobush 6y ago
      And the British enforcement of it during the colony years.
    • eklavya 6y ago
      I am aN Indian and a Hindu. Could you elaborate how reincarnation and caste system are related?
      • barking 6y ago
        Is not reincarnation the only way to move from one caste to another?
        • quantummkv 6y ago
          Where did you read that? There is nothing as such mentioned in any ancient Indian text. Nor does anyone in India today believe in something like this.
• neilsense 6y ago
  You seem to have a vendetta against India so we'll set that aside for a second, sounds like you had a bad experience at some point with an Indian or their family. You are talking about the same Britain that voted in favour of Brexit because they got tired of looking at Eastern Europeans? The same that allowed Tommy Robinson to rise to fame through even the main media channels? The same one that you can be called a 'paki' in while just walking down the street with your family in 2020? The same one that still has glass ceilings in finance and industry if you're not white? Britain is a utopia compared to many countries, but don't get carried away. Also, don't half-understand things about other nations and then try and sell them over her as fact. You are out of your depth.
  • barking 6y ago
    I don't have a vendetta against India, that's way OTT sensitivity on your part. And if you're going to accuse me of having a simplistic view of India then I'll respond to you by saying your comments on Britain are risible. Tommy Robinson's rise to fame is somehow to be taken as a criticism of Britain. The man's notorious, and has served prison time for it. Does it reflect badly on a country that such a man exists? The rest of your criticisms are similarly simplistic.
  • vixen99 6y ago
    'because they got tired of looking at Eastern Europeans'. All sixteen million of them. Seeing the world in such crude categoric terms makes for a simple life I guess.
• jboog 6y ago
  Quite ironic you are using India's caste system as an example of how primitive and un-just the society and how great Britain is when Britain is the very reason the caste system exists as it does today. Prior to British rule, castes were not widely understood along the Indian subcontinent and was one of many social demographic markers for Indians until Britain made it THE defining characteristic. From the BBC: "In fact, it is doubtful that caste had much significance or virulence in society before the British made it India's defining social feature." https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-48619734 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-48619734
  • legolas2412 6y ago
    Also, caste discrimination is illegal. The government grants equal rights to all people.
• badrabbit 6y ago
  In human history, I don't think anyone comes close to Britain when it comes to spreading systems that implement race based divisions. They may not have been lynchy like the US or chopping off limbs like belgium but they are remarkably efficient at spreading systems that show them as superior and civilized because of their skin. Slavery in US colonies,caste system in india,apartheid rule in South Africa come to mind as good examples and as diverse as the UK maybe, there are still strong elements of it that hold onto the "we don't want to exterminate people but we are still superior because of our skin color" mentality. The French from what I know were not as efficient at implementing explicit systems like this. The spanish empire perhaps comes close in efficiency and similarity but not when you look at the scale and spread of the british empire. My suspicion is the rise of darwinism (who was a brit) intersected with the rise of colonialism. Colonizers may not have been too accepting of the whole "everyone comes from adam and eve" narrative when they met locals they deemed to be savages and inferior. Not that I am saying darwinism is the cause,just that their greed and arrogance thrived on any ideology that can be abused to help them with their goals.
  • blackrock 6y ago
    To add to this, the reason why the British and American system of slavery, was so evil and morally bankrupt, was because it institutionalized the racism. We know that throughout human history, there had always been slaves. Whether they were from war conquests, prisoners, or what not. And maybe, some of them eventually got their freedoms, after serving for a term. Basically, they came and went, and no one thought anything of it. But, what truly made the British and American system of slavery so evil, was that it became codified into laws. And written on papers, and enforced by the military, and police. And financed by the banks. This was truly, predatory capitalism, of the highest order. Thus, slavery became institutionalized. This elevated slavery, from something that unfortunately happened to random people like prisoners, to completely enslaving, subjugating, humiliating, and genociding, a specific race of people, purely based on the color of their skin. And all this, happened in a democracy.
    • badrabbit 6y ago
      Yup. Once it becomes formalized people accept it. The holocaust is a good example but China's treatment of Uighur's right now is another example, the average Chinese supports what the government is doing because "they're in a cult" or "why hold radical beliefs". It's official and authorities support it. There is evil and there is evil caused and enforced by an authority the people approve of,the society at large is responsible.