6 ms·

Redditors discover #ReopenAmerica was started as an astroturfing campaign

168 points by milkytron 7y ago

simcop2387 7y ago
A related discussion from /r/bestof/ which tries to be a meta-discussion about the "best" posts and comments on reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/g3sw2l/the_user_udr_midnight_uncovers_a_massive/ https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/g3sw2l/the_user_udr...
fack 7y ago
https://twitter.com/alibreland/status/1252037486295031808 https://twitter.com/alibreland/status/1252037486295031808
- free_rms 7y ago
  On the one hand, we've got a super-long effort post with lots of cites and documentation. On the other, a guy on twitter met an old hippie that says otherwise. Seems pretty metaphorical for the whole situation, no?
  - nkozyra 7y ago
    The information highway sure turned out to be a perfect medium for disinformation, huh?
  - jlmorton 7y ago
    This is not just a guy on Twitter, he's a well-known reporter for Mother Jones Magazine. What he's saying does not dispute anything in the well-cited Reddit post. It just offers new information which paints it in an entirely different light. Because rather than basing the entire allegation on WHOIS records, he reached out to talk to the person involved, something that reporters do, but the Reddit hivemind does not.
    - free_rms 7y ago
      Did you read the comment that this thread is linked to? It's not based on WHOIS records for non-existent sites, it's based on CMS, HTML elements and identifies specific PR consultancies.
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
- mikelockz 7y ago
  To clarify, there was and still is an active astroturf campaign organizing thousands of people to violate recommendations by the federal government about social distancing guidelines. Then there is a guy who registered a bunch of domains and is getting doxxed. Not sure why the later has an article in Mother Jones why the former does not.
jlmorton 7y ago
Please see a follow-up from Mother Jones reporter Ali Breland [1]. While the Reddit thread accurately described that these domain names were all purchased by a single entity, it appears that this entity is not a shadowy conservative astroturf group, but rather a guy who purchased them to prevent them from being registered by conservative groups, or maybe just to squat on them. He's now being doxxed. [1] https://twitter.com/alibreland/status/1252037486295031808 https://twitter.com/alibreland/status/1252037486295031808
- mcphage 7y ago
  > described that these domain names were all purchased by a single entity That definitely isn't all of them, because a lot of them resolve to actual sites.
tathougies 7y ago
I don't really understand the evidence being promulgated. Anyone care to explain? In particular I'm confused at the distinction between 'astroturfing' and 'grassroots'. The chief complaint seems to be that a 'corporation' is behind the campaign as if this stands in opposition to a group of concerned individuals being behind it. Last I checked, any group of people can start a corporation, apply for non-profit status, and register a domain name. Shouldn't the criteria for distinguishing between astroturfing and grassroots involve more than just seeing if a corporation is behind the campaign? Shouldn't we have to look into which corporation is doing it, their history, etc? And if it is just another NGO/non-profit, which shouldn't the be allowed to campaign on behalf of their donors? I'm just confused honestly, and have never understood astroturfing. Help me hacker news.
- ryanianian 7y ago
  Perhaps your comment was directed at a different post? This post is about spreadsheets.
  - dang 7y ago
    I'll move it. Edit: done.
  - recursive 7y ago
    Perhaps your comment was directed at a different post? This post is about a twitter hashtag.
- mpolichette 7y ago
  I think the main idea distinguishing grassroots vs astroturfing is the idea that grassroots campaigns are about individuals deciding to self organize around and idea. It's ok if that idea came from somewhere else, but the organization and push is coming locally. Astroturfing, on the other hand, is when an outside influence is actively trying to organize spread out groups to make it look like a grassroots campaign.
  - tathougies 7y ago
akersten 7y ago
It's pretty easy to understand this operation exists as part of an ongoing campaign to sow discord in the West. What better way to divide a nation than to encourage and exploit an existing polarization, rather than doing the dirty work yourself. Political subterfuge has evolved to be a lot more subtle - plant the seeds of discontent via Facebook events or meme factories, and watch groups take them up. Similar to how completely baseless ideas that 5G causes cancer or coronavirus popped up out of nowhere - and you wind up with citizens destroying their country's own infrastructure[0]. An adversary's dream! [0]: https://venturebeat.com/2020/04/03/uk-debunks-5g-coronavirus-link-after-conspiracy-theorists-burn-cell-tower/ https://venturebeat.com/2020/04/03/uk-debunks-5g-coronavirus...
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
fakeSocialMedia 7y ago
These people are calling it Astroturfing but in reality it's just organization. I am dumbfounded that opening the country now that the curve was flattened is now political.
- stillbourne 7y ago
  Here is the definition for astroturf: https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Astroturf https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Astroturf Seems to match up to me.
- danaris 7y ago
  The purpose of flattening the curve isn't to then celebrate victory and return to normal. Now we need to ride out that flattened curve. Open everything now will just result in all that we've been through thus far being for nothing as infections spike again.
  - fakeSocialMedia 7y ago
    So quarentine for 2 years? Say what it is.
    - danaris 7y ago
      Maybe it is. I dunno, I'm not a virologist, so I don't have any way to predict how long this is actually likely to last.
surround 7y ago
This post was quickly taken off of the front page. Can we get an explanation?
- surround 7y ago
  I guess it was flagged because it was kind of political and would probably start a flame war. I don’t know why I couldn’t think of that.
Obi_Juan_Kenobi 7y ago
I've seen a lot of "just asking questions" about the difference between astroturfing vs. grassroots in discussion related to this issue. Phrased in an oddly similar way. Keep your head on a swivel.
Meekro 7y ago
That whole post is based on a misunderstanding of what OneClickPolitics does: it manages websites, paid ads, and social media campaigns for advocacy groups. These websites look cookie-cutter because the OneClickPolitics platform auto-generates them. It's like saying that all Shopify stores look similar. Their "OneClick Acquisition" platform delivers "on demand, organic supporters through our proprietary digital ad placement technology." They design and place digital ads to attract supporters to your campaign. If they were just hiring people to pretend to be supporters, they wouldn't need to place ads searching for them.
eqdw 7y ago
Now do all the protests from 3 years ago

