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I'm involved in the online music biz. What's going on is this: - current Top 40 rarely has guitar. Basically Taylor Swift and Lil Wayne use one as a prop, and

I'm involved in the online music biz. What's going on is this: - current Top 40 rarely has guitar. Basically Taylor Swift and Lil Wayne use one as a prop, and that's it. - but Youtube is teeming with young adult virtuoso electric guitarists. Check out Polyphia (Tim Henson), Covet (Yvette Young, San Jose!), Periphery, Mel. - Grunge is misunderstood. Kurt Cobain was a good guitar player, and he made his band practise for months before their first album. Same with Soundgarden, etc. Those bands didn't need autotune. - Metal fans ate their own: no loyalty. So 70s and 80s rock bands still tour, and 90s and oughts are scraping by. See the Youtube "Punk Rock MBA" channel for detailed analysis. - 70s and 80s rock bands have tremendous respect online now. View counts on Skid Row, Metallica, Bonjovi, etc. are huge. Their musicianship is acknowledged, and the niche each band occupied is now understood and appreciated.

bsder 7y ago
> 70s and 80s rock bands have tremendous respect online now. View counts on Skid Row, Metallica, Bonjovi, etc. are huge. Their musicianship is acknowledged In my opinion, this is backward and is survivor bias. Only those bands with musicianship survived because all the other fluff goes away with age.
- marktangotango 7y ago
  I'm curious if you could name some examples of "fluff that went away" in this particular genre, that was mainstream? By mainstream I mean either charted or got radio play, during that era? I mean also, please don't rattle off a list of bands no ones ever heard of :)
  - twic 7y ago
    What's Meat Loaf up to these days? We don't listen to a lot of Twisted Sister now either.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - bitwize 7y ago
      Meat Loaf has wrecked his voice and doesn't sing anymore. However, he is on tour: he talks about the music and another guy actually performs his old songs.
  - rezeroed 7y ago
    That's a tricky question because "went away" is fuzzy. For example Ministry were popular in the early, mid 90's - apparently they're still going, I had no idea. There are many who technically haven't gone away, but they're far from the spotlight these days. A certain fluff example: Body Count.
  - alexilliamson 7y ago
    Twisted Sister, Motley Crue, Ratt, Warrant, Quiet Riot, KISS, Scorpions. You ever hear from them these days except for VH1 shows?
  - bsder 7y ago
    Tiffany? Atlantic Starr? Cutting Crew? Samantha Fox? White Lion? Vixen? Captain & Tennille? Lulu? Pick a year. Look for names you don't hear being played anymore in spite of the fact that the were pretty significant at the time. There are quite a lot of them. Or pull up Old Grey Whistle Test or The Midnight Special episodes. There will always be a couple clunkers that were big at the time.
partyboat1586 7y ago
Do you see a guitar revival in the future of popular music?
- hrnnnnnn 7y ago
  They've been talking about this a bit on the Switched on Pop podcast. Here's a whole episode on the subject: https://switchedonpop.com/episodes/return-of-the-guitar-halsey-5-seconds-of-summer-joji https://switchedonpop.com/episodes/return-of-the-guitar-hals...
  - partyboat1586 7y ago
    Thanks :)
talkingquickly 7y ago
Thanks for this, generally find discovering new (as in recent) guitar music challenging. You've sent me down a veyr enjoyable rabbit hole of awesome new stuff!
rezeroed 7y ago
Does your last point not counter your preceding point: tremendous respect online now -- Metal fans ate their own: no loyalty.
SeanLuke 7y ago
I don't play the guitar: I'm a keyboard person. But I'm very concerned about the future of the guitar market. Over the last three years there have been numerous articles about how the guitar industry is in serious trouble. Electric guitar sales have dropped by a third over the last decade, and profits are way down. Guitar Center is in trouble. Gibson is bankrupt. On the other hand, Rolling Stone put out an article about how Guitars are Doing Just Fine Thank You Very Much. (https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/guitars-are-getting-more-popular-so-why-do-we-think-theyre-dying-630446/ https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/guitars-are-ge...). It feels very... apologetic. So I don't know what to think. Here's what I know: DAWs, electronic production tools, synthesizers, etc., are doing very well. Today's underground seems to have a lot of rap, synth metal (NiN, industrial, whatnot), EDM, even pop. [I'm none of those things]. Is the garage band going away, to be replaced with the bedroom producer?
- RickS 7y ago
  As a guitarist and hobbyist bedroom producer for 15+ years, here's what I think is happening to the guitar market: the middle is falling out. Cheap guitars were previously way too expensive. I'm talking about things like the no-name starter packs you'd get from Frys, or even the equivalents from Squire. They were riding on lack of competition and brand clout, and they'd been disrupted by companies that are happy to sell guitars of similar quality for half the price. It has never been more affordable to start playing guitar. I think that's great. The high-end guitar market has some fascinating and innovative entrants. Strandberg stands out as king here. They build absolutely stunning guitars and IMO they've got an impressive adoption rate for something so expensive (2-3K). There are a surprisingly large number of high end guitar manufacturers targeting this market. The 500-850$ market feels like it's got a ton of options, but it's flooded with noise. Some dead wood needs to burn off, I think. I think amp companies are at much greater risk. First, the processing you can get out of the box now is just unreal. $100 for a preamp, and something like neural/toneforge (or even impulse responses + free amp sims) will get tones that compete with very expensive gear. A distant second but interesting: millenials are all broke and living in apartments / cities. You can't really have a giant loud amp in that environment. If you're not gigging, you no longer need to own one at all. > Is the garage band going away, to be replaced with the bedroom producer? At least partially, and for the best: the demand for being in a garage band should fall. Lots of people were in only in bands because they couldn't self-serve across as many instruments as they'd like. That's much easier now for a bunch of reasons. There's a middle ground too. I see a lot of "bedroom bands" – with bedroom production but the multi-member aspect of a garage band. ---- Another random thought: guitars are one of those products that strongly requires showrooming. Buying a guitar without feeling and hearing it is tough. This is one of the few things keeping guitar center alive. If a company figures out how to be warby parker for guitars, letting me pick five and mail four back, they could stand to make a bunch of money. This pairs really well with all the up and coming guitar brands trying to break into the market via youtubers.
beaugunderson 7y ago
who is the Mel in question? (I love Polyphia & Covet so I want to listen to whoever else is in that list!) and I would highly recommend Chon, Intervals, Plini, Vasudeva, Via Luna, Tricot, and Stage Kids as related sounds
- RickS 7y ago
  Animals as Leaders and Chimp Spanner make this list for me as well. I got a chance to see Intervals live and they're the most impressive guitarists I've ever seen. SO dialed. A lot of these bands (polyphia especially) don't really gig like the album, but Intervals is every bit that good in person.
specialist 7y ago
Dude. Great tips. I'm now angry I went so long without Polyphia. My life has been a lie. I'm not worthy. Looking forward to exploring the others. If you need me, I'll be just over there, head banging with the other graybeards.

