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Then companies would just contract out the lowest jobs, and only pay the higher ones.

charlesu 6y ago
Make a law that all contract work must be above $X amount and put some process around it. Hiring individual contractors for low skilled work should be onerous, expensive or both. Do something. We shouldn't simply accept that anything we do will be circumvented and not try at all.
- seanmcdirmid 6y ago
  That is definitely a great way to kick start automation initiatives. Making janitors really expensive to hire means that you either have highly paid (less likely) or janitor robots (more likely). There are lots of opportunities for this in food service as well. This would have a huge side effect of accelerating the robotics industry.
  - charlesu 6y ago
    That's a great point. Many people will find that the market doesn't value their labor much at all, so we should tax automation as well. We can use the funds to provide income to displaced workers.
    - seanmcdirmid 6y ago
      We will get there eventually, it is unavoidable...labor is rapidly losing in its value proposition vs. capital. The minimum wage puts a bottom on the level of human labor the economy can support. This isn't a bad thing, it pressures people up the labor value chain ($5/hour jobs don't exist, you better be able to do a $10/hour one), and it forces companies to constantly improve productivity to match (e.g. through automation). However, if you move the line too fast, productivity improvements will eliminate lower level labor too quickly, causing problems for society. Artificial restrictions on labor will only cause those things to accelerate unless we tax robots as people (as you propose).
- LyndsySimon 6y ago
  One of my possible choices for a future career path is to go into consulting full time. I'm sure this is a common thought here on HN. Prohibiting small contract work sounds like an excellent way to prevent that sort of thing from ever happening. It would severely stunt the ability for tech workers to leave traditional employment to found a small consulting firm (usually composed of "just them", or perhaps a them and a couple of former colleagues) while simultaneously entrenching the concept of a large, established firm. In short, it would make it much more difficult to transition from "employee" to "business owner" in our industry. That strikes me as a terrible idea.
  - charlesu 6y ago
    It would be difficult to do if you intend to build your business around low-skilled work. As an aside, every mentor I've ever had that has started a tech consulting firm has advised me against starting one.

Make a law that all contract work must be above $X amount and put some process around it. Hiring individual contractors for low skilled work should be onerous, expensive or both. Do something. We shouldn't simply accept that anything we do will be circumvented and not try at all.

seanmcdirmid 6y ago
That is definitely a great way to kick start automation initiatives. Making janitors really expensive to hire means that you either have highly paid (less likely) or janitor robots (more likely). There are lots of opportunities for this in food service as well. This would have a huge side effect of accelerating the robotics industry.
- charlesu 6y ago
  That's a great point. Many people will find that the market doesn't value their labor much at all, so we should tax automation as well. We can use the funds to provide income to displaced workers.
  - seanmcdirmid 6y ago
    We will get there eventually, it is unavoidable...labor is rapidly losing in its value proposition vs. capital. The minimum wage puts a bottom on the level of human labor the economy can support. This isn't a bad thing, it pressures people up the labor value chain ($5/hour jobs don't exist, you better be able to do a $10/hour one), and it forces companies to constantly improve productivity to match (e.g. through automation). However, if you move the line too fast, productivity improvements will eliminate lower level labor too quickly, causing problems for society. Artificial restrictions on labor will only cause those things to accelerate unless we tax robots as people (as you propose).
LyndsySimon 6y ago
One of my possible choices for a future career path is to go into consulting full time. I'm sure this is a common thought here on HN. Prohibiting small contract work sounds like an excellent way to prevent that sort of thing from ever happening. It would severely stunt the ability for tech workers to leave traditional employment to found a small consulting firm (usually composed of "just them", or perhaps a them and a couple of former colleagues) while simultaneously entrenching the concept of a large, established firm. In short, it would make it much more difficult to transition from "employee" to "business owner" in our industry. That strikes me as a terrible idea.
- charlesu 6y ago
  It would be difficult to do if you intend to build your business around low-skilled work. As an aside, every mentor I've ever had that has started a tech consulting firm has advised me against starting one.