4 ms·

On a per capita basis, some days this week where sweden had 172 and 180 deaths in a day would be the equivalent of the US having 5600 and 6100 deaths a day. Th

• londons_explore 7y ago
  If they get it all over with in 30 days, when the USA takes 300 days to get it over with, they are still looking smart... What matters is deaths overall, not deaths per day.
  • soperj 7y ago
    It's not likely going to be over until a vaccine comes. The US and Sweden are handling it equally well.
    • munk-a 7y ago
      I agree with the sentiment that Sweden isn't handling it particularly well, the writing on the wall was showing that a full lockdown has been a good idea for quite some time. That said, the US is a great example of how to handle the situation absolutely terribly - with a major political party probably funding and at least endorsing movements violating the lockdown and terribly unclear messaging. No, I don't like the US's approach. Canada has had it's good and bad points and Vancouver was basically acting like Florida for a while, but the governments response has been well focused, even if we don't have the resources to throw at the problem that the US does - and the messaging has been extremely comforting and clear.
  • notacoward 7y ago
    > If they get it all over with in 30 days Time's already up. As I've had to point out many times, "get to herd immunity faster" doesn't just mean let everyone get sicker sooner. The whole "flattening the curve" thing is not about an alternative to herd immunity. It's about getting there in a humane way that doesn't overwhelm health care and disproportionately affect some groups - the elderly, minorities, people with other health conditions, people who have no choice but to work and expose themselves more. "Let the chips fall where they may" is a recipe for excessive and unevenly distributed suffering. And worst of all, it might not even help reduce the total deaths over the long term. That's highly speculative and dependent on other factors.
    • SpicyLemonZest 7y ago
      The reason you've had to point that out many times is that it no longer matches common usage. Most people who use "flatten the curve" nowadays insist that it is about an alternative to herd immunity, that herd immunity is absolutely unacceptable and we can't permit it. (You're right that this is not originally what the phrase meant.)
      • soperj 7y ago
        Herd immunity might not even be possible. Other coronavirus immunity lasts on average a year. There are other viruses like HIV where you can't get herd immunity.
        • microtherion 7y ago
          > There are other viruses like HIV where you can't get herd immunity. Well, maybe if we had just engaged in a vigorous program of needle sharing and unprotected sex, we'd eventually have gotten there.
          • soperj 7y ago
            No, it's impossible based on the virus.
      • notacoward 7y ago
        > Most people who use "flatten the curve" nowadays insist that it is about an alternative That has absolutely not been my impression, but they're probably both matters of perspective - who we talk to, what sources we read, and so on. To the extent that people do think of it as an alternative, that makes me sad.
  • soperj 7y ago
    Overall, in deaths per million Sweden is ahead of the US as well.
• deleted 7y ago
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• Mediterraneo10 7y ago
  People keep pointing to Swedish death numbers as a sign that “the approach are not working”. But lockdown measures in so many countries are not designed to avoid every single fatality as much as to keep the health system from being overwhelmed. If Sweden has had a fairly sizable amount of deaths – of mainly elderly people, as we see – but its health system has not been overwhelmed for the bulk of the population and the economy has not greatly suffered, then things are arguably working out better than in countries which have minimized fatalities but are dealing with greater economic (and psychological) fallout.
• jpalomaki 7y ago
  It depends on what you are aiming at. If you are aiming for the herd immunity then the best approach is to get there as quickly as you can, while keeping within the limits of your health care capacity and protecting those with highest risk of severe outcomes. Certain amount of deaths is inevitable. We really need to wait a year or two before we can tell which strategy was the best. It is not clear if the countries which managed to limit the infections will do any better in the long run than for example Sweden.
  • gindely 7y ago
    Sweden isn't aiming at herd immunity. They've assumed herd immunity is going to come in all places.
• tartrate 7y ago
  73 deaths in one day is the maximum this week. Deaths per day is on a downward trend right now. Two weeks ago the maximum on a day was 108.