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I'm personally a fan of the conspiracy theory that because multiple ANC products have had their abilities reduced in firmware updates over the past couple years

I'm personally a fan of the conspiracy theory that because multiple ANC products have had their abilities reduced in firmware updates over the past couple years, research teams have been independently finding out that user's hearing are being damaged by highly effective ANC and have had to turn them down without admitting fault. Although I'm not even sure if that's how sound waves work, and recently there was Bose's investigation into their firmware update that didn't actually reduce their ANC despite user perspective. It's a fun theory up there with the fake existence of Finland.

jdashg 7y ago
This feels super-plausible to me, and it's something they would never, ever admit.
- valuearb 7y ago
  Lol, it’s the worst conspiracy theory ever, that a lack of noise damages eardrums.
skrebbel 7y ago
Googled it so you don't have to: ANC in this case appears to stand for Active Noise Control, i.e. noise-cancelling headphones https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_noise_control https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_noise_control
russellbeattie 7y ago
The other option is that Bose, Sony or some other high-end audio company has a patent on whatever noise cancellation system was in place originally. A decision was made to avoid a legal battle (or a deal fell through at the last minute) and the feature was nerfed until Apple can strong arm the patent holder into a better deal.
- jmole 7y ago
  this is exactly what happened.
  - jiofih 7y ago
    source?
    - ngngngng 7y ago
      Finland
- sanguy 7y ago
  Without disclosing more this is the situation. The patents violated expire in 2021 so it is likely they are holding out.
- asfarley 7y ago
  I was under the impression that the core principles of noise cancellation were well-understood and in the public domain as part of signal processing. Basically you reverse the predictable component of the signal and add it to the incoming, so only the innovation (unpredictable) signal remains. Couldn’t Apple or Bose just fall back on these methods which should work closely enough to whatever fancy method is patented? Or is the method I’m describing patented?
leetcrew 7y ago
why would people's hearing be damaged by highly effective ANC? it's more plausible that they would be harmed by a bad implementation where the second signal isn't perfectly out of phase.
- Lammy 7y ago
  Isn’t ANC effectively twice the sound waves? People treat ANC like hearing protection in office situations and often turn up the volume to drown out nearby conversations. I don’t think it’s “ANC damages hearing” as much as “ANC encourages people to damage their hearing”.
  - leetcrew 7y ago
    > Isn’t ANC effectively twice the sound waves? ideally no, just the opposite. the idea of ANC is that you detect the frequency and amplitude of incoming waves, then generate a second wave with the same amplitude, but 180 degrees out of phase (so that the trough of the second wave aligns with the peak of the first). a perfect implementation would totally "cancel" the original sound with destructive interference. I'm not very familiar with consumer ANC headphones (I prefer passive attenuation), but I would expect the cancellation effect does not increase when you turn up the volume, as this would just be perceived as noise if it exceeds the amplitude of the ambient sounds. I guess ANC might encourage people to expose themselves to very loud noises that the device can't compensate for, but that's more user error than an inherent flaw in the technology. people routinely listen to music way too loud in quiet settings anyway.
    - jdsully 7y ago
      Yes but perfect destructive interference isn’t possible unless everything remains fixed in place which is difficult on a living human head. Its quite possible to get temporary constructive interference for short periods, and also plausible the brain would filter the spurious noise out.
      - davidgould 7y ago
novok 7y ago
That's my theory! I bought the airpods pro before nov, and around nov 2019 I developed tinnitus that I couldn't pinpoint the cause of, even after going to an ENT & Audiologists. After going to the Audiologist. I also found out tinitus is a big mystery in the medical field outside of a small band of causes that I didn't have. The only difference in my day to day was the Airpods Pro and biking to work with them.
- JustResign 7y ago
  Why would you bike wearing noise-cancelling headphones? It seems odd if one values one's life.
  - novok 7y ago
    They have a hear through option that works with wind noise, unlike a lot of other ones?
    - JustResign 7y ago
      Ah, I did not know that! I assume, though, that that mode doesn't implement ANC. Given that, I'm not sure it explains your symptoms.
      - novok 7y ago
        No it still uses ANC, it uses the microphones to pipe in the audio from outside.
  - matt-attack 7y ago
    Not all commutes are in Urban environments.
- berberous 7y ago
  how old are you?
  - 7y ago

jdashg 7y ago

This feels super-plausible to me, and it's something they would never, ever admit.

