4 ms·

What's unintuitive is that it doesn't follow other conventions that could reasonably be applied.

by aendruk 7y ago

eqvinox 7y ago
Which conventions would that be?
- aendruk 7y ago
  Reasonable candidates, per the article: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left_to_right https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left_to_right - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clockwise https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clockwise
  - eqvinox 7y ago
    By that logic: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterclockwise https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterclockwise Also, it's clockwise when viewed from what used to be the wiring side, i.e. bottom. Also-also, mathematical/engineering sense of rotation for positive angles is counterclockwise. ("The mathematician works against the clock.") Also-also-also, you've listed 2 conventions with no preference between them. If either would have been picked, we would be having the same discussion right now on why it wasn't the other one. The only thing that would give any advantage here is if there were established context or logic giving significant preference to any of them.
    - aendruk 7y ago
      Yes, you understand correctly. In this case, assume the life and cultural context of the author.
  - Dylan16807 7y ago
    If you consider those reasonable, then it's pretty hard to argue that the one they picked isn't reasonable. But "unintuitive" isn't the right word for picking one out of three reasonable options. It's not like you can avoid picking one.
    - aendruk 7y ago
      The argument comes as a thought experiment: If you handed me an arbitrary object and asked me to number its parts, I'd probably default to one the above conventions. This outcome is incidental, but a predictable consequence of my cultural background and individual experiences. It would be surprising for me to make up something different. The insight offered by the article is that they way we ended up with something different is that, amending the hypothetical, the object was actually introduced upside-down.
      - Dylan16807 7y ago
        So you're arguing that clockwise is intuitive but counterclockwise isn't? (In that case it's confusing that you said "other" conventions that could reasonably be applied. If you say "here's two other cats they could have picked", that makes it sound like what they picked was a cat.) I don't think I agree with that. Especially since if you hand me something and I start counting left to right, oops I probably went counterclockwise.

What's unintuitive is that it doesn't follow other conventions that could reasonably be applied.

eqvinox 7y ago

Which conventions would that be?

aendruk 7y ago
Reasonable candidates, per the article: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left_to_right https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left_to_right - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clockwise https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clockwise
- eqvinox 7y ago
  By that logic: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterclockwise https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterclockwise Also, it's clockwise when viewed from what used to be the wiring side, i.e. bottom. Also-also, mathematical/engineering sense of rotation for positive angles is counterclockwise. ("The mathematician works against the clock.") Also-also-also, you've listed 2 conventions with no preference between them. If either would have been picked, we would be having the same discussion right now on why it wasn't the other one. The only thing that would give any advantage here is if there were established context or logic giving significant preference to any of them.
  - aendruk 7y ago
    Yes, you understand correctly. In this case, assume the life and cultural context of the author.
- Dylan16807 7y ago
  If you consider those reasonable, then it's pretty hard to argue that the one they picked isn't reasonable. But "unintuitive" isn't the right word for picking one out of three reasonable options. It's not like you can avoid picking one.
  - aendruk 7y ago
    The argument comes as a thought experiment: If you handed me an arbitrary object and asked me to number its parts, I'd probably default to one the above conventions. This outcome is incidental, but a predictable consequence of my cultural background and individual experiences. It would be surprising for me to make up something different. The insight offered by the article is that they way we ended up with something different is that, amending the hypothetical, the object was actually introduced upside-down.
    - Dylan16807 7y ago
      So you're arguing that clockwise is intuitive but counterclockwise isn't? (In that case it's confusing that you said "other" conventions that could reasonably be applied. If you say "here's two other cats they could have picked", that makes it sound like what they picked was a cat.) I don't think I agree with that. Especially since if you hand me something and I start counting left to right, oops I probably went counterclockwise.