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>JAMstack (JavaScript, APIs, and Markup) is fundamentally reshaping the web. How? "fundamentally reshaping the web" is a bold claim; how are those things resha

>JAMstack (JavaScript, APIs, and Markup) is fundamentally reshaping the web. How? "fundamentally reshaping the web" is a bold claim; how are those things reshaping the Web -- what's changing shape?

winrid 6y ago
It's not, in my opinion. Just something old - simple generated static site with sprinkle of {{currentJSFramework}}, a CDN, and some fancy marketing.
- leerob 6y ago
  What's your opinion on a more full-featured framework like RedwoodJS or Blitz then? https://redwoodjs.com/ https://redwoodjs.com/ https://blitzjs.com/ https://blitzjs.com/
  - winrid 6y ago
    So these are frameworks that generate static sites?
    - leerob 6y ago
      Yes.
      - winrid 6y ago
        They seem nice, however I don't know of many projects I've worked on where you could do this. Usually state is mutable. One that might apply had around 20 million pages, but it still ran on two m2.micros just fine and was dynamic.
leerob 6y ago
Static sites have evolved. Today, they can handle real-time requests, process payments, manage customer accounts, and a lot more. Some other benefits: * Cheaper – Not making requests to the server on-demand * Faster – Served from a global CDN close to your users * Easier – No complicated deployments, better DX How is this reshaping the web? In a way, we've come full circle. What's changing is how we get to a static site. JAMstack unlocks all the benefits of static sites with today's complex data requirements.
- nogabebop23 6y ago
  >> Easier – No complicated deployments, better DX I'm a big fan in many use-cases, but this one is overstated IMO. Yes, your "site" is essentially a bunch of static pages but in order to do all that fancy stuff that the JA-part is selling you now have a massive deployment challenge that's just as prone to the same problems as the distributed monolith. The big win IMO is moving runtime concerns to build-time. There are a surprising number of scenarios where the backing data changes on predictable, not-that-frequent basis. For example, it is far easier to publish a product catalog based on some internal system via a static generator than some sort of real-time link. There are lots of cool use-cases but JAM is not reshaping the web in any structural way, at least if you've been programming it for more than 5-10 years...
  - leerob 6y ago
    Fair points – "reshaping the web" was a probably bit overzealous.
- Nicksil 6y ago
  I'm still not quite there. >real-time requests What's this mean? If you're describing the ability to transfer the web site's data whenever a request comes in for that data, that's been the case since day 1. Alternatively, if you're describing the ability to make changes on the fly and re-draw the web site without a full request/response cycle, is it still a static web site? >process payments This really doesn't count though, does it? After all, the processing is occurring elsewhere: a third-party payment service or somewhere within the infrastructure behind the web site. It's more-or-less sending a request to some place else to process a transaction. >manage customer accounts This is similar to the previous. There's not a whole lot new going on here; you'll have to expand. >Cheaper – Not making requests to the server on-demand I don't understand how not making a request is intrinsic to any type of web site. >Faster – Served from a global CDN close to your users This just describes the location of the data; nothing to do with the web site. >Easier – No complicated deployments, better DX Now this might have some merit to it. Over the course of time, technology evolves and tasks which were more complex 10 years ago may seem trivial today; the technology you're describing could indeed be one of the choices available today. >How is this reshaping the web? In a way, we've come full circle. What's changing is how we get to a static site. JAMstack unlocks all the benefits of static sites with today's complex data requirements. Come full circle to what? We also haven't changed how we get to a static web site; a client calls a server and the server might respond with some data. I would navigate to your website the same exact way I would have 10, 15, ... years ago.

>JAMstack (JavaScript, APIs, and Markup) is fundamentally reshaping the web. How? "fundamentally reshaping the web" is a bold claim; how are those things reshaping the Web -- what's changing shape?

winrid 6y ago

It's not, in my opinion. Just something old - simple generated static site with sprinkle of {{currentJSFramework}}, a CDN, and some fancy marketing.

leerob 6y ago
What's your opinion on a more full-featured framework like RedwoodJS or Blitz then? https://redwoodjs.com/ https://redwoodjs.com/ https://blitzjs.com/ https://blitzjs.com/
- winrid 6y ago
  So these are frameworks that generate static sites?
  - leerob 6y ago
    Yes.
    - winrid 6y ago
      They seem nice, however I don't know of many projects I've worked on where you could do this. Usually state is mutable. One that might apply had around 20 million pages, but it still ran on two m2.micros just fine and was dynamic.

leerob 6y ago

Static sites have evolved. Today, they can handle real-time requests, process payments, manage customer accounts, and a lot more. Some other benefits: * Cheaper – Not making requests to the server on-demand * Faster – Served from a global CDN close to your users * Easier – No complicated deployments, better DX How is this reshaping the web? In a way, we've come full circle. What's changing is how we get to a static site. JAMstack unlocks all the benefits of static sites with today's complex data requirements.

nogabebop23 6y ago
>> Easier – No complicated deployments, better DX I'm a big fan in many use-cases, but this one is overstated IMO. Yes, your "site" is essentially a bunch of static pages but in order to do all that fancy stuff that the JA-part is selling you now have a massive deployment challenge that's just as prone to the same problems as the distributed monolith. The big win IMO is moving runtime concerns to build-time. There are a surprising number of scenarios where the backing data changes on predictable, not-that-frequent basis. For example, it is far easier to publish a product catalog based on some internal system via a static generator than some sort of real-time link. There are lots of cool use-cases but JAM is not reshaping the web in any structural way, at least if you've been programming it for more than 5-10 years...
- leerob 6y ago
  Fair points – "reshaping the web" was a probably bit overzealous.
Nicksil 6y ago
I'm still not quite there. >real-time requests What's this mean? If you're describing the ability to transfer the web site's data whenever a request comes in for that data, that's been the case since day 1. Alternatively, if you're describing the ability to make changes on the fly and re-draw the web site without a full request/response cycle, is it still a static web site? >process payments This really doesn't count though, does it? After all, the processing is occurring elsewhere: a third-party payment service or somewhere within the infrastructure behind the web site. It's more-or-less sending a request to some place else to process a transaction. >manage customer accounts This is similar to the previous. There's not a whole lot new going on here; you'll have to expand. >Cheaper – Not making requests to the server on-demand I don't understand how not making a request is intrinsic to any type of web site. >Faster – Served from a global CDN close to your users This just describes the location of the data; nothing to do with the web site. >Easier – No complicated deployments, better DX Now this might have some merit to it. Over the course of time, technology evolves and tasks which were more complex 10 years ago may seem trivial today; the technology you're describing could indeed be one of the choices available today. >How is this reshaping the web? In a way, we've come full circle. What's changing is how we get to a static site. JAMstack unlocks all the benefits of static sites with today's complex data requirements. Come full circle to what? We also haven't changed how we get to a static web site; a client calls a server and the server might respond with some data. I would navigate to your website the same exact way I would have 10, 15, ... years ago.