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I spent a while in Thailand and the dropship-bro "digital nomad" culture is just everywhere. During burning season the Chiang Mai dudes would come down to the i

I spent a while in Thailand and the dropship-bro "digital nomad" culture is just everywhere. During burning season the Chiang Mai dudes would come down to the islands and the rest of us expat/nomad types would bail to avoid them. Lots of Tim Ferris cultists and so forth, though there were also a lot of sincere people just trying to get out of the rat race. All chasing the four hour workweek thing. It's a weird subculture.

deleted 6y ago
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ashtonkem 6y ago
I genuinely wonder if there was a point where these 4hww tactics worked before the book was released, or has it always been this way?
- Nextgrid 6y ago
  Drop shipping and similar high-margin ventures work when there’s no competition. There’s no reason why it wouldn’t work in the beginning but eventually competition appears and margins go down as the market readjusts.
  - freepor 6y ago
    And it still works in market niches that haven’t been discovered by the dropship brotherhood.
  - 0xy 6y ago
    If you're a juicy enough target, Amazon will just launch an Amazon Basics version of your product and crush you with algorithms.
- lsalvatore 6y ago
  I read the book 10 years ago and it was hugely inspirational to me. From what I remember it was not about drop-shipping or specific tactics (it does mention virtual assistants), but general ways of thinking, like the 80/20 rule. For me, he really pioneered the idea of "the side project" as a thing people were doing seriously, and gave many examples of different businesses people started on their spare time that lead to a full time income. So Tim Ferriss is not a "get rich quick guru". The 80/20 rule, outsourcing things you're not good at, will always be relevant, and that's why his books/podcasts are so successful.
  - hnick 6y ago
    I never finished the book but I got that impression too. Also he really talked up virtual assistants a lot as you say. I don't hear a lot about them anymore, is it still a useful thing?
factsaresacred 6y ago
> there were also a lot of sincere people just trying to get out of the rat race. With the relatively small start-up costs, if you can limit the downside risk it's worth a shot. But as with anything with a low barrier of entry people grossly miscalculate the odds of success - easy to begin does not equate to easy to win. And that's when the "$0 to $100,000 in 30 days" ebook hucksters jump in with all the answers.
txcwpalpha 6y ago
I know this sounds dramatic but these types have practically ruined staying in hostels for me. I used to love hostels because of the types of people you would meet, all of them vastly different in most ways but all united by a common desire to travel and see the sights of the place you're visiting. If someone were to talk about work, it would be to say that they are taking an extended vacation from it or working as a part-time bartender or travel guide, but they certainly wouldn't brag about it. But the last couple of times I've gone backpacking in Southeast Asia, you can't go to any hostel common area without at least a handful of nomad-bros on their MacBook and a Chang bragging to anyone nearby about "yea I'm a digital nomad, I'm making so much money even while just chilling at this bar". A lot of them have somehow turned the travel aspect of the culture into "just part of the job", as if the only reason they are traveling is because "working and traveling is cool", rather than simply "travel is cool".
- weeksie 6y ago
  That's a brilliant summation. My sentiments exactly. It's like they've managed to bring the office with them and get the worst of all worlds in the process.
- gfxgirl 6y ago
  Are you sure you're not just rebelling against the new? Like in the past most people had to separate work from travel but now there's this new thing "digital nomad" that lets lots of people work from anywhere and they're enjoying this new freedom that used to be available to a lot less people?
  - txcwpalpha 6y ago
    My point that I'm having a hard time expressing is that these dropshippers do not seem to be "enjoying this new freedom" in the way you imply. As in, they aren't people who wished to travel, were previously unable to do so because of work commitments, and now are able to enjoy travel because of extra work freedoms. The majority of "nomads" I've encountered seem like they are mostly uninterested in travel, but they do it anyway because that's "what you're supposed to do" if you're a nomad. This leads to a bizarre culture where talking about the places they've been becomes more of a "digital nomad resume" than it does a recounting of enjoyable travel experiences. Instead of "I went to the Batu Caves and it was gorgeous, they have such interesting architecture there!", it becomes "yea I've been to the Batu Caves, there's a really nice cafe with good wifi just outside that I used to work from". Have you ever had a conversation with a professional consultant and they have this weird habit of bragging about waking up at 4am to catch flights to NYC, and the only thing they ever tell you about NYC is how nice the Midtown Marriott's beds are? It's kind of like that.
robotnikman 6y ago
Speaking of the Four Hour Work Week, I've been recommended that book by others but never got around to reading it. Is it worth reading? It sounds like the ideas it teaches might be either outdated or just plain false at this point.
- brian_spiering 6y ago
  There are parts of it that are brilliant. Good stuff about organizing your internal mindset.
- syedkarim 6y ago
  There are parts of it that are just dog shit, complete drivel. I read the book when it first came out and can't understand why it's so popular after all of these years. Came off as bits of pop psychology with a large helping of self-promotion, and sprinkles of bullshit. I do recall coming across some interesting tidbits, though. For some reason it reminded me of Trump's first book, The Art of the Deal.
  - adventured 6y ago
    > For some reason it reminded me of Trump's first book, The Art of the Deal. They're both primarily selling the same thing, the glorification of the author's image.
  - EForEndeavour 6y ago
    I wonder if, consistent with what the "Four-hour work week" title implies, only about 10% of the content is actually of value.
    - ryanwaggoner 6y ago
      That's probably the high water mark for 99% of books.
  - exolymph 6y ago
    > Came off as bits of pop psychology with a large helping of self-promotion, and sprinkles of bullshit. This is exactly why it's so popular.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

ashtonkem 6y ago

I genuinely wonder if there was a point where these 4hww tactics worked before the book was released, or has it always been this way?

