3 ms·

I'd still take a heavily configurable and customizable "mess", as you put it, than the one that doesn't allow me to control how it works. There's a good reason

I'd still take a heavily configurable and customizable "mess", as you put it, than the one that doesn't allow me to control how it works. There's a good reason why Linux absolutely dominates the server space.

ThrowawayR2 6y ago
> "There's a good reason why Linux absolutely dominates the server space." Yeah, it was cheaper (in both senses of the word) than all the other contenders and more or less Unixy enough that software could easily be ported over.
- tombert 6y ago
  Well, not to mention that you're allowed to add features to it without waiting for Microsoft to do it. Linux might not be the best codebase in the world, but it's probably easier to add a feature to Linux than it is to get MS to add a new feature. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Linux quicker to support multithreading than Windows, largely because big megacorps needed that for their servers?
  - ThrowawayR2 6y ago
    > "Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Linux quicker to support multithreading than Windows, largely because big megacorps needed that for their servers? " Surely you jest. The other Unixes, including Microsoft Xenix, supported multithreading before either Windows NT or Linux even existed. Big megacorps in that era used Sun Microsystems ("The com in dotcom™") server and other proprietary Unix servers because both Windows NT and Linux on the x86 hardware of the time weren't considered good enough to handle megacorp server loads and that didn't change until around '00. If you go strictly by release date, Linux 0.01 came out in '91 and Windows NT 3.1 came out in '93 so it's technically correct that Linux had multithreading first but neither Linux 0.95 (what would have been available in '93) nor NT 3.1 was exactly something anyone would consider using in production, let alone at a megacorp.
    - int_19h 6y ago
      Linux didn't have real threads early on tho, didn't it? LinuxThreads were only introduced in 1996, and they were broken in many ways.
      - ThrowawayR2 6y ago
        You're right. According to the old Linux Threads FAQ (https://web.fe.up.pt/~jmcruz/etc/threads/linuxthreads-faq2.html#LinuxSupport https://web.fe.up.pt/~jmcruz/etc/threads/linuxthreads-faq2.h...), that seems to be about the right timeframe. Oh well, shows what my memory's worth.
- marcosdumay 6y ago
  Yeah, that completely ignores how shitty all the UNIX userland was. Some of the kernels were even good, but what gain does it bring if tar would always do the most insane action instead of backing-up your disk?
freefriedrice 6y ago
When I worked for a large semiconductor company from late 1980's till early 2000's, I saw IT move from a ghastly mix of AIX, HPUX and SunOS terminals & distributed computing to 100% Linux ... in under 2 years!! It was like someone flipped a switch and suddenly there was only one type of environment for all computing (we used something else besides VNC to manage remote X sessions, I forget what it was, it was some weird launcher for Windows). IT claimed hundreds of millions in savings due to not having to pay for AIX, HPUX and SunOS licensing. I think the cost is what tipped the scales.

ThrowawayR2 6y ago

> "There's a good reason why Linux absolutely dominates the server space." Yeah, it was cheaper (in both senses of the word) than all the other contenders and more or less Unixy enough that software could easily be ported over.

tombert 6y ago
Well, not to mention that you're allowed to add features to it without waiting for Microsoft to do it. Linux might not be the best codebase in the world, but it's probably easier to add a feature to Linux than it is to get MS to add a new feature. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Linux quicker to support multithreading than Windows, largely because big megacorps needed that for their servers?
- ThrowawayR2 6y ago
  > "Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Linux quicker to support multithreading than Windows, largely because big megacorps needed that for their servers? " Surely you jest. The other Unixes, including Microsoft Xenix, supported multithreading before either Windows NT or Linux even existed. Big megacorps in that era used Sun Microsystems ("The com in dotcom™") server and other proprietary Unix servers because both Windows NT and Linux on the x86 hardware of the time weren't considered good enough to handle megacorp server loads and that didn't change until around '00. If you go strictly by release date, Linux 0.01 came out in '91 and Windows NT 3.1 came out in '93 so it's technically correct that Linux had multithreading first but neither Linux 0.95 (what would have been available in '93) nor NT 3.1 was exactly something anyone would consider using in production, let alone at a megacorp.
  - int_19h 6y ago
    Linux didn't have real threads early on tho, didn't it? LinuxThreads were only introduced in 1996, and they were broken in many ways.
    - ThrowawayR2 6y ago
      You're right. According to the old Linux Threads FAQ (https://web.fe.up.pt/~jmcruz/etc/threads/linuxthreads-faq2.html#LinuxSupport https://web.fe.up.pt/~jmcruz/etc/threads/linuxthreads-faq2.h...), that seems to be about the right timeframe. Oh well, shows what my memory's worth.
marcosdumay 6y ago
Yeah, that completely ignores how shitty all the UNIX userland was. Some of the kernels were even good, but what gain does it bring if tar would always do the most insane action instead of backing-up your disk?

freefriedrice 6y ago

When I worked for a large semiconductor company from late 1980's till early 2000's, I saw IT move from a ghastly mix of AIX, HPUX and SunOS terminals & distributed computing to 100% Linux ... in under 2 years!! It was like someone flipped a switch and suddenly there was only one type of environment for all computing (we used something else besides VNC to manage remote X sessions, I forget what it was, it was some weird launcher for Windows). IT claimed hundreds of millions in savings due to not having to pay for AIX, HPUX and SunOS licensing. I think the cost is what tipped the scales.