bsder 7y ago

> 70s and 80s rock bands have tremendous respect online now. View counts on Skid Row, Metallica, Bonjovi, etc. are huge. Their musicianship is acknowledged In my opinion, this is backward and is survivor bias. Only those bands with musicianship survived because all the other fluff goes away with age.

marktangotango 7y ago
I'm curious if you could name some examples of "fluff that went away" in this particular genre, that was mainstream? By mainstream I mean either charted or got radio play, during that era? I mean also, please don't rattle off a list of bands no ones ever heard of :)
- twic 7y ago
  What's Meat Loaf up to these days? We don't listen to a lot of Twisted Sister now either.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - bitwize 7y ago
    Meat Loaf has wrecked his voice and doesn't sing anymore. However, he is on tour: he talks about the music and another guy actually performs his old songs.
- rezeroed 7y ago
  That's a tricky question because "went away" is fuzzy. For example Ministry were popular in the early, mid 90's - apparently they're still going, I had no idea. There are many who technically haven't gone away, but they're far from the spotlight these days. A certain fluff example: Body Count.
- alexilliamson 7y ago
  Twisted Sister, Motley Crue, Ratt, Warrant, Quiet Riot, KISS, Scorpions. You ever hear from them these days except for VH1 shows?
- bsder 7y ago
  Tiffany? Atlantic Starr? Cutting Crew? Samantha Fox? White Lion? Vixen? Captain & Tennille? Lulu? Pick a year. Look for names you don't hear being played anymore in spite of the fact that the were pretty significant at the time. There are quite a lot of them. Or pull up Old Grey Whistle Test or The Midnight Special episodes. There will always be a couple clunkers that were big at the time.