Nextgrid 6y ago
Drop shipping and similar high-margin ventures work when there’s no competition. There’s no reason why it wouldn’t work in the beginning but eventually competition appears and margins go down as the market readjusts.
- freepor 6y ago
  And it still works in market niches that haven’t been discovered by the dropship brotherhood.
- 0xy 6y ago
  If you're a juicy enough target, Amazon will just launch an Amazon Basics version of your product and crush you with algorithms.
lsalvatore 6y ago
I read the book 10 years ago and it was hugely inspirational to me. From what I remember it was not about drop-shipping or specific tactics (it does mention virtual assistants), but general ways of thinking, like the 80/20 rule. For me, he really pioneered the idea of "the side project" as a thing people were doing seriously, and gave many examples of different businesses people started on their spare time that lead to a full time income. So Tim Ferriss is not a "get rich quick guru". The 80/20 rule, outsourcing things you're not good at, will always be relevant, and that's why his books/podcasts are so successful.
- hnick 6y ago
  I never finished the book but I got that impression too. Also he really talked up virtual assistants a lot as you say. I don't hear a lot about them anymore, is it still a useful thing?

factsaresacred 6y ago

> there were also a lot of sincere people just trying to get out of the rat race. With the relatively small start-up costs, if you can limit the downside risk it's worth a shot. But as with anything with a low barrier of entry people grossly miscalculate the odds of success - easy to begin does not equate to easy to win. And that's when the "$0 to $100,000 in 30 days" ebook hucksters jump in with all the answers.

txcwpalpha 6y ago

I know this sounds dramatic but these types have practically ruined staying in hostels for me. I used to love hostels because of the types of people you would meet, all of them vastly different in most ways but all united by a common desire to travel and see the sights of the place you're visiting. If someone were to talk about work, it would be to say that they are taking an extended vacation from it or working as a part-time bartender or travel guide, but they certainly wouldn't brag about it. But the last couple of times I've gone backpacking in Southeast Asia, you can't go to any hostel common area without at least a handful of nomad-bros on their MacBook and a Chang bragging to anyone nearby about "yea I'm a digital nomad, I'm making so much money even while just chilling at this bar". A lot of them have somehow turned the travel aspect of the culture into "just part of the job", as if the only reason they are traveling is because "working and traveling is cool", rather than simply "travel is cool".

weeksie 6y ago
That's a brilliant summation. My sentiments exactly. It's like they've managed to bring the office with them and get the worst of all worlds in the process.
gfxgirl 6y ago
Are you sure you're not just rebelling against the new? Like in the past most people had to separate work from travel but now there's this new thing "digital nomad" that lets lots of people work from anywhere and they're enjoying this new freedom that used to be available to a lot less people?
- txcwpalpha 6y ago
  My point that I'm having a hard time expressing is that these dropshippers do not seem to be "enjoying this new freedom" in the way you imply. As in, they aren't people who wished to travel, were previously unable to do so because of work commitments, and now are able to enjoy travel because of extra work freedoms. The majority of "nomads" I've encountered seem like they are mostly uninterested in travel, but they do it anyway because that's "what you're supposed to do" if you're a nomad. This leads to a bizarre culture where talking about the places they've been becomes more of a "digital nomad resume" than it does a recounting of enjoyable travel experiences. Instead of "I went to the Batu Caves and it was gorgeous, they have such interesting architecture there!", it becomes "yea I've been to the Batu Caves, there's a really nice cafe with good wifi just outside that I used to work from". Have you ever had a conversation with a professional consultant and they have this weird habit of bragging about waking up at 4am to catch flights to NYC, and the only thing they ever tell you about NYC is how nice the Midtown Marriott's beds are? It's kind of like that.

robotnikman 6y ago

Speaking of the Four Hour Work Week, I've been recommended that book by others but never got around to reading it. Is it worth reading? It sounds like the ideas it teaches might be either outdated or just plain false at this point.

brian_spiering 6y ago
There are parts of it that are brilliant. Good stuff about organizing your internal mindset.
syedkarim 6y ago
There are parts of it that are just dog shit, complete drivel. I read the book when it first came out and can't understand why it's so popular after all of these years. Came off as bits of pop psychology with a large helping of self-promotion, and sprinkles of bullshit. I do recall coming across some interesting tidbits, though. For some reason it reminded me of Trump's first book, The Art of the Deal.
- adventured 6y ago
  > For some reason it reminded me of Trump's first book, The Art of the Deal. They're both primarily selling the same thing, the glorification of the author's image.
- EForEndeavour 6y ago
  I wonder if, consistent with what the "Four-hour work week" title implies, only about 10% of the content is actually of value.
  - ryanwaggoner 6y ago
    That's probably the high water mark for 99% of books.
- exolymph 6y ago
  > Came off as bits of pop psychology with a large helping of self-promotion, and sprinkles of bullshit. This is exactly why it's so popular.