168 points by milkytron 7y ago

A related discussion from /r/bestof/ which tries to be a meta-discussion about the "best" posts and comments on reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/g3sw2l/the_user_udr_midnight_uncovers_a_massive/ https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/g3sw2l/the_user_udr...

fack 7y ago

https://twitter.com/alibreland/status/1252037486295031808 https://twitter.com/alibreland/status/1252037486295031808

free_rms 7y ago
On the one hand, we've got a super-long effort post with lots of cites and documentation. On the other, a guy on twitter met an old hippie that says otherwise. Seems pretty metaphorical for the whole situation, no?
- nkozyra 7y ago
  The information highway sure turned out to be a perfect medium for disinformation, huh?
- jlmorton 7y ago
  This is not just a guy on Twitter, he's a well-known reporter for Mother Jones Magazine. What he's saying does not dispute anything in the well-cited Reddit post. It just offers new information which paints it in an entirely different light. Because rather than basing the entire allegation on WHOIS records, he reached out to talk to the person involved, something that reporters do, but the Reddit hivemind does not.
  - free_rms 7y ago
    Did you read the comment that this thread is linked to? It's not based on WHOIS records for non-existent sites, it's based on CMS, HTML elements and identifies specific PR consultancies.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
mikelockz 7y ago
To clarify, there was and still is an active astroturf campaign organizing thousands of people to violate recommendations by the federal government about social distancing guidelines. Then there is a guy who registered a bunch of domains and is getting doxxed. Not sure why the later has an article in Mother Jones why the former does not.

jlmorton 7y ago

Please see a follow-up from Mother Jones reporter Ali Breland [1]. While the Reddit thread accurately described that these domain names were all purchased by a single entity, it appears that this entity is not a shadowy conservative astroturf group, but rather a guy who purchased them to prevent them from being registered by conservative groups, or maybe just to squat on them. He's now being doxxed. [1] https://twitter.com/alibreland/status/1252037486295031808 https://twitter.com/alibreland/status/1252037486295031808

mcphage 7y ago
> described that these domain names were all purchased by a single entity That definitely isn't all of them, because a lot of them resolve to actual sites.