valuearb 7y ago
Lol, it’s the worst conspiracy theory ever, that a lack of noise damages eardrums.

skrebbel 7y ago

Googled it so you don't have to: ANC in this case appears to stand for Active Noise Control, i.e. noise-cancelling headphones https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_noise_control https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_noise_control

russellbeattie 7y ago

The other option is that Bose, Sony or some other high-end audio company has a patent on whatever noise cancellation system was in place originally. A decision was made to avoid a legal battle (or a deal fell through at the last minute) and the feature was nerfed until Apple can strong arm the patent holder into a better deal.

jmole 7y ago
this is exactly what happened.
- jiofih 7y ago
  source?
  - ngngngng 7y ago
    Finland
sanguy 7y ago
Without disclosing more this is the situation. The patents violated expire in 2021 so it is likely they are holding out.
asfarley 7y ago
I was under the impression that the core principles of noise cancellation were well-understood and in the public domain as part of signal processing. Basically you reverse the predictable component of the signal and add it to the incoming, so only the innovation (unpredictable) signal remains. Couldn’t Apple or Bose just fall back on these methods which should work closely enough to whatever fancy method is patented? Or is the method I’m describing patented?

leetcrew 7y ago

why would people's hearing be damaged by highly effective ANC? it's more plausible that they would be harmed by a bad implementation where the second signal isn't perfectly out of phase.

Lammy 7y ago
Isn’t ANC effectively twice the sound waves? People treat ANC like hearing protection in office situations and often turn up the volume to drown out nearby conversations. I don’t think it’s “ANC damages hearing” as much as “ANC encourages people to damage their hearing”.
- leetcrew 7y ago
  > Isn’t ANC effectively twice the sound waves? ideally no, just the opposite. the idea of ANC is that you detect the frequency and amplitude of incoming waves, then generate a second wave with the same amplitude, but 180 degrees out of phase (so that the trough of the second wave aligns with the peak of the first). a perfect implementation would totally "cancel" the original sound with destructive interference. I'm not very familiar with consumer ANC headphones (I prefer passive attenuation), but I would expect the cancellation effect does not increase when you turn up the volume, as this would just be perceived as noise if it exceeds the amplitude of the ambient sounds. I guess ANC might encourage people to expose themselves to very loud noises that the device can't compensate for, but that's more user error than an inherent flaw in the technology. people routinely listen to music way too loud in quiet settings anyway.
  - jdsully 7y ago
    Yes but perfect destructive interference isn’t possible unless everything remains fixed in place which is difficult on a living human head. Its quite possible to get temporary constructive interference for short periods, and also plausible the brain would filter the spurious noise out.
    - davidgould 7y ago

novok 7y ago

That's my theory! I bought the airpods pro before nov, and around nov 2019 I developed tinnitus that I couldn't pinpoint the cause of, even after going to an ENT & Audiologists. After going to the Audiologist. I also found out tinitus is a big mystery in the medical field outside of a small band of causes that I didn't have. The only difference in my day to day was the Airpods Pro and biking to work with them.

JustResign 7y ago
Why would you bike wearing noise-cancelling headphones? It seems odd if one values one's life.
- novok 7y ago
  They have a hear through option that works with wind noise, unlike a lot of other ones?
  - JustResign 7y ago
    Ah, I did not know that! I assume, though, that that mode doesn't implement ANC. Given that, I'm not sure it explains your symptoms.
    - novok 7y ago
      No it still uses ANC, it uses the microphones to pipe in the audio from outside.
- matt-attack 7y ago
  Not all commutes are in Urban environments.
berberous 7y ago
how old are you?
- 7y ago