partyboat1586 7y ago

Do you see a guitar revival in the future of popular music?

hrnnnnnn 7y ago
They've been talking about this a bit on the Switched on Pop podcast. Here's a whole episode on the subject: https://switchedonpop.com/episodes/return-of-the-guitar-halsey-5-seconds-of-summer-joji https://switchedonpop.com/episodes/return-of-the-guitar-hals...
- partyboat1586 7y ago
  Thanks :)

talkingquickly 7y ago

Thanks for this, generally find discovering new (as in recent) guitar music challenging. You've sent me down a veyr enjoyable rabbit hole of awesome new stuff!

rezeroed 7y ago

Does your last point not counter your preceding point: tremendous respect online now -- Metal fans ate their own: no loyalty.

SeanLuke 7y ago

I don't play the guitar: I'm a keyboard person. But I'm very concerned about the future of the guitar market. Over the last three years there have been numerous articles about how the guitar industry is in serious trouble. Electric guitar sales have dropped by a third over the last decade, and profits are way down. Guitar Center is in trouble. Gibson is bankrupt. On the other hand, Rolling Stone put out an article about how Guitars are Doing Just Fine Thank You Very Much. (https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/guitars-are-getting-more-popular-so-why-do-we-think-theyre-dying-630446/ https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/guitars-are-ge...). It feels very... apologetic. So I don't know what to think. Here's what I know: DAWs, electronic production tools, synthesizers, etc., are doing very well. Today's underground seems to have a lot of rap, synth metal (NiN, industrial, whatnot), EDM, even pop. [I'm none of those things]. Is the garage band going away, to be replaced with the bedroom producer?

RickS 7y ago
As a guitarist and hobbyist bedroom producer for 15+ years, here's what I think is happening to the guitar market: the middle is falling out. Cheap guitars were previously way too expensive. I'm talking about things like the no-name starter packs you'd get from Frys, or even the equivalents from Squire. They were riding on lack of competition and brand clout, and they'd been disrupted by companies that are happy to sell guitars of similar quality for half the price. It has never been more affordable to start playing guitar. I think that's great. The high-end guitar market has some fascinating and innovative entrants. Strandberg stands out as king here. They build absolutely stunning guitars and IMO they've got an impressive adoption rate for something so expensive (2-3K). There are a surprisingly large number of high end guitar manufacturers targeting this market. The 500-850$ market feels like it's got a ton of options, but it's flooded with noise. Some dead wood needs to burn off, I think. I think amp companies are at much greater risk. First, the processing you can get out of the box now is just unreal. $100 for a preamp, and something like neural/toneforge (or even impulse responses + free amp sims) will get tones that compete with very expensive gear. A distant second but interesting: millenials are all broke and living in apartments / cities. You can't really have a giant loud amp in that environment. If you're not gigging, you no longer need to own one at all. > Is the garage band going away, to be replaced with the bedroom producer? At least partially, and for the best: the demand for being in a garage band should fall. Lots of people were in only in bands because they couldn't self-serve across as many instruments as they'd like. That's much easier now for a bunch of reasons. There's a middle ground too. I see a lot of "bedroom bands" – with bedroom production but the multi-member aspect of a garage band. ---- Another random thought: guitars are one of those products that strongly requires showrooming. Buying a guitar without feeling and hearing it is tough. This is one of the few things keeping guitar center alive. If a company figures out how to be warby parker for guitars, letting me pick five and mail four back, they could stand to make a bunch of money. This pairs really well with all the up and coming guitar brands trying to break into the market via youtubers.

beaugunderson 7y ago

who is the Mel in question? (I love Polyphia & Covet so I want to listen to whoever else is in that list!) and I would highly recommend Chon, Intervals, Plini, Vasudeva, Via Luna, Tricot, and Stage Kids as related sounds

RickS 7y ago
Animals as Leaders and Chimp Spanner make this list for me as well. I got a chance to see Intervals live and they're the most impressive guitarists I've ever seen. SO dialed. A lot of these bands (polyphia especially) don't really gig like the album, but Intervals is every bit that good in person.

specialist 7y ago

Dude. Great tips. I'm now angry I went so long without Polyphia. My life has been a lie. I'm not worthy. Looking forward to exploring the others. If you need me, I'll be just over there, head banging with the other graybeards.