tathougies 7y ago

I don't really understand the evidence being promulgated. Anyone care to explain? In particular I'm confused at the distinction between 'astroturfing' and 'grassroots'. The chief complaint seems to be that a 'corporation' is behind the campaign as if this stands in opposition to a group of concerned individuals being behind it. Last I checked, any group of people can start a corporation, apply for non-profit status, and register a domain name. Shouldn't the criteria for distinguishing between astroturfing and grassroots involve more than just seeing if a corporation is behind the campaign? Shouldn't we have to look into which corporation is doing it, their history, etc? And if it is just another NGO/non-profit, which shouldn't the be allowed to campaign on behalf of their donors? I'm just confused honestly, and have never understood astroturfing. Help me hacker news.

ryanianian 7y ago
Perhaps your comment was directed at a different post? This post is about spreadsheets.
- dang 7y ago
  I'll move it. Edit: done.
- recursive 7y ago
  Perhaps your comment was directed at a different post? This post is about a twitter hashtag.
mpolichette 7y ago
I think the main idea distinguishing grassroots vs astroturfing is the idea that grassroots campaigns are about individuals deciding to self organize around and idea. It's ok if that idea came from somewhere else, but the organization and push is coming locally. Astroturfing, on the other hand, is when an outside influence is actively trying to organize spread out groups to make it look like a grassroots campaign.
- tathougies 7y ago

akersten 7y ago

It's pretty easy to understand this operation exists as part of an ongoing campaign to sow discord in the West. What better way to divide a nation than to encourage and exploit an existing polarization, rather than doing the dirty work yourself. Political subterfuge has evolved to be a lot more subtle - plant the seeds of discontent via Facebook events or meme factories, and watch groups take them up. Similar to how completely baseless ideas that 5G causes cancer or coronavirus popped up out of nowhere - and you wind up with citizens destroying their country's own infrastructure[0]. An adversary's dream! [0]: https://venturebeat.com/2020/04/03/uk-debunks-5g-coronavirus-link-after-conspiracy-theorists-burn-cell-tower/ https://venturebeat.com/2020/04/03/uk-debunks-5g-coronavirus...

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

fakeSocialMedia 7y ago

These people are calling it Astroturfing but in reality it's just organization. I am dumbfounded that opening the country now that the curve was flattened is now political.

stillbourne 7y ago
Here is the definition for astroturf: https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Astroturf https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Astroturf Seems to match up to me.
danaris 7y ago
The purpose of flattening the curve isn't to then celebrate victory and return to normal. Now we need to ride out that flattened curve. Open everything now will just result in all that we've been through thus far being for nothing as infections spike again.
- fakeSocialMedia 7y ago
  So quarentine for 2 years? Say what it is.
  - danaris 7y ago
    Maybe it is. I dunno, I'm not a virologist, so I don't have any way to predict how long this is actually likely to last.

surround 7y ago

This post was quickly taken off of the front page. Can we get an explanation?

surround 7y ago
I guess it was flagged because it was kind of political and would probably start a flame war. I don’t know why I couldn’t think of that.

Obi_Juan_Kenobi 7y ago

I've seen a lot of "just asking questions" about the difference between astroturfing vs. grassroots in discussion related to this issue. Phrased in an oddly similar way. Keep your head on a swivel.

Meekro 7y ago

That whole post is based on a misunderstanding of what OneClickPolitics does: it manages websites, paid ads, and social media campaigns for advocacy groups. These websites look cookie-cutter because the OneClickPolitics platform auto-generates them. It's like saying that all Shopify stores look similar. Their "OneClick Acquisition" platform delivers "on demand, organic supporters through our proprietary digital ad placement technology." They design and place digital ads to attract supporters to your campaign. If they were just hiring people to pretend to be supporters, they wouldn't need to place ads searching for them.

eqdw 7y ago

Now do all the protests from 3 years ago